Basketball brawl-sports has reached a new low

Go to http://www.msnbc.com to watch grown men who make a great big pile of money acting like schoolyard bullies beat up the very fans who support their salaries.Only for the strong of stomach.

I was wnderin' if anyone had an opinion on this event. I think how it's shown makes it look worse than it is...

I think there is alot going on with the egos pf people paid millions of dollars who have never had to say to themelves "I better not do this or I could loose this sweet gig"

A building full of drunks throwing stuff not thinking they might get some jail time too...or worse yet, loose some teeth...certainly makes it worse.

Soccer...fans throwing bags of urine, and stabbing each other...now THAT'S over the top.

Usually, schoolyard bullies don't require you to throw a cup full of liquid at them first, eh?

What would you do if somebody hit you with a cup full of soda or beer?

I say you're taking a calculated risk when you throw shit at a large human.

Same with the "fan" who went onto the court to keep the fight going. I say, you go on the court with violent intentions, then whatever happens next is your own damn problem. Buncha Eminem wannabe's.

What I can't figure out is who would throw a perfectly good 12 dollar (yup, twelve dollar!) beer at somebody. Throwing 12.00 beers is a sign from God that you have too much money. Throwing away alcohol of any kind is a sign of bad breeding. I've never even thrown free beer at anybody, let alone 12.00. Shameful.

I wouldn't suspend any of those players - well, maybe Ben Wallace for the game related incident. But just one game.

On the plus side, I bet it's the first time almost all of us have seen Detroit or Indy on TV this year. Just so long as they spell N-B-A right, eh? :wink:

On 2004-11-20 16:25, Geeky Tiki wrote:

I say you're taking a calculated risk when you throw shit at a large human.

Usually, the only ones who get away with this activity are safely beyond a barrier inside a zoo exhibit.

Well said,Zebratiki! I'm reminded of the phrase "Soccer is the most boring sport in the world,yet people riot because of it-American Football is the most violent sport in the world,yet people fall asleep watching it".Don't know where basketball fits in.Alright,I've had a few Chardonnays.

People (fans) get way to emotional about sports. I can understand (but don't condone) athletes flying off the handle in the heat of the moment. Celebrities, sports figures, politians, etc. all get objectified by the public, bad news in and of itself. On top of that people these days seem way to justified to do and say whatever they want no matter how irrational, and there always seems to be someone there to back them up.

I should point out that, for the most part, I don't follow sports. I didn't even know about the story until checking out this thread. Events like this make us all look bad.

[ Edited by: FREAKBEAR on 2004-11-21 21:32 ]

On 2004-11-20 16:25, Geeky Tiki wrote:
Throwing away alcohol of any kind is a sign of bad breeding. I've never even thrown free beer at anybody, let alone 12.00. Shameful.

:lol: Shameful is an understatement. Despicable is more like it. May they rot in a fiery Hell. Without beer. :wink:

I thought of that line..."last night I went to the fights and a hockey game broke out". Makes me yern for the old days of roller derby. I could almost hear Dick Lane yelling WHOOOOOOOO NELLY!

Shipwreck...Dick Lane..."A Country Mile" Dick Lane?

Remember the match race between Ralpy Balladeros and Ronnie Psycho Reines?

While sipping on my belgian triple ale, I say PFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!
C'mon, That "Old Europe" has these boys beat by a hundred kilometers.

Soccer hooliganism, heck Rugby just the sport, have this childs play beat.

Look at the violence at south american football matches.

More than once, teams have gotten involved.

I have a theory, but it involves certain mumbo jumbo practices that allow people to feel better about themselves after they've been complete idiots.

TG

*On 2004-11-20 16:25, Geeky Tiki wrote:*What would you do if somebody hit you with a cup full of soda or beer?

Get wet? :drink:

Pathetic group of fans, but an even worse group of thugs, errrr Basketball Players. Get some class...

On 2004-11-20 20:31, Gigantalope wrote:

Remember the match race between Ralpy Balladeros and Ronnie Psycho Reines?

