Handpainted Tiki Mug auction: monkey and bear

I could be wrong in saying this and I might get blasted for saying this.But you took a fine piece of art (Munktiki Mug)and painted it for the purposes of selling it to make a profit. The money should go to munktiki. This might not be the right place to promote your artistic abilities. Artists don't like people stealing their work.

Munktiki got their money for the mug when Yoryuk (or whoever the original purchaser was) initially bought the mug. Once he(?) buys it, it's his to do with as he will. He didn't copy the design, he simply added his own art to it, much like several artists here have done with the mugs Tiki Farm provides for DVA Gallery's annual tiki party. Or like the pinstriped mugs one of the vendors at Oasis was selling. I had Little Lost Tiki handpaint one of his amazing original designs on an OMC Moai Mug for me and paid him for his work, and I'm sure OMC got paid for that mug decades ago, so I don't expect that their representative will show up at LLT's studio expecting royalties!

I saw the listing for the skull monkey on eBay a few days ago, and I liked it before it was even posted here. I actually assumed the buyer had bought it from one of the well-known artists we see here from time to time. It's fine work, and I would really like to see the others Yoryuk has done!

I've always wondered what the artists who design mugs think about this.

It's one thing for Tiki Farm to provide a gallery with bisques intended to be used in an art show, but I think it's entirely different to take one of Doug Horne's Tiki Farm mugs and paint it up in some atrociously garish fashion. That was one of the things I saw at Oasis that made me cringe, especially after Holden and/or the artist went through all the trouble of trying to select just the right glaze to accent each particular mug.

On 2008-08-24 12:54, Tiki-Kate wrote:
Holden and/or the artist went through all the trouble of trying to select just the right glaze to accent each particular mug.

But with a company like Tiki Farm, Its One Million tiki mugs glazed like the group of artists intended, to ten painted Tiki Farm mug out there (not counting DvA).

I like seeing painted mugs. Extra creativity. I like the tile work done with a Tiki Farm mug too.

so I am to understand that it is ok to buy a mug with the intention of painting it to resell it for profit? It's one thing to buy a mug and ask someone to paint it for your personal use but then to turn around and sell it for personal gain is totally different. Isn't that like rubbing it in the artists face???

On 2008-08-24 13:39, mymotiki wrote:
so I am to understand that it is ok to buy a mug with the intention of painting it to resell it for profit?

Isn't that like rubbing it in the artists face???

Yes

No

And if someone was to take the time to paint a mug, I would hope it would be for porfit. The mug companies hope for profit too.

ok teakey I agree to disagree with you. Long live original art! Not some fake rip off

[ Edited by: Yoryuk 2008-09-08 11:15 ]

Yoryuk, you need to realize that sometimes people on this site get way too emotional when it doesn't even concern them, so just take it with a grain of salt.

Bottom line is your work is bad ass, no one can dispute that! I hope to see more of your work. Me personally, I dig it! I love Munktiki and you just made a great mug even better! Kudos to you, you have crazy skills!

Going to buy a car and repaint it and then sell it at a profit ... Going to send half my profits to GM!

I am sticking up for the artists in here that is all. People bitch in here all the time about their artwork being stollen or copied. No I am not an artist nor do I sell things on here. Everybody loves money, including me I was only trying to make the point that maybe he should ask the artist first. I did not say anything about his talent. He paints just fine. Especially because the artist sells here on TC.

[ Edited by: tiki trav 2008-08-25 17:31 ]

On 2008-08-25 16:15, mymotiki wrote:
I am sticking up for the artists in here that is all. People bitch in here all the time about their artwork being stollen or copied. No I am not an artist nor do I sell things on here. Everybody loves money, including me I was only trying to make the point that maybe he should ask the artist first. I did not say anything about his talent. He paints just fine. Especially because the artist sells here on TC.

Okay, so you are chastising this person because they repainted a mug and are reselling it, despite mentioning in their ebay description "Custom painted"
Why don't you attack another ebay user for selling their ipod? OH NO!

Seriously, you really need chill out and stop harassing people. it was bad enough with the racial comments made towards another TCer, but now you have to go and attack someone who PLAINLY stated in their description "CUSTOM PAINTED".

And as for the artists who get ripped off, when their designs are being mass produced by a company and not getting royalties, that is an entirely different story. That is plain theft. But this ONE PERSON......buys a mug.....and CUSTOM PAINTS IT....sells it on ebay, and suddenly he's a thief?

