The "Just Because It's From Hawaii, Doesn't Mean It's Tiki" Thread

Grog does good stuff, that be sure,don't know if he was just playing along with the goofing around
or something set him off, we are all just having fun here, after all its Bilge, that's what we do in the
TC basement,no good for sure.

Grog gonna come to this part of town, he might get dirty, its full of questionable Women, fighting drunks
and brightly colored Tikis. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I like the Part where Grog can make fun of other people,
but because he is "funny" its ok.

But when I do it to him, he gets all bent, and threatens to tell the moderators.

Jeff(btd)

On 2011-09-21 12:35, Chuck Tatum is Tiki wrote:
Is Hawaiian Pudding Tiki?

Bear, We only got the homemade kind around here.

No One? it's Poi, It was served at many Mid Century Tiki Supper clubs....so is it? John-0

No I don't believe poi can be considered Tiki, it's way too authentically Hawaiian. It's an acquired taste, I doubt very much that it was served at Hawaiian tourist luaus, let alone mainland Tiki restaurants back in the day. If someone can identify poi on a vintage menu then I will stand corrected.

It would be good Tiki Revival food however, it's a much healthier starch than steamed rice to eat with that greasy pork.

Poi... NOT TIKI !! (But maybe it should be.)

And GROG raised the compelling question "Is JOHN-O Tiki ??". Actually I'll save people the effort in that argument. Admittedly, I am NOT Tiki. How much Tiki swag you own appears to be the qualifying criteria, and I only own 3 Tiki mugs (one BTW is a commissioned GROG piece). I do drink my share of Tropical cocktails but I must confess I prefer bourbon, gin, and tequila over rum.

But as King Bushwich the 33rd pointed out earlier in this thread...

"...just because something is not tiki does not make it bad"

:)

Also I see a Tiki double standard here. If one points out that things like Carribean bars, or Tiki Joe (not the Ocean one, the other one), or Burning Man are NOT Tiki then that's a valid TC argument. If one however suggests that Tiki "grey area" items are not Tiki (in Bilge of all places), then that's considered pot stirring.

"Trouble making" is all a matter of your perspective.

Agree that poi is not tiki, since it didn't appear on the menus at Poly-pop restaurants and bars. I believe it did appear at Hawaiian tourist luaus, but only in a small, token amount, so that the tourists could dip in with their fingers, grimace at the taste, pass the bowl to the person sitting next to them, and tell the neighbors back home that they had tried "authentic Hawaiian poi". This theory is based my extensive knowledge of vintage sitcoms (and Flintstones cartoons).

On 2011-09-20 19:24, Chuck Tatum is Tiki wrote:
You are kidding Ernie, Right? :P
just having a laugh? don't make me put you in the corner :P

Nobody puts Grog in a corner! He's not only a terrific dancer, but somebody... who's taught me... that there are people willing to stand up for other people no matter what it costs them. Somebody who's taught me about the kind of person I wanna be.

Also, the Pachanga is not tiki!

[ Edited by: Sabu The Coconut Boy 2011-09-22 12:54 ]

On 2011-09-22 12:15, JOHN-O wrote:
No I don't believe poi can be considered Tiki, it's way too authentically Hawaiian. It's an acquired taste, I doubt very much that it was served at Hawaiian tourist luaus, let alone mainland Tiki restaurants back in the day. If someone can identify poi on a vintage menu then I will stand corrected.

A quick search on TC for "serving poi" turned up that poi was available at at least two different Trader Vic's locations back in the day (San Francisco and St Petersburg):

http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=12689&forum=2&vpost=453035&hilite=serve%20poi

"If someone wants poi, we'll have that, too," says Wong. "In fact, we'll even have the true taro root from which poi is made - after it is shipped from the San Francisco Trader Vic's."

Just because something was traditionally associated with tiki does not mean we need to continue that tradition. Eating poi is one of those things. Sacrificing virgins is probably another :D

But was that just marketing rhetoric or was poi ACTUALLY on the menu ??

Inquiring Tiki minds want to know !! (And in my case a Non-Tiki mind :D)

On 2011-09-22 14:53, JOHN-O wrote:
But was that just marketing rhetoric or was poi ACTUALLY on the menu ??

