Central Florida Tiki

I did a search and only 1 topic from 2005 came up about Ed's Heads in Melbourne, and none mentioned Mai Tiki in Cocoa Beach.

http://www.edsheadstikis.com/
http://www.maitiki.com/

I am planning to relocate to The Space Coast of Florida next spring, and am saddened at the thought of leaving behind all the great locations and events that are available to me in SoCal. So I was thinking there is bound to be tiki bars, art shows and gatherings in Central Florida... right? The Mai Kai will be a stretch (3hr drive) for me to visit on a regular basis, so I'm hoping the Floridan Tikiphiles can help me out with further information.

On 2008-07-07 15:59, TikiMango wrote:
So I was thinking there is bound to be tiki bars, art shows and gatherings in Central Florida... right?

Wrong. It WAS the Space Coast once, but now its other moniker, the Redneck Riviera, is the more apt term to describe it.

Where 'bouts on the Space Coast?

There is not a lot of 'active' tiki in the area.... but there are all kinds of Tiki Archeology you can do.

Daytona has (had?) the Hawaiian Inn, the Mai Kai hotel, Julienes, and evidence of a lot of Poly-Pop and Mid-Century architecture.

Coco Beach has a couple of places whose names I can't think of that I hope some of the Florida ohana will chime in with.

There is the Polynesian Resort at Mouse-Land.

We have the Mai-Kai down here in the south.

Plus we have a surprising large number of Ohana in Florida, more than you would ever guess.

Wrong. It WAS the Space Coast once, but now its other moniker, the Redneck Riviera, is the more apt term to describe it.

Redneck One: IS THAT A NASCAR?

Redneck Two: YUP! REEL NAS! NASIST CAR I EVAH HAD!

Don't let him fool you, it is only the Redneck Riviera during Race season. And even then the rednecks are pretty much concentrated in Daytona.

Coco Beach and points north are quite nice. And as you head south it is fascinating to go from Pines to Palms in just a few short miles.

Just moved from there. Lived there in Indialantic/ melbourne beach since i was a kid. Not much tiki!!
Daytona has a few haunts. a great theamed tiki bar downtown orlando called Waitiki... it is a beautiful bar... but staff and the college yuppy crowd ruin it. http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=11161&forum=2&15 good luck finding some stuff..

[ Edited by: Tiki Cowboy 2008-07-07 18:56 ]

There is a nice Tiki Restaurant and Bar in Downtown Orlando.

Waitiki

There is some reviews in this post:

http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=11161&forum=2&hilite=Waitiki

Thanks for chiming in folks. C&A, I'll be moving to Satellite Beach, 3 blocks from the beach, between Cocoa Beach and Indialantic, a mile or so South of Patrick AFB. So it seems that I'll have to do some driving in all compass directions (except East unless I get an outrigger). Not what I wanted to hear, but expected. I guess there are no Chops hosted in that area then.

I found a local artist that lives within a mile from where I will be. I guess I will have to recruit him and whoever else I can find to bring the tikis back to the Space Coast. I'm sure there are tons of Archeology sites to rediscover.
http://www.thomsart.com/

On 2008-07-07 19:31, TikiMango wrote:
I guess there are no Chops hosted in that area then.

We have Chops, just not as often.....

And we call them Tiki Jams.

And we have quite a few carvers on this coast as well, but most are still a good drive away.

On 2008-07-07 18:25, bigbrotiki wrote:

Wrong. It WAS the Space Coast once, but now its other moniker, the Redneck Riviera, is the more apt term to describe it.

The Redneck Riviera is on the Gulf, Pensacola, Ft. Walton and all that. But, it is Florida and the rednecks are never far.

Grew up surfing Patricks AFB to Satellite Beach. It is one of the best spots on the east coast. Florida has a huge beach culture, but it is more inspired by the Caribbean than the South Seas.

Hope you can bring some tiki culture there before you smash a conch across your head from hearing Margaritaville for the billionth time. :lol:

What's with the pineapple in the forehead tiki design all about? Is that a Floridian redneck influence? It seems only tikis from the Peninsula have them.

I grew-up in Satellite Beach, so I know all about the dangers of getting between a redneck surfer and his Pabst Blue Ribbon. The surf was good enough for me as a teen. I left there in 1990, thinking I'd never return. Now it seems I have to go back to care for my father that is 75. It just doesn't make financial sense to bring him out to SoCal, or put him in a assisted living facility. I figure I can flip burgers and carve on the beach to pass the time.

