Post #191716 by louisebialik on Mon, Oct 10, 2005 11:04 PM

Thanks for this long and thoughtful expose on the history of Savage Republic. But before you go to print, I'd like to help you fine tune some of the facts. First off, it would really help if you would interview all the artists you've mentioned because things are skewed to the degree where one single member is depicted as the sole creative numena while others are lesser contributors, or worse, conniving.

So, let me help you get the record straight on a few items... and I qualify to speak because I was, for a brief time, a guest member of the band but did move on to the 17 Pygmies...

Here's my feedback...

On 2005-09-07 20:31, RevBambooBen wrote:
There is a very cinematic sounding quality throughout the work of the band and Bruce Licher's later band Scenic that seems ripe for plucking as soundtrack stuff. This is a musical direction that group leader Bruce Licher has claimed was intentional and that has been made use of before.

Sorry, but Bruce was not the band leader for Savage Republic, nor was Desi Arnez. Did Bruce really call himself the "leader"? If anything SR was/remains to be a collaborative effort and when ideas were presented that did not jive with a member or two, the majority voting would put the idea into action...

Like Kid, most of the players in Savage Republic were more interested in soundmaking than conventional technique.

That's because the band members were art students who painted and were not learned musicians... they became musicians over time, like 20 years, but in 1981, when they entered into "soundmaking" it was because they only new a few chords or rhythms, not because they were rejecting conventional technique.

To quote later member Thom F 'When I think of SR, I don't think of musicians. I think of soundmakers. I had only been playing bass one year when I joined SR (and it showed). Musicianship isn't everything. We all brought something different to the table and that's what makes SR special.'

That's more like it... see... at least Thom is honest!

Shortly after picking up the guitar, Bruce Licher now leader of Arizona's Scenic had joined the band Neef. Neef had decided to stick out a single following their friends the Urinals earlier record release.

Whoa whoa whoa, hold on, slow down, the timeline is way off by at least 15 years... Bruce formed Scenic AFTER Savage Republic had split, and this was around 1994ish with Jim Brenner and Brock... it was a trio and a couple years later they invited Loveless as a GUEST. So first, for Bruce, it was SR, then Neef, then Scenic.

Prior to the Africa Corps, Bruce had been exploring the tonalities of playing in the tunnels under UCLA leading to his aggregate crew being known as the Tunneltones.

The tunnels were Mark Erskine's discovery and hang out.

Bruce's ex Them Rhythm Ants bandmate Phil Drucker (at the time known as Jackson Del Rey) talked his way into playing along with them.

Phil "talked his way into the band" -- where the heck do you come up with this??? What source said "talked his way into the band" and why would a group want a bandmate who weasles his way into the group? What's that say about the group, that they are spineless, too?

Drucker was in contact with a 16 year old bassist named Jeff Long who was interested in learning to play experimentally and became involved in the project. As Bruce describes Long, "he was a bass prodigy and had already played with some heavy jazz players, loved Jaco Pastorius, and was starting to get into punk rock and looking to stretch out into new things. He was a friend of Phil's, and apparently they had played in some band previously, though I never got any details." These 4 would form the line up that would record the band's first LP Tragic Figures.

Okay, so Phil weasles his way into the group and brings in a central member who solidifies the sound, and Jeff is in, because like George Harrison as a teen, could play the freaking guitar while the other members were painters and not guitarists... so it was a smart move on Phil's doing to introduce Jeff to the group.

RE: Glen Branca -- All the way home all I could think of was "I've got to try tuning my guitar like that." And that's exactly what we did at the next SR (actually Africa Corps at that point) rehearsal I had gone and bought a bunch of B strings for my guitar and strung it all up with 6 B strings.'

the monotone guitar is an old cheat and works great for guys who can't play... if anything, seeing Branca helped give the band an idea on how to cheat and make a sound sound like it's going somewhere.

This is the same basic idea as behind the guitar credited on the first Velvet Underground LP as Ostrich guitar. This was also the predecessor to the instrument the band may well be best known for, the white 12 string Hagstrom guitar called the Monotone which is responsible for a lot of the more Eastern sounding textures on the bands' recordings. At the time, Bruce was using a cheap Fender Stratocaster copy, which was followed by another Strat, then came the Hagstrom because Bruce couldn't afford to go for a Rickenbacker. Up until he corrected me, I was convinced he was using a Gibson SG, possibly because I always link it to classic psychedelic era players. For a similar reason it would've been weird if he had got the Rickenbacker since it's the guitar always linked to the jangle of the Byrds.

that's strange... I gave Loveless a starburst Rickenbacker in 1986 which he sold a decade later... And yes, a real piece of equipment really brings out the talent of its player.

