Mystery Photo 1959 Tiki Bar

Hmmm, I dunno - are we talking about the store with the 'Grand Opening..." banner @ #540? The side-door looks the same but...
Aw, damn - I'd elaborate, but once again TC has made me late for work!!!

from my mom: who's 80, from memory!!

Hi Elicia: Can't say that I know who that gentleman is. Only that the store front is located on 544 Grant Ave. My Father's store is Peking Bazaar on 486 Grant Ave (cross street is Pine street.) This store front is 544 Grant Ave on the middle of the block (cross street is California Street where St. Mary's Church sits.)

i'll get pix next week, i'll be there for a memorial for my cousin-in-law

Pix would be cool, but the Google Street View shows its the same place.

..even though this may be the famed beatnik hangout, i wouldn't put too much stock in what the sign above the door says...beatniks weren't real hip on advertising their hangout to possible squares that might wander in off the street...hence the "underground" aspect .....so i doubt the sign said "the place" on it....the sign was probably for whatever business it was before (or after) the beatniks left.....none the less, it's all the same building...

the part of the sign that refered to "room" probably had more to do with rooms for rent than a bamboo room.....a beatnik flop house indeed!!

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-16 08:28 ]

Regardless of whatever the sign above says, the mystery photo IS of 'The Place', legendary beatnik bar and hangout of the 1950s, located at 546 Grant Avenue in San Francisco. (542 would be to the left of 544, as one looks at the photo.)

http://www.hotelboheme.com/sanfran/tour.html

http://www.emptymirrorbooks.com/books/blabbermouth1957.html

Mystery solved.

The bar opened in 1953. The building the tiny bar was located in was sold by the landlord -- an Italian ex-Mafia from Chicago -- in 1960; and as the owners, Knute Stiles and Leo Krikorian, didn't have a lease, the bar closed.

It could be possible that the man/men in the photos may have been connected in some way, or knew some, or even were some, of the famous Beat poets of the 1950s. Then again, maybe not.

In any case, that photo is really something else! That was THE PLACE, literally, for the Beats of San Francisco to meet. (The other was Vesuvios.) I bet one would be hard-pressed to find many photos of 'The Place' now-a-days, without going through some kind of photo compendium or film footage of the Beat life in San Francisco. And it is far more interesting than some little rinky-dink Tiki bar! Wow!

Perhaps now we should do some sleuthing to find out who the man and men are in the photos? 'Course, that really could be a waste of time. Comparing photos of some of the more popular Beat poets of the 1950s with these chaps may be a quick way to at least realise or eliminate the possibility.

Anybody close to Berkeley? I found this

"The Beach
This exceptional documentary portrays the history of San Francisco's North Beach in the 1950s, focusing on the artists, writers, and "Beat" hipsters who made "The Beach" legendary. The artists who came to The Beach rejected conformity, complacency, and mainstream morality. "The Place", Vesuvio's, and a galaxy of bars, coffee houses, and studios were their hangouts. They loved poetry, jazz, and jug wine, and they presaged a profound change in American cultural attitudes. 57 min. Video/C 4665"

At this site.

http://www.lib.berkeley.edu/MRC/BeatGen.html

The movie might have photos of the outside of "The Place"

And check out the mention of it in this article.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,868906,00.html

[ Edited by: Tiki Shaker 2008-08-16 10:48 ]

Perhaps foremost L.A. Beatnik archeologist BC-Dada can identify the guy...but he doesn't look that "beatnik" to me, more like a beatnik tourist, or maybe the photo was taken before this joint became a beatnik hang out. Then again, some of the most hardcore beats didn't look the part.
Great to have the locale mystery solved, Yay Elicia! :)

On 2008-08-16 11:08, bigbrotiki wrote:

Great to have the locale mystery solved, Yay Elicia! :)

I posted the Grant ave address. mystery solved, Yay ME....:lol:

No need for accolades though. I saw this thread and everyone struggling with the mystery and it was my pleasure.:)

On 2008-08-16 09:13, DJ Terence Gunn wrote:
...located at 546 Grant Avenue in San Francisco. (542 would be to the left of 544, as one looks at the photo.)...