Mango, welcome to central Florida. As has been said, Florida has a surprisingly large number of tikiphiles, although many have wandered away from TC. You'll be close enough to the Hawaiian Inn and Julian's, that you must do them at least once. As for MaiTiki in Cocoa, search TC for "Wayne Coombs" and you'll find plenty of hits. His studio is a must visit. Even though his most popular carving style is the toothy Florida tiki style, take a look at some of his other works, including his faux stone tikis and his paintings. And he's a real swell guy too. :)

Sven, the real Redneck Riviera is the northwest Florida panhandle. I know because I lived there for years and my family still does. It's a beautiful coast though. But where else could you sip a Mai-Tai in a Trader Vic's while listening to "Sweet Home Alabama"? It still holds true that the farther north you drive in Florida, the further south you get.

On 2008-07-08 06:10, TikiMango wrote:
What's with the pineapple in the forehead tiki design all about?

That's a Wayne Coombs hallmark. But it is often copied and it's all over Florida.

chip and andy wrote "Daytona has (had?) the Hawaiian Inn," has something happened to the hawiian inn?

On 2008-07-08 07:19, TIKI DAVID wrote:
chip and andy wrote "Daytona has (had?) the Hawaiian Inn," has something happened to the hawiian inn?

They had a problem with their roof recently, a chunk of it fell in. I know they were closed for at least a day for clean-up, but I got the details second hand. Maybe someone closer or more in the know could tell us more.

I wnt to Satellite High. My family still live in the area.. so I get back there..we'll make our own tiki happenings when i get back... as for hawaiian inn in Daytona it is back open..

On 2008-07-07 18:25, bigbrotiki wrote:

On 2008-07-07 15:59, TikiMango wrote:
So I was thinking there is bound to be tiki bars, art shows and gatherings in Central Florida... right?

Wrong. It WAS the Space Coast once, but now its other moniker, the Redneck Riviera, is the more apt term to describe it.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

'Redneck Riveria' is located in the Panhandle of Florida!

That's funny, when I was there last, I saw them all along the coast. Didn't know they had their own reservation, sorry. :)

You probably just saw regular rednecks, not Riviera Rednecks. There is a difference, but its not something one can put into words.

Back to Wayne Coombs and his pineapple element in his tikis, has he ever stated the reasons for adding it? Coming from FL, I just grew-up/accepted them, but since I have been here in SoCal for 12yrs they just seem "different" now. I'm wondering if it has to do with the East Coast artists having to deal with all the Jimmy Buffett Parrotheads? Or is it the fact that the West Coast is the West Coast (Pacific Island/Polynesian influence) and the East Coast is the East Coast (Caribbean influences)?

I can't say for any certainty, but I would imagine it has something with Hawaii = pineapples. They don't show up nearly as much as coconuts in Carribean styled art work. But hey, I could just be blowing smoke.

It is kind of funny though, as the pineapple is native to southern Brazil and spread by the natives into the Carribean where Columbus found it and carried it back. The Spanish in turn brought it to the Philippines where it traveled east to Polynesia in the 16th century.

(ha, Google makes me sound edumacated)

the pineapple has long been a symbol of hospitality..you will find it over doorways the way some folks hang horseshoes (i.e hala kahiki)....i've seen them over the doors to even non tiki bars on occasion (i.e. Nick's bar in chicago).....wayne added pineapples to his tikis for the same reason...simply as a welcoming, hospitable statement....

other than that there is no mystery behind the use of the pineapple symbol.....

The fact that it does not show up in any Tiki restaurants is because Wayne is a post-Tiki period, pre-Tiki revival artist that did not begin to carve before the 1970s ....one of the few that exercised the craft during the Tiki devolution period.

I resent the fact that people think that Floridians are all "Rednecks". I was born and raised in Hollywood, have been frequenting the Mai Kai for all of my life and now proudly live in Ocala, Florida. Just because we don't live in California doesn't make us any less cool or in love with the tiki culture....and there is absolutely nothing wrong with a tiki that has a pineapple on it! We may not have all of the tiki meccas that SO Cal has, but that doesn't mean that we ain't worth nothin' How would you like if I said that everyone from Germany is a Nazi?

I think that the restaurant Julians has closed. The last time I was up that way it did not appear open anymore. Maybe someone else could confirm. It was a classic place and had awesome food and really nice management people that made you feel like you were part of the family.

On 2008-07-09 18:25, The Ragin' Rarotongan wrote:
We may not have all of the tiki meccas that SO Cal has, but that doesn't mean that we ain't worth nothin' How would you like if I said that everyone from Germany is a Nazi?