I checked Arkiva Tropika and it looks like they mostly just have scans of the cover art and interiors of drink menus, so I wasn't able to dig up the dirt on those two locations. We need a menu collector to clarify this for us. I suspect they did actually serve it, but that it quickly disappeared because nobody really wanted it.

On 2011-09-22 14:51, MadDogMike wrote:
Just because something was traditionally associated with tiki does not mean we need to continue that tradition. Eating poi is one of those things. Sacrificing virgins is probably another :D

Finally, something controversial on this thread!

I don't think you're going to convince tikiphiles to give up their virgin sacrifices, however...

On 2011-09-22 14:51, MadDogMike wrote:
Just because something was traditionally associated with tiki does not mean we need to continue that tradition. Eating poi is one of those things. Sacrificing virgins is probably another :D

the 'sacrificing virgins' part was probably due to the lack of supply.

OK I am checking some of my menus, but I gotta take em off the wall & open the frames,dust them off
have a drink.......yadda yadda yadda....

But the Poi issue is interesting yet does taste God Awful.
MadDogMike making some opinions known, I like it!

[ Edited by: Chuck Tatum is Tiki 2011-09-22 23:07 ]

Poi definitely falls under the Hawaiiana category, which falls, at least partly, under the umbrella of Poly-Pop. But does that in and of itself make it Tiki? I'd say no. If a restaurant had it on a menu, would THAT make it Tiki? That depends on WHEN the restaurant had it on the menu. If it was before 1955, then no, that makes it Hawwaiiana/Poly-pop in the Pre-Tiki period. Post '55, then we're talking Tiki possibility.

And Mike! Mike, Mike, Mike... They never REALLY sacrificed any virgins, it was all for show. All just part of that amalgam of Oceanic culture that was the Polynesian Floor Show, a little titillation for the paying customers. Ain't no big thing, Brada. Just think of it as a burlesque act.

Bear

Would sweet potato ''mock poi'' be tiki? It is in my hawaii kai cookbook and seems follow the tiki method of taking an authentic native practice and altering it to fit into mid-century American culture.

gabbahey

Now that sounds like it fits in well with the concept of Tiki, taking inspiration from Oceanic cultures and making something that was palatable to Haole sensibilities and tastes, as John-O has pointed out before, the food in these Tiki establishments wasn't really Polynesian, just reworked (not even that at times) Chinese restaurant fare. So to me, that mock-poi sounds very Tiki to me.

Bear

Mock Poi is definitely Tiki in spirit. I would hesitate in considering it official Tiki food unless we can confirm it was listed on a vintage menu.

Gabbahey, when was that cookbook published ? We're talking about that long-gone place in New York's Time Square, right?

You remember what happened to another "somebody" who defined "Tiki Food" on TC.......

:o

On 2011-09-22 19:46, JOHN-O wrote:
Mock Poi is definitely Tiki in spirit. I would hesitate in considering it official Tiki food unless we can confirm it was listed on a vintage menu.

I concur.

Bear

The Hawaii Kai Cookbook (1970) lists recipes for Poi, , Poi Malihini, and Sweet Potato Mock Poi (pages 191-192).

Has your poi "winked" at you? If not, you haven't had the good stuff...

New York Times October 31, 1982

-Tom

Yeah, Trader Tom listed the book I found it in. The book seems to have a lot of things that were not offered at the Hawaii Kai restaurant so that may not help give mock poi street cred. And it was written at the start of the dark ages by a couple that doesn't seem to have worked there. FYI the book is super cheap and easy to find.

gabbahey

Bump

And that excellent article about poi makes me want a taro boba drink. Not tiki even with a float of lemon hart

gabbahey

And oh yeah, I've decided that the Shaka sign is not really Tiki either...

Really only "Brahs" should be using it.

Yea that was more of a surfer thing that started in the 70s

So to late for the Tiki era

Not tiki perhaps but an interesting history

Shaka Sign

One theory according to the Honolulu Star-Bulletin, prevailing local lore credited the gesture to Hamana Kalili of Laie, who lost the three middle fingers of his right hand while working at the Kahuku Sugar Mill. Kalili was then shifted to guarding the sugar train, and his all-clear wave of thumb and pinkie is said to have evolved over the years into the shaka as children would imitate his unique hand "waaaave".