Wasn't Ronnie Psycho Reines the principal jammer for the Bombers?

He switched sides after that and became Captain of the T-Birds, but yes, he was.

Do you remember the phone number for tickets? (Live at he olimpic)It was on the back of the penalty box.

I think it was Ricmond 9 5171...but maybe that was Zachary-All's ph?

What a Battle Royale - a fight for the ages!

When entering the ring, or taunting players courtside, fans should remember the admonition, "protect yourself at all times."

Ron Artest should have fought Ben Wallace, not the fans. Nevertheless, the fans should not have egged on Artest, the most hot-headed player in the NBA by throwing possible career ending projectiles near his face (even though it did not hit his face).

The security issue is irrelevant - first and foremost, they are primarily ushers. Moreover, fans & players alike must be responsible for their own actions and everyone knows not to throw projectiles or punches.

fans & players alike must be responsible for their own actions and everyone knows not to throw projectiles or punches

By responsible...at this point do you mean financially?

The thing that irks me, as half assed sports fan, is that neither group who acts, is prepares (nor is society) for them to be responsible for thier actions.

Too bad there isn't some parole where they would both have to live two years working at Taco Bell in some middle of nowhere dive, just sctaching out a 'livin.

Is it wrong to not like sports...

This is not sports anymore.
Even when youre being responsible you can still get caught up in it all as an bystander. Like that lady last summer watching some ballgame and she gets hit in the face with a chair that was thrown by a player into the stands. The fans and players are both to blame. What last year the father and son jump onto the ball field and attack the first base coach during the game.

The idiot fans who got punched by the players...for throwing things, or for going on the court...When they get the "Out of Court Settlements" which they 'probly will get....I hope they have the composure to say as they get the cheque "I was just doing the best thing for my family".

So some loud-mouthed, stupid, rich, drunk, suburbanite, ex-jock got his teeth knocked out at a basketball game. It's about time!!

Now maybe the loud-mouthed, stupid, rich, drunk, suburbanite, ex-jock who sits next to me and my family at Buck's games will think twice before dropping the f-bomb every thirty seconds while spilling beer all over my daughter.

I love the look on that guys face just before the first fist gets planted in his pretty-boy face.

On 2004-11-22 08:22, finkdaddy wrote:
So some loud-mouthed, stupid, rich, drunk, suburbanite, ex-jock got his teeth knocked out at a basketball game. It's about time!!

So some loud-mouthed, stupid, rich, overpaid, self involved jock got busted. It's about time!!

-Z

On 2004-11-22 09:16, Feelin' Zombified wrote:

On 2004-11-22 08:22, finkdaddy wrote:
So some loud-mouthed, stupid, rich, drunk, suburbanite, ex-jock got his teeth knocked out at a basketball game. It's about time!!

So some loud-mouthed, stupid, rich, overpaid, self involved jock got busted. It's about time!!

-Z

I totaly agree with you. I think the penalties are justified and were needed. Everybody involved was at fault, and I'm glad no physical harm was done to anyone who was innocent. The players clearly crossed the line, and your right, Artest is amazingly self-involved and has no idea what a good thing he has going.

I guess I'm just bitter because there is an asshole who has season tickets next to us that is the type of guy who pulls that kind of crap. Always swearing and throwing junk. I've tried to have him kicked out more than once, but nothing ever comes of it.