I almost hope I'm wrong, but I think you have that backwards.
The address numbers increase as you move to the left of 544 (or, north). At least that's how it works on the Google Maps view.
The address on the yellow sign of our target says "540" and "Lisa Jewelry Co." 544 would be the store immediately to the left of it.
I know it would be really cool if he was standing in front of The Place, and it had a Polynesian mural, and we had some sort of beat/tiki tie-in. But I don't think it's The Place. Address is wrong. It would be on the other side of 544. But I definitely think AlienTiki has the right place.
Tilt the Google picture down and look at the granite curb (perfect match) and the sidewalk. In 1959, that tilted over signpost sticks up from broken concrete in the sidewalk. The Google pic shows darker concrete where that same spot was later repaired.
I'd be delighted to find I'm wrong, if someone finds a picture of The Place in 1959.

So far I have only found a photo of the inside of "The Place"

It's titled [Crowd gathering around a man reading from a novel by D. H. Lawrence at The Place bar]
"SOAPBOX EXPOUNDING AT 'THE PLACE'--A necktie's hard to come by in Bohemia."
1957 Sept. 26.

No signs of polynesia in that pic.

Damn! And here I was all excited that I may have solved the mystery -- at least the place -- with help from previous info, but I sit corrected. Yes, the address is 442 Grant Avenue, which -- according to a San Francisco's Metrobot site -- is currently home to Forever Happhy Visa Service. This would mean that The Place would be on the other side of that boutique (544); and that really sucks. 'Course, the facade probably is very bland, considering it was a bohemian hangout.

Okay then. I'm going back to my initial proposal (before anyone else did, so I get credit remember:) that the mystery place was a jewelry store.

Boy! This is, indeed, fun though! I made a mistake but unearthed something that I never knew in the process.

maybe...but before we can say with any certainty, we must first find out if the city changed the addresses at all within the past 40 years..until we know this, we cannot rely on the address placement of the photo and it's relation to current day google pics ....

..and as for this......it's actor james brolin from one of his earlier movies.....

..okay..it's not.....but it sure looks like him!!

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-16 16:18 ]

I'm really enjoying following this thread, but this photo has broght up another mystery...

Could the man expounding from the soapbox in this picture...

Be this man?

There is a resemblance.

Back to the original subject:
I haven't been able to get a definite answer from anyone that might know if it's in San Diego. No-one I know remembers the facade anywhere around downtown. And if it was here, the part of downtown that has the slight hills has been "revitalized".
I'll keep trying though.

I was thinking about that, too, that we can't completely rely on the street address info of today in comparison to those of many years ago; too many things change, alter, and vanish altogether.

If the mystery photo isn't of The Place, and it is something else, the reason I don't think it is a bar (and I could be wrong, of course) is because:

#1. In 1959, Polynesian bars were usually attached to Polynesian restaurants or in hotels (some both), and this little store looks too small to be a restaurant.

#2. The alcoves displaying jewelry. Why would a bar display jewelry?

#3. There were loads of jewelry stores in this very area of 1959.

#4. If this mystery place was, in fact, a tiki bar of somekind, why does nobody know about it on this website? Why hasn't it been documented in Tiki News or some other publication? Wouldn't Otto have known of it? Sven? Etc.? After all, if it IS a tiki bar, it must've been privately owned, short-lived, and therefore somewhat special.

Anyway, a few things to think about. And yes, AlienTiki is the one who came up with the Grant Avenue proposal before anyone else did. The street number, however, was in the initial post by sputnik. I came up with The Place proposal (even if I was mistaken). This is collective sleuthing.

I would be surprised if the place in the photo was a jewelry store. Would they really only display their goods in two tiny windows? And have a door decorated with bamboo? As for that being a necklace in the window, I disagree. Take a look at the man's eyes. Now look at the size of his eyes compared to the size of the "necklace" in the window behind him. That would make the beads/shells or whatever that is used to make it about the size of marshmallows.... or, in my humble opinion - flowers. I do believe that is a Lei in the window.

Now for the 2 white things in front of the black square type thing below the Lei. I think the black square is a reflection. And the two white things? 2 asian statues or mugs similar to the Geisha mugs.

Damn Heath, I haven't laughed that hard in forever. I completely expect them to bring up the fact that he taught Kerouac how to write in the next commercial!

