Post #758404 by tiki mick on Thu, Feb 4, 2016 1:02 PM

I hesitate to post this, because certain people on this forum basically made me feel no longer welcome, but since it has the bearing on the subject of people defecting to FB instead of here, I will go ahead and add my two cents:
The problem with tiki central (and any forum, really) is that there is and always has been a “herd mentality”. If you don’t share the same feelings and opinions as the majority you are made to feel unwelcome.

Take my own case, for example. I started posting in 2003 (under username Tiki Mick) and started right away with the same opinionated comments I also make around my own friends on facebook and in person.
Instantly, I was judged as being negative. People automatically assumed I had some sort of malicious intent. But my motivation was strictly to find “like minds” to converse with, and I was surprised that there were none! I admit, it took me over 11 years or so to finally figure it out, which is also why I stopped posting.
For me, I am a bit of a tiki purist, especially when it comes to the music aspect of it. I was constantly amazed at what I found on this forum: People very strictly into authentic mugs and tiki bars, but absolutely not liking Hawaiian music and probably not even really liking exotica. Post after post showed people would be adamant about using the exact ingredients used in a Trader Vic’s 1950’s era Mai-Tai, and then would poo-poo the type of music trader Vic himself probably listened to.

Garage rock, punk, surf. These are the most popular types of music I found that people like on this forum.
As I always considered Tiki to be an offshoot of cocktail lounge culture, NOT low-brow custom care culture, I often clashed with far too many people here. The tiki world tilts very heavily towards Low-Brow/hot rod culture.

So when, for example, I posted about not liking the beatles, it was NOT to stir the pot. I was generally surprised to find my posts ridiculed, since to me 1964 was a turning point in cocktail culture. Out with the old, in with the new and don’t trust anyone over 30. I honestly expected to find a larger amount of people that also liked everything before 1964, before rock, before garage and surf. People who understood the difference between youth culture and the Eisenhower generation.
I felt that everything I was arguing was also contained in the Book of Tiki. The iconic image In Sven’s book of the cocktail party, the midcentury people wearing Hawaiian shirts and eating pupus, who had probably spent the day working at the mad men advertising agency, was something I thought was very cool.
Turns out, a large amount of tiki people reject that iconography in favor of punk /tatts/garage rock/hot rod imagery.
I saw tiki central every day moving farther away from what I thought was tiki.

So, as regards facebook, I think everything seeks its own level. FB allows me to converse with the few like- minded individuals I first met here, without the butthurt. They know who they are.

As regards unfriendly posters chasing newbies away, one thing people need to understand: I went back and looked at some of my more combative posts from the old days. I found that there were other combative people who were also very negative, and argumentative, and opinionated calling ME a troll. Isn’t that a case of the kettle calling the pot black? Time and time again, the same names would come up. And the people I was tangling with were people that in many cases I had never met in person, but who were totally rude and unpleasant to me as though I had fucked their sister, instead of just arguing whether the grateful dead is tiki or not. It was that level of animosity that drove me away, and probably drives others away.

So when someone like “swizzle” calls ATP or myself a troll, maybe he should look at his own disruptive behavior. I never even met Swizzle! For all I know, he could be a great guy in person but I will never know. That is something to consider.

Bay park Buzzy and Grog both asked me to leave this forum. Bay park Buzzy. Never even met the guy! Don’t know why my opinions meant so much to him! Grog? I thought we were cool. When he was having his health issues, I was genuinely worried and concerned, and sent positive thoughts out for him. Yet my posts about the Beatles were enough to make him tell me to leave.

In a nutshell, different opinions are ok. We should not be chasing people away because you don’t agree with them. Look at the end result: One less tiki central member. Hate me or love me, I was a steady contributor since the old days. And when I was not telling you why the beatles sucked, I was posting funny crap (at least funny to me) and informative stuff about music that many people probably were not aware of. I was supporting other bands and other artists with positive comments. I did my own urban archeology. I discussed forgotten theme parks. I contributed my fair share. And by chasing me away, you lost a lot of that.
So now, I stay on facebook because if I post something, only people who like me talk about it with me. That’s the advantage, but it is a closed off world. And, I don’t want to see tiki central ever disappear. I freaking love this forum, and I love tiki. And I learned a lot about stuff I did not know about it.

It’s really simple. If you want this forum to continue, just learn to ignore the posts you don’t agree with, and move on. Spirited conversation is perfectly fine. Even negative critiques of things are fine. Being exclusive, rude, cold and clique-ish is not.

[ Edited by: lucas vigor 2016-02-04 13:04 ]