Wow, Detroit’s getting a bad rap, yet again, or was it again and again, or perhaps again and again, and again. Half of the comments on this post have me pretty pissed. I understand the situation was ugly. I live twenty minutes away from The Palace (Piston's stadium) and have watched this stuff over and over and over again for the last few days. To keep things professional I just want to say not everyone at the game were drunk, as many have assumed. There were many innocent bystanders in the mix. The first guy who got hit didn't even throw the cup of beer. Whoever the guy was who did throw it deserves to be fined and banned from all sports arenas as far as I'm concerned. But let me say this, he wasn't the first guy to throw a beer and Artest wasn't the first player to get hit with a beer. Hell, Patrick Ewing got spit on by a fan last year and things didn't go crazy the way it did here the other night. If you ask me that’s far worse than having a "career ending projectile" cup of beer thrown at you. The selected few fans that were involved deserve punishment, but that doesn’t mean that Detroit is full of "pathetic half assed Eminem wannabe sports fans". If some fan from a Lakers game through a beer at a player from Detroit and that player along with his teammates started knocking down innocent people in the stands and throwing punches at people who they believed threw the beer, wouldn't you expect that the fans would fight back. If you're at that game and your friend, girlfriend, wife, or kid next to you gets knocked down or hit wouldn't you jump on top of that player to try and stop him. These are big strong guys. This could have happened anywhere. I've heard so much negative sh*t about Detroit these last three days I'm ready to puke.
I'm not sure what I'm trying to say here. It was an ugly scene the other night. Twenty people went to the hospital. I'm just trying to defend the good people here, not the handful of jackasses who got involved, the good people and spirit that is here everyday. This could have happened anywhere, Dallas, Milwaukee, anywhere. But it happened because this is Detroit. Not all the fans were a bunch of raging drunken lunatics but they were because this is Detroit. Artest shouldn't have been provoked, but if he's attacking innocent people don't they have the right to defend themselves. But they didn't defend themselves; they rioted because this is Detroit. All of you have a right to your opinion and I appreciate every post, I'm not trying to lash out in revenge but don't you people know how much these type of comments just break this city's heart. (My own included)

Hey Tikilee!

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. My post wasn't about Detroit at all. It was really about the guy who sits next to us at Buck's games. I think it could happen anywhere.

But hey, even if Detroit has a bad reputation with it's sports teams, Milwaukee is the capital of crooked politicians to much of the country so who would I be to talk!

Let's do a reality check here....the Palace of Auburn Hills where the team plays is about a 45 minute drive from Detroit. I would bet most of the fans at the game weren't from Detroit (the guy pinpointed as actually throwing the beer is from West Bloomfield an extrememly wealthy suburb). The only thing relating to the actual city any longer is the name of the team.

WTF, does this have to do with the city of Detroit??? NOTHING!!! Quit trying to defend this as they're picking on Detroit again type issue. It's not! The city has it's own richly deserved bad reputation.

Some jerk threw a beer and a bigger jerk went and started a brawl. The beer throwing didn't start the brawl, the "professional" athlete who will now reportedly lose $5 million worth of salary did.

Would I fight with someone who threw a beer at me? If my job required me to take the abuse of fans, which an NBA players does, I would not.

Taking kids to a sporting event? I wouldn't! When did everything become Disneyland? They are serving alcohol and children shouldn't be around adults who consume it. PERIOD!

Matt

Mattfink
Sorry if my post upset you. I'm not really pissed about the posts here at TC. I was merely venting against the national media, which have been running their mouth lately about Detroit. You can't disagree with that. No hard feelings I hope.
Also, I have some pretty fond memories of my dad taking me to Tiger games when I was a kid. Sports are pretty important to kids and to leave them home from games just because they serve alcohol is a little harsh. Hell, if that was the case, we should leave them home during wedding receptions, family reunions, and put 21 and over restrictions on resturants like the Olive Garden or TGIFridays. Many sporting events do promotions for children, and restaurants have Kids Menus.
Anyway, I've probably been watching to much ESPN anyway. To everyone who posted; I'm sorry. NO HARD FEELINGS. Aloha. I blame the national media, who keep playing this thing over and over again.
Finkdaddy, I think its cool you take your daughter to games. Don't let the incident the other night change your mind about that.
Again, to everyone, I'm sorry. I guess I really shouldn't care too much because I live 30 minutes away. Although I was downtown Saturday night and saw the Pixies. Great show.

