Would you prefer Tiki as 'mainstream' or 'underground'? - General Tiki

E EsQui Member Chicago Joined: Aug 15, 2004 Posts: 41	E EsQui Posted posted on Wed, Feb 9, 2005 4:57 PM You guys really sucked me in. I was planning on working but I couldn't stop reading all of the posts in this topic. Sorry in advance for my long post! I think I see the problem and the solution. The problem is considering tiki a scene that can go from underground to mainstream and then die. The solution is to see tiki as a culture that has expanded to include other things. Take Asian culture as an example. Asian food, art, music, films, and dishware can be created and enjoyed by anyone, including non-Asians. There are cool retro Asian things, fancy restaurants, and artifacts. But you can find eggrolls at the shopping mall food court, along with chopsticks at target, asian cartoons on the Cartoon Network, and geisha outfits at the party store. When Madonna started dressing like a Geisha, and everyone was yapping about Feng Sui decorating, I didn't lay down and cry that I would never eat fried rice again. With scenes you can say, I'm Gothic, I'm Punk, I'm a Raver, I'm a Stoner, I'm a Headbanger. Unless you actually are Polynesian, I think with tiki you just say I like tiki stuff. Anyone that likes the tropical vacation feel and scenery, a certain type of retro collectables and images, along with island drinks and food can be into tiki. People can gather in the name of tiki, listen to tiki, dress tiki, collect tiki as the wave of interest becomes scene-like. But in the end, when the tide goes back out it falls back into the culture category plus a little extra twist from retro America. Not only did I buy the Target Tiki mugs, I have them displayed prominently in my backporch tikibar. Why? Because unlike my other tiki mugs, I can drink out of these and wash them without sweating with worry about breaking them. I can even let drunk guests drink out of them without threatening to kill them. And most of all, I get a weird sense of amusement when serious tiki elitists see them and wince. But cheap tiki stuff has been in the stores ever since I can remember. I don't think it is a matter of someone trying to cash in on current interest. I think it is more of a matter of cashing in on tropical vacation themed parties. Along with Target, Ebay is also mentioned in a condescending tone. I've been creating and selling Tiki Pop Art and selling it on Ebay for years. I did it before I was even aware of Tike Central, and because of it nice people from TC invited me to fun events and let me know about TC. But I have probably been accused by some of trying to cash in. Believe me, Ebay keeps most of the money, and after material costs and time I wouldn't say that Tiki related sales keep me alive. But I do pop art of anything from any culture that I like. Why? Because I like it! As for mainstream: I would like an all Tiki Radio station (but I would like the DJs to be serious about the quality). I would like a Tiki Channel that plays not only retro shows, but new variety shows, and cool tiki music videos, and cartoons for intelligent people). I would like more bars to have tiki drinks made with real fruit juices, freshly squeezed, with chunky garnishes. If I order a drink that has coconut milk, I want to see someone hacking that shell open for the goodness inside. I want a bigger selection of affordable and expensive collectables. That way I can pick and choose, save or use. I want Tiki bars on a grand scale, with 50 foot statues, flaming torches, live bands, and a mass of people to watch and have a good time with. But the problem with mainstream is not with quantity or quality. The problem with mainstream is intelligence. The majority of people on earth are dumb and annoying (not you or me, of course). We want to enjoy ourselves in tiki culture without morons in our faces ruining it. Imagine if 100,000 people, that qualified by your own personal standards as cool, gathered together for a tiki event like a bunch of hippies. Imagine that they are all selling something cool that they made, and affordable enough for you to buy. You would have the time of your life, pick out a momento to take home, and pat yourself on the back for going. It is only when a bunch of mindless, possibly souless idiots show up that it gets ruined. I'm not talking about innocent retards, they can't help it. I'm talking about dumb jerks. But if you get too serious about it you can ruin it too, by being a tiki facist that decides what goes and what doesn't. Sometimes it seems like "Lord of the Flies" in here. It is as laughable as a white rapper. So you see, mainstream provides more opportunities. Then you just choose from the best. Anything else can be disposable or avoided. Taco Bell doesn't ruin Mexican culture. Calm down and have fun! Open your kitchen cabinet and look at all those plain and ugly drinking glasses you have. Everyone of them could have been replaced by big and small tiki mugs from target. If you were too stuck up to buy some you missed out. If you have plenty of $30 tiki mugs that you are reluctant to use, you missed out. Here in Chicago they went on clearance because they were not part of the dreaded mainstream. I could understand if they were plastic, but they were not plastic! I hope Martha Stuart makes a whole line of them when she gets out of jail, along with drink recipes. I hope they are cooler than anything retro or limited edition, and I hope they are $2. Then I can get drunk, rowdy, smash them on the floor and yell "ooompa!" EsQui http://www.waitingchairgallery.com [ Edited by: EsQui on 2005-02-09 17:04 ]

You guys really sucked me in. I was planning on working but I couldn't stop reading all of the posts in this topic. Sorry in advance for my long post!