I didn't say that "all Floridians ain't worth nuthin", I merely wanted to point out that Tiki Mango's hope:

So I was thinking there is bound to be tiki bars, art shows and gatherings in Central Florida... right?

PS: And there's lots wrong with a Tiki with a pineapple on its forehead, especially if it is the only thing that people think of as Tiki. Just because the concept stuck doesn't mean it's good. Wayne is a great artist, but he did what sold best, and along came bozo armies of imitators, so the pineapple thing spread like a weed. When I saw it at the Hard Rock Cafe in Lahaina, I knew it had gone too far. :D

[ Edited by: bigbrotiki 2008-07-09 22:53 ]

..actually....those imitators were other carvers that wayne had hired and trained to carve in his style...he was getting so much work, that he needed a few more carving hands...not all the carvings were done by wayne....if you wanted him to carve one you had to specifically say "wayne, i want YOU to carve it, not one of your employees"...or ask him to point out the ones he actually carved....otherwise you would end up with a carving by someone else......

long story short, many of the carvers wayne trained wound up quitting and when they did, they went into business for themselves miles down the beach, carving the same tikis wayne showed them how.....it always pissed wayne off and rightly so....not only did he invest time and money into these carvers but now they were stealing his thunder and cutting him out......

this is the legend of the big tooth tikis!!

incidentally, i also have pics from way back at the leeteg art gallery opening in huntington beach...where copies of waynes tikis were sent overseas to be duplicated and sold at the opening....and this was back when few people had even heard of wayne and his style wasn't so widespread....

Bigbrotiki, thanks for mentioning the stark realities I will face. Though not as prolific as SoCal events, its good to see there are events happening in FL, it just looks like I'll be doing a heck of a lot more driving.

McStagger, thanks for the background information. I knew Wayne hired "apprentices", I just never took the time to put 2+2 together to be the root cause of the proliferation of pineapple design motifs seen in Florida tikis.

Rarotongan, I don't want to get into a semantics battle with anyone, especially with me being so new to TC. I think the generalization of "redneck" was not meant to be taken as all inclusive to Floridians, but rather in jest. I came to FL when I was 3, so I consider myself a native. Californians enjoy boasting about their climate and how they can surf, snow ski and visit the desert all in one day. Floridians can surf, water ski, scuba dive (without a 7mm suit), watch sea turtles lay/hatch eggs, go 4x4 muddin', see awesome pollution-free sunrises and enjoy common sub-$1 drafts. If all of that is redneck, sign me up, and give me a Bocephus hat.
:wink: :drink:

Floridians can also go to the Mai-Kai without a plane ticket. Na-na-na-na-na! :P

On 2008-07-10 09:20, GatorRob wrote:
Floridians can also go to the Mai-Kai without a plane ticket. Na-na-na-na-na! :P

Yeah!

Na-na-na-na-na! :P

Heh!

So I'm trying to do some research, and it seems that most of the carvers are from CA, and most of the palm selections are Californian as well. Considering Central Florida and the locally available materials there, what are some good palm varieties for carving?

Here is a link to a local palm supplier, and I hardly see any common names between palms on the East vs West coast. Of course I didn't cross check the Latin names...

:-?

On 2008-07-26 09:58, TikiMango wrote:
Central Florida and the locally available materials there, what are some good palm varieties for carving?

Sabal (sp?) Palm, Cabbage Palm, and Coconut all make good carving stock.

Part of the problem with the Palms in Florida is we have too many of them. Not physically, but in varieties... we have a lot of palms that make beautiful trees but are completely useless for carving.

Get in touch with Wayne Coombs or Benzart, they can give you the lowdown on what's good carving from local resources.

My father ha "real" coconut palms, one had something wrong with it and it was chopped down. I met with a carver that got the tree from my dad. He said it was the worst palm he had ever worked with and would stay away from coconut palms in the future.

Palms are plentiful in your area. Sabal is the most common - it is the official state tree. I have found that every palm is different and every part of the tree is unique. I recently cut down a live Coconut and cut into 2 pieces. I kept the bottom and a buddy kept the top. The top of the tree turned into a mass of palm threads, while the bottom is curing nicely. Also something to be aware of is "palm rot" - that's when the outside of the tree dries faster than the inside. All of the water is trapped and turns the inside into a mushy, stinking mess. There are plenty of other types of wood in Florida that can be carved. Mahogany, mango, avacado, campher, oak... not the pine. FL pine is not good for carving but is great for wildfires!! Good luck.