You can spend all day browsing the pictures on this site: http://sfpl.org/librarylocations/sfhistory/browse.htm

A lei IS a necklace. A string of flowers, sure, but still a necklace (or a wreath). But I understand your point, regarding the scale of the necklace/lei compared to the man, and I agree. They're probably white silk flower leis. However, the place may have sold Hawaiian curios, clothes, jewelry, etc. The bamboo door fits in with the aesthetics of the Polynesian mural. As far as what's below the leis, they could possibly be statues of somekind, as well. Two porcelain dolphins, perhaps? The place could've been a South Pacific art gallery of some kind, as well. The mid-20th Century Art Movement was popular in this particular area.

In any case, I think we all want this place to BE a Polynesian-themed bar/restaurant, but we really don't know at this point. I still think it's too small to have incorporated cooking facilities within.

Anyone know of any small, stand alone, foodless, tiki bars in late 1950s California? I'm not referring to this one, but any one. And if there is/was/were, would the establishment been legally permitted to sell hard alcohol without the sale of food back then?

[ Edited by: DJ Terence Gunn 2008-08-16 17:29 ]

..how about tiki ti??..no food, small bar, stand alone building, been there forever....

also, look closely at the close up of the leis in the window.....i agree there is a reflection.....but there is also something distinct and dark behind the leis....looks like a sea turtle shell with the leis draped over it.....or is that a small face in the center of the leis's??? a maori face with shell eyes?? a turtles head??

..this guy is linked to the travel industry.......that's my gut feeling..i'll bet this place is a travel agency of some sort that his company was associated with....this particular store or branch dealt with south seas travel which was becoming very popular about that time.....

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-16 18:24 ]

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-16 18:26 ]

On 2008-08-16 18:16, Tipsy McStagger wrote:
..how about tiki ti??..no food, small bar, stand alone building, been there forever....

Thanks! Interesting. Been there since 1961. They legally can allow smoking currently, as there are only two employees and both are the owners. I like that. And cash only. Safter to pay with cash. I like that, too.

So, does the state of California allow liquor to be served in bars without the sale of food? Each state is different. In Washington State a certain amount of sales must come from food, otherwise, no liquor licence.

In any case, the mystery location could definitely be a bar, a tiki tavern, if no food sales were necessary. It could've been a travel agency of sorts, too. However, it doesn't give any kind of indication that it would be a travel agency, which would be bad for business. And the sign above definitely looks more like a sign a tavern would have. It really looks more like a bar, or an art gallery, or a jewlery store. Did Hawaiian Airlines or Pan America have any travel agency stores that may have resembled this? Anyone know?

I'm wondering, too, if perhaps the mural was a fabric or the like put up in the windows, rather than a direct painting.

On 2008-08-16 16:48, Tiki Shaker wrote:
Damn Heath, I haven't laughed that hard in forever. I completely expect them to bring up the fact that he taught Kerouac how to write in the next commercial!

Or, how about he taught Kerouac how to type.

No, it looks nothing like the Tiki-Ti. And yes, there are plenty of bars here that serve booze without serving food.

As for it being painted or not, I would say yes, it is painted. If you look at the bottom of the mural, just above the dark tile you can see the outline/shapes of decorative tile that have been painted over.

On 2008-08-17 00:21, Tiki Shaker wrote:
No, it looks nothing like the Tiki-Ti. And yes, there are plenty of bars here that serve booze without serving food.

As for it being painted or not, I would say yes, it is painted. If you look at the bottom of the mural, just above the dark tile you can see the outline/shapes of decorative tile that have been painted over.

.the question was not if it looked like tiki ti.....anyone can see it doesn't.... the question was in regards to there being any other stand alone bars from that time period in california.

..and it was never a question of it being painted or not....we are all in agreement there....the question was in regards to it being painted on a wooden facade or glass..personally i said wood because painted window glass is a liability for any business.(plus, they would have had to cut the glass around the chinese tiles at the bottom...what business would bother with that??).....suppose someone leans against it thinking it's solid or some dope tries to post a bill by stapling it to the glass.(yes people are that stupid sometimes).....i suppose some einstein here will explain that the moulding around the little windows is painted on and not actual molding, which is what it is-three dimensional moulding framing the little window...