Sheesh. You need to understand the difference here before making crazy accusations. :/

I think the monkey mug looks great. I totally agree with TeaKey and Atomic on this issue. I do not care if someone paints over a mug. Its theirs and if it thats what they want to do with it fine. I just want to drink out of mine. Nowadays the mugs are becoming more like art work and are very hard to drink out of. I think that the original artists might get a little upset sometimes because they do not have the time to handpaint all of their mugs.
I know some artists are now charging a ton of money to do 1 of 1 mugs which most of these are hand painted over top of the original glaze. I think the artists that are doing this are making the industry better. Thus a lot more thinking and detailing is going into each mug. I know I have paid dearly to have some of these done.

At Oasis I bought a Tiki Farm mug that Doug Dorr pinstriped...it was Sam's Shrunken Head by Sam Gambino. Sam designs Tiki mugs but doesn't make them. Tiki Farm makes mugs but doesn't pinstripe them. Doug Dorr doesn't design or make mugs, but he can pinstripe the hell out of them (or anything else for that matter.) The way I look at it - win/win/win for me, I got a cool mug made by a cool company striped by a way underrated artist.

why don't you all ask the artists how they feel about it? Forget what I say, its what the artists think that matters.

On 2008-08-25 17:02, mymotiki wrote:
Forget what I say.

Guys if you're posting to change mymotiki's mind, forget it.

[ Edited by: teaKEY 2008-08-25 18:18 ]

Yes artwork being stolen/copied bites HARD, however I feel that if someone buys an object at retail they should be able to modify/enhance/destroy the object as they wish, if they modify it in such a fashion that the value is increased that's great.

There were people selling artworks at Oasis that consisted of modified tiki mugs used in a mosaic, They looked fantastic though they had chopped and smashed up lots of mugs to achieve this. Holden was impressed with how they used Tiki Farm mugs and I'm sure Squid was fine with it although they used his art in a sense. Difference is they were from the original source. Not knock offs made to resemble known artworks.

If I bought a Bamboo Ben mug and dipped it in 24c gold I would imagine i could market it for the price of the mug plus the gold plus the time and ingenuity required and not feel guitly towards Bamboo Ben, Ernie, or Tiki Farm. Of course I would be incredibly stupid too.

Mymotiki it is my opinion that you are WRONG.

...okay, as an artist i'll chime in......as long as the items in question were bought from whatever source (retailer, manufacturer, artist) the person is free to modify them and either keep them to decorate their home, give them away to friends or turn around an resell them.....it's totally legit and no infringement lines are being crossed....now let it go....

On 2008-08-25 17:02, mymotiki wrote:
why don't you all ask the artists how they feel about it? Forget what I say, its what the artists think that matters.

I LOVE to see my mugs painted on or even practiced on. I LOVE IT MOSTLY when an artist benefits or profits from his/her HONEST efforts. I invite any artist, anywhere to paint on any mug that I designed and to sell it for even a HUGE, ridiculous profit - just do it honestly. It would do me well to know that another artist would put that kind of time into a Sam's Shrunken Head or a Merv or Mort or whatever, and profit from it. Why not? CAPITALISM is BEAUTIFUL. After all, nothing's being stolen by painting on a mug. If you started manufacturing my designs without asking my permission and giving me a cut, then that's stealing.

Oh yeah, send me your Sam's Shrunken Heads, and I'll stripe them up too! :)

By the way, beautiful work on those 2 mugs at the beginning of this thread.

http://www.samgambino.com

[ Edited by: sam gambino 2008-08-25 18:24 ]

Well said Sam! Your input to this thread is appreciated, important and respected!

On 2008-08-25 19:23, jpmartdog wrote:
Well said Sam! Your input to this thread is appreciated, important and respected!

..unlike that rotten, no good, tipsy mcstagger character!! ..... when is that prick ever gonna leave tiki central???

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-25 19:37 ]

On 2008-08-25 19:35, Tipsy McStagger wrote:

On 2008-08-25 19:23, jpmartdog wrote:
Well said Sam! Your input to this thread is appreciated, important and respected!

..unlike that rotten, no good, tipsy mcstagger character!! ..... when is that prick ever gonna leave tiki central???

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-25 19:37 ]

..unlike that rotten, no good, Tiki Trav character!! ..... when is that prick ever gonna leave tiki central???