On 2008-07-28 07:52, AlohaStation wrote:
There are plenty of other types of wood in Florida that can be carved. mango

Beautiful wood, but one must be very careful with this one. Some people have allergic, poison-ivy type reactions when handling the wood, the sap specifically. If you have allergic reactions to Poison Oak, Sumac, or ivy you will want to steer clear of using Mango for your carving.

If you don't react to any of those, then carve away because it really is excellent carving material. So I've been told. I am one who reacts to it so I have never tried to carve it.

There could be plenty of free sabal palms for you all to carve very soon:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080723/ap_on_sc/dying_palms

I've got three of them in my front yard and they're all over my neighborhood. I hope they don't get infected.

[ Edited by: GatorRob 2008-07-29 05:31 ]

We had to get ride of an awesome Mango that was in our yard when Mrs. Bo. turned into the "Elephant Woman" from her allergic reaction.

Sorry to hear about this disease affecting the sabal palms. I hope they can find a cure. I lived in FL in the early-80's and we lost 6 acres of orange tree groves, but not to really disease. There was hurricane David in '79, then we had some bad winters in the '83 and '84 seasons.

My dad has two giant mango trees in the back yard now, but I don't plan on taking them down when I get back. They are easily 45ft tall with 30ft-wide canopies. As long they they continue to produce a plethora of mangoes they'll have a home. I hadn't thought of carving mango, I'll have to give that a shot at some point.

Has anyone here carved in SoCal and in Florida, or vice versa? Have you noticed a difference in the way you have to carve due to the humidity levels being so different? More cracking, less?

SoCAl- seems 30% humidity
Florida- seems 90% humidity

The difference I noticed was I sweat much more and my safety glasses fog up in Fla.

Quote
On 2008-07-08 06:10, TikiMango wrote:
What's with the pineapple in the forehead tiki design all about?
Quote
Tipsy is the closest so far but I haven't finished this thread. Yes it probably was Wayne who put the first pineapple on a tiki's head but there is no way to know for sure. The FACT is that Wayne Marketed these tiki's all over the WORLD and they are all many peeps see or know as tiki I(too bad,But is bad tiki worse than No Tiki?)(Whole different conversation)
Actually Tipsy is right there next to the answer about the importance of the Pineapple to south East Florida. Way back when Florida was the new Wilderness, the Treasure coast (tucked in between the Space coast and the Gold coast)was home to Many LARGE Pineapple Plantations to the effect that it was the Main crop for many years. The pineapple was a sign of prosperity and back then with the heartfelt neighborly way of life, when anyone had something to share, be it a crop of freshly ripe Pineapples, or a load of goods fresh off the ship from afar or whatever to share, the People would top the gate poles at the road with fresh Pineapples as a WELCOME to Anyone interested to "Come on in and Partake of this great fortune" and to Share what it was they had in abundance. Not a Sale thing or an advertisement for anything but Sharing, (ALOHA?). The Pineapple on the Gate was so prevalent that they (Artists?) started making wooden ones or cement so they could continue this practice when there were no Pineapples around or ripe , You get the picture. The Pineapple had become the Local symbol of hospitality that grew to larger than Local. Of course over the years the symbol has been watered down and the original reasoning all but forgotten by most except for some Treasure coast Peeps..So it was a Natural,, everywhere you went around here you'd see pineapples on top of a post, why not put a Tiki Underneath and meld the Aloha with the local Hospitality thing, YEA Wayne...
I hope this helps explain the Pineapple thing. I have yet to carve one but that doesn't mean I won't someday. :P :)