..I'm sorry ...i'm grumpy...it's early in the a.m.....haven't had my morning coffee and i'm on the way out the door to the flea market.....

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-17 05:07 ]

"The alcoves displaying jewelry. Why would a bar display jewelry?' **
-DJ Terence Gunn-**

Because they sold jewelry?

In his review of Portland Oregon's Aloha Room in his 1957 book Be My Guest In The Pacific Northwest Bill Spiedel. Jr. wrote:

"I do not wish to create the impression that the (Aloha Room) is laden with bric-a-brac from the South Seas. What might be thought of as souvenir items are found across the hall in the Lanai Room- a combination gift shop and cocktail lounge."

(The full entry on the Aloha Room is HERE.)

On 2008-08-17 10:05, woofmutt wrote:
"The alcoves displaying jewelry. Why would a bar display jewelry?' **
-DJ Terence Gunn-**

Because they sold jewelry?

In his review of Portland Oregon's Aloha Room in his 1957 book Be My Guest In The Pacific Northwest Bill Spiedel. Jr. wrote:

"I do not wish to create the impression that the (Aloha Room) is laden with bric-a-brac from the South Seas. What might be thought of as souvenir items are found across the hall in the Lanai Room- a combination gift shop and cocktail lounge."
[/guote]

Doubtful. By presenting such an example, what you aren't taking into consideration, woofmutt, (if it is even a tiki tavern at all, which hasn't been proven or disproven yet) is the size of this mystery place and the location which it is in. Having a souvenier shop across the hall in a nice spacious hotel with a restaurant and cocktail lounge is one thing; having it in some little tavern is another.

If this place is a tiki tavern and they did sell some kind of jewelry, they'd be mere trinkets and sold behind the bar, most likely, and hardly worthy of window displays.

On 2008-08-17 05:01, Tipsy McStagger wrote:
..and it was never a question of it being painted or not....we are all in agreement there....the question was in regards to it being painted on a wooden facade or glass..personally i said wood because painted window glass is a liability for any business.(plus, they would have had to cut the glass around the chinese tiles at the bottom...what business would bother with that??).....suppose someone leans against it thinking it's solid or some dope tries to post a bill by stapling it to the glass.(yes people are that stupid sometimes).....i suppose some einstein here will explain that the moulding around the little windows is painted on and not actual molding, which is what it is-three dimensional moulding framing the little window...

I agree, too, that the mural was painted, and painted on wood. When I suggested the mural being some kind of fabric I would imply a glass facade with the mural attached from the inside. I don't really believe it was, but wanted to throw it out there as a possibility. However, the tiles (actually they're more decorative grates than tiles) certainly wouldn't have been installed in glass. An oversight on my part. My apologies.

I recall somebody earlier in this thread saying the little windows (display, alcove, or otherwise) were (or may have been) painted on, and I also disagree with that. The mouldings and tiles were not painted on and over, but around.

[ Edited by: DJ Terence Gunn 2008-08-17 11:57 ]

"...What you aren't taking into consideration...Is the size of this mystery place and the location which it is in. Having a souvenier shop across the hall in a nice spacious hotel with a restaurant and cocktail lounge is one thing; having it in some little tavern is another."

What I was taking into consideration was an answer to your question:

"Why would a bar display jewelry?"

It was proposed earlier that this could be the lounge/bar entrance to a larger establishment.

Though I don't think it's a part of the actual answer I like the notion of a bar/lounge that sold nice trinkets to be brought home to the wife. "Ah c'mon baby! Look...I wasn't out drinking, I was jewelry shopping!"

The current business of the mystery place is Vy's Jewelry, according to the following.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=544+Grant+avenue+san+francisco&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&resnum=1&ct=title

The green door's still there, too. Now before all the Einstein's and Sherlock Holmes' out there correct me, I know the address is incorrect (it should -- actually, should it? -- be 542 -- the address of the mystery place), and that Vy's Jewelry should be in the boutique (the boutique at 544 in the mystery photo), but compare it with the photo. Vy's looks like it could very easily be the mystery place! Once again, the green door and even some green paint on parts of the exterior are still there.

Whether there was food served there or not, the area to the right of the mystery place is
a separate building altogether -- hence no expansion, no torn down wall. The boutique in the mystery photo is also in a separate building. Basically speaking, the mystery bar or whatever it is, is the sole business on this side of the building, below apartments above.