I think I see the problem and the solution. The problem is considering tiki a scene that can go from underground to mainstream and then die. The solution is to see tiki as a culture that has expanded to include other things.

Take Asian culture as an example. Asian food, art, music, films, and dishware can be created and enjoyed by anyone, including non-Asians. There are cool retro Asian things, fancy restaurants, and artifacts. But you can find eggrolls at the shopping mall food court, along with chopsticks at target, asian cartoons on the Cartoon Network, and geisha outfits at the party store. When Madonna started dressing like a Geisha, and everyone was yapping about Feng Sui decorating, I didn't lay down and cry that I would never eat fried rice again.

With scenes you can say, I'm Gothic, I'm Punk, I'm a Raver, I'm a Stoner, I'm a Headbanger. Unless you actually are Polynesian, I think with tiki you just say I like tiki stuff. Anyone that likes the tropical vacation feel and scenery, a certain type of retro collectables and images, along with island drinks and food can be into tiki. People can gather in the name of tiki, listen to tiki, dress tiki, collect tiki as the wave of interest becomes scene-like. But in the end, when the tide goes back out it falls back into the culture category plus a little extra twist from retro America.

Not only did I buy the Target Tiki mugs, I have them displayed prominently in my backporch tikibar. Why? Because unlike my other tiki mugs, I can drink out of these and wash them without sweating with worry about breaking them. I can even let drunk guests drink out of them without threatening to kill them. And most of all, I get a weird sense of amusement when serious tiki elitists see them and wince. But cheap tiki stuff has been in the stores ever since I can remember. I don't think it is a matter of someone trying to cash in on current interest. I think it is more of a matter of cashing in on tropical vacation themed parties.

Along with Target, Ebay is also mentioned in a condescending tone. I've been creating and selling Tiki Pop Art and selling it on Ebay for years. I did it before I was even aware of Tike Central, and because of it nice people from TC invited me to fun events and let me know about TC. But I have probably been accused by some of trying to cash in. Believe me, Ebay keeps most of the money, and after material costs and time I wouldn't say that Tiki related sales keep me alive. But I do pop art of anything from any culture that I like. Why? Because I like it!

As for mainstream:

I would like an all Tiki Radio station (but I would like the DJs to be serious about the quality).
I would like a Tiki Channel that plays not only retro shows, but new variety shows, and cool tiki music videos, and cartoons for intelligent people).
I would like more bars to have tiki drinks made with real fruit juices, freshly squeezed, with chunky garnishes. If I order a drink that has coconut milk, I want to see someone hacking that shell open for the goodness inside.
I want a bigger selection of affordable and expensive collectables. That way I can pick and choose, save or use.
I want Tiki bars on a grand scale, with 50 foot statues, flaming torches, live bands, and a mass of people to watch and have a good time with.

But the problem with mainstream is not with quantity or quality. The problem with mainstream is intelligence. The majority of people on earth are dumb and annoying (not you or me, of course). We want to enjoy ourselves in tiki culture without morons in our faces ruining it. Imagine if 100,000 people, that qualified by your own personal standards as cool, gathered together for a tiki event like a bunch of hippies. Imagine that they are all selling something cool that they made, and affordable enough for you to buy. You would have the time of your life, pick out a momento to take home, and pat yourself on the back for going. It is only when a bunch of mindless, possibly souless idiots show up that it gets ruined. I'm not talking about innocent retards, they can't help it. I'm talking about dumb jerks. But if you get too serious about it you can ruin it too, by being a tiki facist that decides what goes and what doesn't. Sometimes it seems like "Lord of the Flies" in here. It is as laughable as a white rapper.

So you see, mainstream provides more opportunities. Then you just choose from the best. Anything else can be disposable or avoided. Taco Bell doesn't ruin Mexican culture. Calm down and have fun! Open your kitchen cabinet and look at all those plain and ugly drinking glasses you have. Everyone of them could have been replaced by big and small tiki mugs from target. If you were too stuck up to buy some you missed out. If you have plenty of $30 tiki mugs that you are reluctant to use, you missed out. Here in Chicago they went on clearance because they were not part of the dreaded mainstream. I could understand if they were plastic, but they were not plastic! I hope Martha Stuart makes a whole line of them when she gets out of jail, along with drink recipes. I hope they are cooler than anything retro or limited edition, and I hope they are $2. Then I can get drunk, rowdy, smash them on the floor and yell "ooompa!"

EsQui
http://www.waitingchairgallery.com

[ Edited by: EsQui on 2005-02-09 17:04 ]

Post #140346 by EsQui on Wed, Feb 9, 2005 4:57 PM