Dear Tipsy mcstagger and Tiki Trav,
I thought you knew how appreciated and respected your feedback is on any thread, I offer my unabashed appreciation for your important feedback on this thread also! Well said both of you, this thread is only a success because of you and all TC members, afficionados, artists and otherwise that contribute heartfelt sentiment. Now mix yourself a Mai Tai and relax.

..unlike that rotten, no good, jpmartdog character!! ..... when is that prick ever gonna leave tiki central???

Just kidding...

..me too!!!

....sorry.......couldn't resist taking a shot at myself in my last post......

On 2008-08-25 17:33, Tiki Trav wrote:

If I bought a Bamboo Ben mug and dipped it in 24c gold I would imagine i could market it for the price of the mug plus the gold plus the time and ingenuity required and not feel guitly towards Bamboo Ben, Ernie, or Tiki Farm. Of course I would be incredibly stupid too.

Trav,

Save your money on the 14k gold.

Instead, tar and feather it!

The tar and feather edition out now. Look for it at an Ebay near you.

First, my nice thoughts: I've always found it odd when people on TC feel they must step up for an artist and defend him/her. But I also thinks it's a nice gesture, it clearly shows that people are passionate about the work of the artists they like.

Now for my finger wagging:

Threads in Tiki Marketplace are best left as threads for selling/announcing a product/locating things for sale. With the exception of blatant acts of intellectual theft (products being passed off as what they're not) discussions about artistic merit/history/supporting independent sock knitters over mass producing sock mills overseas/et cetera would be ideally brought up in separate threads. It's fair to those trying to sell their mass produced socks from overseas and if the argument against the design/idea behind the product is strong enough it'll make an interesting thread on its own.

Of course everyone will continue hijacking others threads, it's just easier. But in your accusations and eventual flame throwing it's best to focus on the argument and issue at hand. Bringing up past issues/slights/wrongs/et cetera is the kind of argument that only works in a marriage/significant other situation where mentioning a forgotten birthday or phone call not made usually always quiets things down quickly.

So ignoring all that make sense I'll climb aboard:

"I could be wrong in saying this and I might get blasted for saying this.But you took a fine piece of art (Munktiki Mug)and painted it for the purposes of selling it to make a profit. The money should go to munktiki. This might not be the right place to promote your artistic abilities. Artists don't like people stealing their work." -mymotiki-

The reinterpretation of others works is as old as art itself. It's been extremely common in modern art. In contemporary art one can find many examples of actual reworking of mass produced pieces. These new works are considered legitimate art and I've never heard a serious argument that the original maker of the soup can, inflatable bunny, basket balls, or mouse traps is owed payment for the new work.

"Artists don't like people stealing their work." That's true, but once a piece has been bought I don't care what happens to it. In fact I'd highly encourage anyone who dislikes my work to buy all the available pieces from me and then toss them in Puget Sound. Pm me. I'll make yuh a bulk offer.

If there's a piece I care about so much that what happens to it in the future matters to me, I keep it. Or give it away to an adoring fan. Or sell it for enough money that I stop caring.

On 2008-08-24 10:38, Yoryuk wrote:

I don't think I could sleep with that in the house. MAN is that thing creepy-looking! :)

I was going to reply by offering a totem pole made out of limited, rare, and one of kind mugs glued together, with African tribal masks glued on. It would be an -original- artwork because it would have in big red letters painted all over the mugs 'f*** off wankers', but I wasn't sure if that would go over so well.

Not to be a spoiled sport but I'm editing out my posts for reasons given in the original post. Plus, it's an interesting subject but this thread has little to do with my auction anymore, I had intended to post more auctions in the thread but I don't think I'll do that, start a new one if I post again sometime. Thanks for the replies though, I do appreciate the responses received both in and out of the forum.

Sorry for the childish reply motiki, but I thought that was a pretty heavy accusation for my first post. I have been ripped off before and I don't take being called a thief lightly. I love the design of their mug and it wasn't my intent to dishonor it or cause any controversy. I don't have much online but I do have an original work some might have seen available in the past that might explain my interest in the modification, if anyone has an interest in seeing it they can pm me for a link.

I've been tuning in to the forum for years, the moldmaking really interests me. I finally signed up to buy one of squids mugs a while back, (for the record, it was a limited event mug and I wouldn't modify something like that.) I think everybody is inspired a little by everybody else's work and I like that. That's why there are art movements, why Polynesian art is still inspiring people and why so many retro styles have become popular again.

I like the tarred ben mug but it needs some bulging eyeballs if you are going to ask several hundred dollars for it.