Aren't there any TC'ers in San Francisco who can take a trip over there, go inside, talk to the owners and maybe find some information about the previous businesses that occupied the location? Bloody hell, if I lived in SF I'd have done it as soon as we found out the city and street location! If so, bring in a copy of the mystery photo, too. I'm sure the owners and employees -- assuming they aren't one in the same -- would find the photo most amusing.

[ Edited by: DJ Terence Gunn 2008-08-18 12:28 ]

It should also be noted that the address of the store to the right of the current 544 Grant Avenue business is 540 Grant Avenue, and there is no shop inbetween the two. The shop to the left of the current 544 Grant Avenue location is 550, with no shop inbetween. The interesting thing, though, is that all three locations have a similar door off to the left of each business. One thing is definitely for sure, the facades have been completely redone. In any case, if this isn't proof of address rezoning, I don't know what is.

[ Edited by: DJ Terence Gunn 2008-08-17 19:51 ]

Wow! I just got home from Tiki Oasis and you guys have added another 4 pages of info! Sheesh..I thought I would just take a quick peek! I will have to review this all tomorrow. Nice job everyone!

i'm not convinced....the yellow door building is our mark from the vintage photo...look at the trim above the door...it has the same three half round strips as the one in the photo....plus, architectural details/ motifs remain consistant in buildings as they are being built......they don't arbitrarily "mix em' up"....the brick detail on the roof line of the place with the yellow door is identical to the brickwork in the photo... ....vy's jewelry does not match the building in the slide.

On 2008-08-17 21:25, Tipsy McStagger wrote:

i'm not convinced....the yellow door building is our mark from the vintage photo...look at the trim above the door...it has the same three half round strips as the one in the photo....plus, architectural details/ motifs remain consistant in buildings as they are being built......they don't arbitrarily "mix em' up"....the brick detail on the roof line of the place with the yellow door is identical to the brickwork in the photo... ....vy's jewelry does not match the building in the slide.

Excellent observations, Tipsy! The door part I don't agree with yet, as the door in the current photo of Vy's Jewelry cannot be fully seen at the top (and it's only a side view anyway). They may be identical. However, the brick motif above the front is uniqe to the three buildings. If one pans upwards on the google street cam (what a wonder that is!) one can see this motif on the upper part of the building. Bravo, Tipsy! However, I'm not completely convinced that this is, in fact, the mystery location. It may be, of course; but as any possible brick motif (namely, the one shown in the mystery photo) is hidden by an awning at Ry's Jewelry, there's no telling that the same motif isn't there -- even if the motif is there and wasn't extended to the upper part of the building. More than likely there isn't such a motif there. But without somebody actually going and taking a look under the awning, we'll never know.

If the current photo (if it is the same building that the mystery place is located in) is 550 Grant Avenue, and the mystery photo indicates an adjacent business at 544, then there was rezoning. But more importantly, there is an anomoly in numbering along Grant Avenue -- then and now. The fact that 'The Place' was located at 546 Grant Avenue in the 1950s, and that there is no 546 Grant Avenue currently, proves rezoning/numbering. Still, this is the general area, and the numbers are somewhat logically close enough -- though 550 and 544 are numbers apart.

However, if there was rezoning, the mystery location may not be at the current 550 Grant location at all (despite any similarities), and either further up the street or further down. A lot of these store fronts had/have similar facades (though not always similar brick motifs -- especially the one indicated above), and with the proverbial door to the left (as one looks at the store).

Anyway, I'm going to bow out of this thread now, as I'm getting too obsessed with it. (I love a mystery and I love a challenge and I am prone to indulgence!) I've made some input and observations on this thread, hopefully some helpful and insightful, and I will continue to follow the thread as an interested observer.

May the mystery be solved soon! Sorry to say this, but I'm going to laugh my ass off if the mystery location turns out to be in a different Chinatown in a different city altogether! I'm hoping it won't be, though, as we've gone so far to get this far.

-T.G.

..i agree....until someone actually goes there and investigates the issues we all proposed in this thread in order to finally put this part of the mystery to rest, we are just spinning are wheels on this...

..i'm out too, until further info comes to light on this....