On 2004-11-22 13:42, tikilee wrote:
we should leave [kids] home during wedding receptions...

the wee ones SHOULD be left home for adult receptions. We had an adult-only reception, but one cousin of mine brought her 10 year old daughter without asking. Well, not only that, she also sent her up for the bouquet toss AND SHE CAUGHT IT. so when it came time for the garter business, the guy who caught the garter was quite uncomfortable to say the least and just tied her ankles together... funny, perhaps, but it shouldn't have happened.

and put 21 and over restrictions on resturants like the Olive Garden or TGIFridays.

Oh God Yes! I'd give anything for child/no child seating much like smoking or non. Not that I have anything against kids, mind you, but when you wanna relax with a cocktail & a quiet dinner, the last thing you want in your ear is a screaming kid.

What was this thread about again? Oh yeah. Detroit IS getting a bum rap from ESPN especially... to the point of ESPN's bias actually becoming part of local news stories.

-Z

I beg to differ that security is not an issue. I attend all of the Baltimore Ravens home games as a member of their marching band. I sit in the last row of our section i.e. closest to the fans. I have encountered quite a range of fan behavior, but mostly pretty good. While I agree that the security folks are mostly ushers, they are the first level in the escalation of force in countering unruly behavior. It may take a complaint from someone near a disruptive fan; but often, the ushers on their own go to specific fans in their assigned section and ask them politely to simmer down. The next step if the fan questions their authority (assuming no violence) is talking to the security supervisor. Any of this is bypassed when there is any violence or the threat thereof. Then, you would think they threw free doughnuts in the stands there are so many Baltimore City Police Officers. Many a drunk has been carried out like a log, horizontal and by many hands! Before each game, there is an announcement and reading of text on the big screens that spells out the stadium policy. I am quoting from memory here but it says "unruly and rude behavior will not be tolerated...have fun, root hard, but don't be a jerk!... here are the realities; first time offenders will be ejected from the stadium, repeat offendors lose their season tickets" This also means you better be sure who you sell your tickets to if you do not want to lose your tickets or permanent seat license.I am not saying it is perfect, but the system there mostly seems to work. NBA fans seem to be a lot closer to the court, but it sure seems that a little rethinking of the security plan could prevent this type of thing from happening.

[i]On 2004-11-22 14:40, WillTiki wrote:

NBA fans seem to be a lot closer to the court, but it sure seems that a little rethinking of the security plan could prevent this type of thing from happening.

NBA are fans aren't just a lot closer to the Court, they are sitting on the same row as or immediately behind the players.

I don't think any amount of security/ushers would have prevented Ron Artest or the others from going into the stands if they desired.

Regarding the penalty, Spreewell was penalized the balance of a season (reduced from one calendar year) from choking his coach, so Artest's penalty is not excessive in and of itself.

However, Artest's 72 game suspension is very excessive in light of the 30 game suspension given to Stephen Jackson, who delivered many more devastating blows.

Ya put some colorful shorts and t shirts on a bunch of street thugs, pay them millions of dollars and you've still got a bunch of street thugs. Brawls, sexual assaults, you name it. And any yutz who mouths off at them probably deserves whatever he gets although it shouldn't happen in the first place.

I blame whoever started giving a voice to the low-lifes of the world in the first place. Jerry Springer wasn't the first. Rikki Lake maybe. Showing real people's unacceptable behavior on TV only reinforced that sort of behavior with all the unemployable bottom feeders of society who are sitting at home watching it in the first place.

Now, taking advantage of real people who don't know any better is big business on the tube. Very sad. Train wreck T.V. I work with kids from these families for a living trying to keep them from turning out like this. This sort of crap doesn't make it any easier.

I blame whoever started giving a voice to the low-lifes

Damn that Hanford Lemore!

Ha ha. You're right. What's that saying about not wanting to be part of any group that'll have me? But I like it here...

On 2004-11-22 18:52, christiki295 wrote:
NBA are fans aren't just a lot closer to the Court, they are sitting on the same row as or immediately behind the players.

If I remember correctly, Jack Nicholson always sits next to the opposing team's coach at Lakers games.