Carving Palms, what types are best, about curing and All that stuff.
Some Palms you think are Uncarvable:
........................................................
Queen and Royal or Cuban Royal also called Cement palm because it looks like a cement pole and the wood is about as hard, unfortunately the usable wood is only 3 to 4 inches on the outside with the inside all turning to Mush. Curing this involves getting a fresh log and cutting it to the size you want and Digging out all the stringy Pulp BEFORE it turns to rotten mush. IF that has happened, it's too late, chunk it all otherwise you have a Beautiful hollow shell useful for MANY types carving and the remaining wood will be very hard and FINE and will take a furniture finish. Just let your imagination take over ie, hollow tiki with plants and lighting,, Beautiful carves shelving and storage, with multiple sizes, tiki within a tiki within a tiki within a tiki ,with.....you get the picture. The related but smaller Queen palm, an exact twin, Both have beautiful smooth bark De barking NOT required
...............Coconut Palm, Many varieties.
When cured properly, the Absolute best carving wood among the Palms I think. The wood is Very hard and tough. Carves with chisels nicely and will accept Minute detail. The curing is the issue and I DON'T Know the best way. I've found them cured after dying remaining in the upright position for unknown times. I know if you cut one fresh it is usually not carvable for awhile and will turn to mush easily Maybe someone else knows that secret. Get some.
......Cabbage Palm, Sable palm, Florida State tree.
Again a few different varieties Very splintery, usually Firm but soft. Quick carve If you get it fresh grab the"Hearts-of-Palm" goodies near the top. Delicious and you can eat it ON the Spot for lunch then carve the tiki with that energy!
However The tree IS PROTECTED so careful with randomly eradicating them or else face hefty fines, there are Plenty landscape take-downs.
.............Washingtonian or Chinese Fan palm, Mexican fan palm, all the same tree basically. Same here as the west coast (Cal) they can get Huge and are Firm wooded trees that are Stable and carvable Fresh but better cured a few months.
There are MANY MANY More types of palms and Most all ARE Carveable in some manner or another but ALL Depend on the curing action taken or being lucky enough to find one ready to go Suggestion, Carry your chainsaw in the back seat and ALWAYS be on the lookout for felled trees of ANY Kind. STOP and grab a chunk to test out. If there is a crew cutting them down, ask for permission, explain your intentions, don't ask them to get it for you, they hate to let the boss see them wasting their time. Make friends and find their schedules.
This discussion could fill a book but my part will be short. I carved many years in Fort lauderdale to Boca area and NEVEZR once ran out of wood and in fact supplied wiood to several carvers who just couldn't manage to ever get much on their own. I Always had an abundance and was fairly free with it. I gave it away because It had cost me nothing but my time. in Most cases.
Now Get out there and Find that wood!!! :P :) :D

Don't forget the hardwoods. Mahogany, camphor, rosewood, mango, avacado... just to name a few (Benz can rattle off a few more, I'm sure).

Florida compared to SCal is naturally lush. Most of the wood that you get cut is full of water and needs to be dried/cured. Palm can be carved fresh but as it dries the wood may split or even rot. Wood rot in FL Palms is common because of the amount of water that gets trapped in the wood. I have cut dead palms, let them stand and watched puddles form when the water begins to drain. Sabal palm will be the most plentiful where you are moving. Be prepared to sweat and remember to stay hydrated.

Benzart and AlohaStation, thanks for the education. Thanks for taking the time to list such great detail. I'm sure that curing/drying the palms is a very critical step. The folks I have talked with seem to indicate that it doesn't really matter if the wood is vertical or horizontal, as long as it is off the ground to allow air flow over the entire piece. I can't wait to get my hands on some real tools and chunk of palm.

Things are getting closer for my move, 8wks or so and counting (but who's counting?).

Quote
"Has anyone here carved in SoCal and in Florida, or vice versa? Have you noticed a difference in the way you have to carve due to the humidity levels being so different? More cracking, less?"
I did some carving in SoCal a few days but several Months in Las Vegas where there is even less Humidity. As far as the wood, no difference, if a log is full of water and you open it up it will split no matter where you are and maybe even Less with less humidity because a log will have already lost much more of its water than in a humid condition. What it boils down to is this. If you carve a log before it is at least partially cured,, IT WILL Split Open. Now to confuse that a bit, Only SOME logs won't split at ALL. You can cut down a Norfolk Island Pine tree and carve it before it hits the ground and all you will get is covered with white, milky, sticky milky goop and No Cracks.. Ficus here will rarely split, in So Cal it will split. On Any number of palms it totally depends othe type of palm and what it's living conditions were when it went down. Did it die and stand for 2 years or is it a fresh "Landscape" take down, One of those might spplit and spit at you but it's possible both will not. it is Wacky. SO, Find a log and see how dry it is and try a small piece before going for broke. LikeChip&Andy said, there are Hundreds of carving trees down here and if you become friends with several tree trimmer companies you can get the lowdown quickly. IMPORTANT with these guys, Always Offer to do stuff for them, Help them and Never ask them to let their gus load you up. Offer to chop up some logs for them and O by the way can I roll a couple into my truck?? You'll have more wood than you can ever carve and you will be welcome in any of those trimmers yards. Be professional and they will be professional back.
When you get down here one of these days, don't hesitate to come on down and pick my brain all you want I still have a few things in there that make sense any more :)

I don't know how it is in your city, but up here, the city picks up logs and other 'green' debris from the curb twice a month. During the summer here, oak, pine, and palms can be routinely found just by driving around. Of course, during the winter, nice logs become scarce as they end up in fire pits.

well like i stated earlier on this post i moved away from Melbourne area... well I am moving back to Indialantic. we'll seek out tiki together!! lol