At that time, Bruce had also recently bought a copy of the Faust IV album. This was not the only krautrock influence on the band from the start; Bruce also cites both Popul Vuh and Amon Duul II. With Faust IV, Bruce was really taken with the sonic drone of the song "Krautrock," and played it for Phil, Jeff and Mark. 'I suggested we try something along those lines, so Jeff started up a simple, repetitive bass line, Phil & Mark got a gamelan-style percussion beat going on a metal rail and pipes, and I started droning on what became known as our "monotone" guitar.

The guys probably had Faust IV in their music collection before Bruce brought a copy over, but who cares, you make it sound like the guys were trying to emulate Faust-- how crazy is that??? That's like saying Einsterzende Neubauten emulated Savage Republic because they played Tragic Figures in their livingroom. From what I recollect about the jam sessions, really, all it was was a bunch of guys getting together and just beating drums and thrashing riffs until something was chiseled out of the extensive mantra, becoming a song, and that itself was a collaborative effort.

Tragic Figures was originally recorded under the band name Africa Corps. After it was recorded and the sleeve had been printed, Drucker announced that he was unhappy with the connotations of the band name. Bruce: 'when Phil laid down the ultimatum that we had to change our name or he would leave the band

This is what irritates me... Phil's not the kind of guy to throw his hands up in the air and say "I'm quitting if you guys don't chaneg the bands name." That's total Fantasy Island stuff. Look Boss, the plane, the plane!

" I remember thinking of the name "Savage Republic," during the brainstorming and almost saying something, then discarding the idea because it seemed "too obvious." Just like an art student to think he has to be more mysterious or obtuse or something. Then Phil said "what about Savage Republic?" It seems the name was hovering around in the ether that day, and we both sort of plucked it out, though Phil was the first to verbalize it. And it quickly became obvious that that was the right name for us.'

That is some pretty trippy word stretching... now Phil is a mind reader stealing Bruce's thoughts..? Funny! No way. Here's the real story... Phil came up with the new band name, "Savage Republic" just as he came up with "17 Pygmies." The reason for the 17 Pygmies title was because Phil was working in a museum and was counting artifacts that were to be paired, or a set of 9 married pygmy relics, but there were only 8 complete sets and one single pygmy, so he said to himself, "wow, 17 Pygmies, not 18" and while doing so, noted to himself that that would be a cool band name...

The name had been a problem before, with people approaching the band admiring Africa Corps' apparent Nazi connection, Drucker was Jewish so its appreciable that he wouldn't like such thought. // Bruce substituted an Islamic Crescent and Star for the original Nazi Swastika thus hopefully removing the original connotations.

The thing Phil didn't dig was the swastika and nazi punk sentiment, and being a good natured spirit told the group that those two items had to go because they were UNCOOL and UGLY. What band wants an association with White Supremacy? So if anything, Phil cleaned up SR's act and helped steer it toward a more wholesome direction and so capture the true sentiments of the members, being that they're peaceniks and not intolerant bastards. So I guess that's a pretty decent action coming from a guy who 'talked his way into the band.'

Drucker had asked fellow UCLA student Robert Loveless to join the band who therefore became a five piece (Loveless is currently working with Bruce Licher again as a member of Scenic).

OK, so the guy who talks his way into the band also continues to bring in new members?

This LP has remained difficult to get hold of for several years I thought this was due to legal considerations; Robert Loveless has told me that there was a limited reissue from Stray Dog records in Greece coupled with the Hatikvah EP sanctioned by Phil Drucker. I'll have to see about getting a copy since it's a record that I really would like to lay my hands on.

Which one, Viva, Missyfish or the bootlegs? Also, to clarify, the bootlegs occurred when we (17 Pygmies) sent our demo tape overseas and because there are no copyright laws there, we shot ourselves in the foot... then when the band had taken a long sabbatical, idiot rumors were circulating that a member had done the bootlegging when in fact he was just as in the dark as we were.

Well, this is about as much as I can get into commenting tonight... anyhow, nice enough job, just try to get ahold of other members and have a bigger picture so as to avoid putting good folks down. Thanks, Louise

[ Edited by: louisebialik 2005-10-12 13:21 ]