Perhaps it is possible that each individual door was assigned its own street number in those days. If so, then the numbers might make a little more sense. 540 and 542 would be the two doors of the building that is 540 today (Lisa's Jewelry). 544 and 546 would be the two doors of today's Vy's Jewelry building. And 548 and 550 would be today's LT Jewelry, now known as 550.

[ Edited by: Pacifilantic 2008-08-18 13:01 ]

..you may be right...perhaps one address was for the business on the ground floor and one for the apartments above in each building.

in some plaCES these days they use 1/2 -for example, a business will be 544 and the apartment above will be 544 1/2....

[ Edited by: Tipsy McStagger 2008-08-18 07:44 ]

"i'll be in SF on Aug 25, and i'll recon for us...i'll get pix..." -dogbytes-

Besides this photo:

For comparison purposes could you please also approximatae these pictures:

So we need shots of...

•You at the Mystery Location
•You on a bench
•You lying on a tropical beach
•You in front of a chalet style restaurant
•You in a sombrero on a donkey that's hitched to a wagon

And why the hell not...How about one of you and a man being friendly on a couch?

If time is short I think I speak for everyone when I suggest that other than the Mystery Location picture the photo we'd all find most useful would be the one of you wearing a sombrero and riding a donkey.

Thanks!

I am only going to weigh in on the address thing. Here in Seattle there can be two sets of addresses for one building - a PUD address which is the original plot address being serviced, and the business/apartment address, which comes later and is more specific. For instance: you originally have one business on one plot of land being serviced by PUD, then later, you either break up or add more places to the one plot and the address then becomes an amalgam of numbers (beginning: 1212 Boogie Woogie Avenue - after remodel or additions: 1212-14 Boogie Woogie Avenue - combined it can become 1214 provided there is not another building on that street with that number already.) Just a thought.

I want to live on Boogie Woogie Avenue.

well in google you can go to street view:
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=544+Grant+avenue+san+francisco&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&resnum=1&ct=title

orginal

down the street

my parents are all over this! here's a reply from Uncle Walt (who was a liquor distributor, i know he has cool swag...)

John,
This used to be a Bar on the right was Shanghai Low Restaurant. I don't remember the name of the Bar but it is definitely on Grant Ave between Pine and California Streets. Ray Low would know the name of the place but he died 6 years or so. I knew the people that bought the place and eventually moved across the street. They renamed it Orient West Cocktail Lounge.
Walt

i'm bringing dad along cuz he speaks cantonese and can get better info .. i'll post when i get info.

Edit: Oops, new post appeared while I was typing, that made mine moot. I was speculating that it may have been a jewelry or clothing store, and they had the mural done to tap into the general excitement of what was happening that year... Hawaiian statehood. But it looks like it was a little cocktail place! Thanks, Dogbytes!
I agree that the doors on the left open to stairways, to go to the apartment or lease space above the shops. I wonder if The Place was on the ground floor, or if it was upstairs, in the space over one of these shops.

[ Edited by: Limbo Lizard 2008-08-18 17:15 ]

From the movie "The Lady From Shanghai"

Postcard

Founder

Menu cover

Inside menu

Drink Menu

History of the area on the bottom of the page. But look at the entire site, it's great. The info on the drink menus is fantastic.

http://grantavenuefollies.com/

[ Edited by: Tiki Shaker 2008-08-18 17:48 ]

and this was on flicker...

From San Francisco Film Society site, near bottom of this page:
"You can’t go to Shanghai Low at 532 Grant Street anymore (seen in THE LADY FROM SHANGHAI), but you can have lunch at the no doubt tamer Lotus Garden Restaurant at the same address."

The Lotus Garden is immediately to the right of the yellow-signed Lisa Jewelry Co.:

Oops, that pic from The Lady From Shanghai was already posted above.

Well, I still wanna see Dogbytes in a sombrero. On a donkey.

[ Edited by: woofmutt 2008-08-19 00:06 ]

looks about right - note the tower and clock area

also from flickr

[ Edited by: sneakyjack 2008-08-19 10:12 ]

I think the mystery location is solved. Now all we need to figure out is what the storefront was. Maybe someone can research that exact address and see what (DBA)'s have come and gone out of that location? Someone who might have access to the SF library. Good job to all, and what a great thread!