Post #586394 by bigbrotiki on Sun, Apr 24, 2011 11:00 PM

On 2011-04-24 09:57, arriano wrote:

What was the purpose of posting this?

The OED references the earliest found written references (books, newspapers, journals, etc.) of words and terms. Uses of such words and terms may have been earlier (verbally, commercial signs, etc.), but these are the earliest found written references by OED staff. And that's not to say there aren't written references out there that the staff hasn't found.

On 2011-04-24 14:32, JOHN-O wrote:
Hmmm... The use of "Tiki" as an adjective in the term "Tiki bar" would suggest a style of bar, no?
Are we saying that throughout the 1960's, there was no popular use of term "Tiki bar" ??
Arriano's dictionary post would seem to support that.

Hokeh, time to take a deep breath, bigbro. I have to sincerely apologize to Arriano and John-O for my previous page reactions to their above posts. Me always being the one who begs "we must differentiate, folks!", here I go just BARRELING through with blinders on and belligerently wiping all other arguments off the slate, completely fulfilling the German demagogue cliche that my critics have of me, and betraying my friends who see me as a reasonable, rational human being. Unforgivable and embarrassing!

I must admit to having been irritated recently by posts that in my mind smart-assedly bring up exemptions to a rule that just confuse and weaken the issue at hand, thus being de-constructive instead of helpful and enlightening, like John-O's recent Bacardi post for example. Objectively viewed, Arriano's Oxford Dictionary quote was not entirely in that vein, though. It was a fair response to my over-simplified statements with which I SEEMED to be saying that the word "Tiki" DID NOT EXIST as a label in its heyday.

I am sorry if it sounded that way, but I did not aim to deny the term's complete existence by saying:
"In its own heyday, Tiki style was not named "Tiki", this term for the genre was created in the 90s."
"So, Tiki was not recognized as a style in its own day, and consequently did not have a name."
"All this brings up the question of WHEN the name of the style was coined."

I was talking about the use of the word as a label for the WHOLE pop culture GENRE, as a term for the decor, art and architectural STYLE. Please allow me to differentiate, even if too late, in the case of:

Trader Vic's "Tiki punch": a single name for a drink, not significant enough to name a style

1963 Times and 1975 Times: "Tiki torch" was a brand name and a popular descriptive. What came first? Dunno. Did it describe a whole style? No.

1981 B. Granger Schism and 1985 Smithsonian: "Tiki Bars" Aaaah! A name for a certain type of bar! I stand corrected - to some degree:

In the 80s, writers were already looking in retrospect - and it still does not show the word's use for the whole genre: One thing I know for sure is that there were no "Tiki Restaurants", no "Tiki Motels", no "Tiki Apartment buildings", no "Tiki Bowling Alleys", and certainly no "Tiki Cocktails" in common use in the popular language of the 1960s, 70s and 80s.

John-O, do find the use of "Tiki Bar" for me in the 60s, and you can call me a liar. :) And again: Single exceptions do not affect the rule!:

[ Edited by: bigbrotiki 2011-04-24 23:07 ]