Punk Rock, the way it was meant to be....

Just to let you know, one of the key bands from the early '80s So Cal Punk scene is back together and will be on tour this week...Shattered Faith is kicking off the tour at the El Rey in L.A. tonight. They'll be heading up to the Bay Area, Phoenix, San Diego, etc.....so check 'em out. More info @ http://www.shatteredfaith.us

OK, I checked out the link and am forced to ask:

Does "Punk Rock, the way it was meant to be" include a commercial website, T-Shirt and skateborad sales, and links to other commercial sites?

You raise a great point, though.

What is Punk Rock the way it was meant to be?

I gotta ponder that myself before I can take a stab at it!

Edit: By the way, Bartiki looks great!

[ Edited by: Geeky Tiki on 2004-07-22 10:35 ]

Duane Peters is about as close to punk rock as you get.Or check out http://www.nofrontteeth.co.uk/ Its not your usual skate punk stuff

I am at a loss. I've been writing about punk rock for over 15 years and I thought I knew every band from the SoCal punk/hardcore scene, but I have never hear of Shattered Faith. All Music Guide doesn't even have a listing for them.

So is this a conspiracy? Who really is this Shattered Faith?

This is pretty much unconnected, but I had a pint the other night with the bassist from the UK Subs. He was wearing a Tiki shirt at the time and lives a few streets away from me.

Trader Woody

I've never heard of Shattered Faith either. Any band that puts "Original Punk Rock" on their slick web site would make me skeptical about them.

This Saturday Nikki and the Corvettes (70's Ramones-like girl band) are playing at the Parkside (in SF). And the Lurkers are playing in August with Mad Parade.

Some good bands I've seen recently: The Girls (Seattle), The Briefs (Portland?), Marked Men (Texas), and the return of the Morlocks (great 80s group). None of whom claim to be punk!

[ Edited by: thejab on 2004-07-22 12:16 ]

On 2004-07-22 12:09, thejab wrote:
I've never heard of Shattered Faith either. But I'm willing to check 'em out.

This Saturday Nikki and the Corvettes (70's Ramones-like girl band) are playing at the Parkside (in SF). And the Lurkers are playing in August with Mad Parade.

Recent good bands I've seen: The Girls (Seattle), The Briefs (Portland?), Marked Men (Texas), and the return of the Morlocks (great 80s garage-punk group).

Try checking out SLA if they play near you. They're out of Sacramento.

[ Edited by: TikiGardener on 2004-07-22 12:15 ]

On 2004-07-22 12:14, TikiGardener wrote:

Try checking out SLA if they play near you. They're out of Sacramento.

[ Edited by: TikiGardener on 2004-07-22 12:15 ]

TG- thanks for the tip. I'm seeing them in August at this!:
http://www.theoldironsides.com/wastedweekend.html

X is now in their summer concert tour!
Another great punk band.

August 21, 2004
Belly Up
Solana Beach CA

August 22, 2004
24th Annual Sunset Junction Street Fair
Los Angeles CA

November 26, 2004
November 27, 2004
House Of Blues
West Hollywood CA

Later Date:
April 1, 2005
UCLA Royce Hall
Los Angeles CA

New Yorkers, don't miss the Weirdos (original 70s LA band) this Friday the 23rd. at the Southpaw! I saw them in Deecember and they were phenomenal. And Saturday it's the only appearance of The Kids (70s Belgian punk band) ever in the US!! Wish I could go. :(

[ Edited by: thejab on 2004-07-22 12:57 ]

Back in 1981 my band (Civil Disobediance, which nobody has ever heard of either) was on a compilation album with Shattered Faith who were much more established and popular around Orange County. Also on the record was a band Called Political Crap which was Duane Peters first band. Ohyeah, the name of the record was a very punk WHO CARES on American Standard Recorrds. Long out of print.

I've heard of Shattered Faith. I might even have seen'em, maybe at the Olympic Auditorium? Either that or opening for someone at the Hollywood Palladium.

I totally remember shattered Faith! Great band!

Anyone remember the Swamp Zombies? The Bell Jars?

There are some modern punk bands from the bay area that don't have that modern punk sound...if anyone is interested!!

Subincision (my brother's band)
AFI
The Winona Ryders
Diesel Queens
White Trash Debutantes

Just to set the record straight: Shattered Faith was formed in the late 70s in O.C. along with the likes of Middle Class, TSOL, Adolecents, etc. They've played over the years with the above bands plus Bad Religion, CH3, The Vandals and countless others. They would open for the Cramps in the early 80's on a regular basis. Bands such as Offspring and Stone Temple Pilots have even opened for them (Shattered Faith). As far as the "commercial website, t-shirts and skateboards" - name me a band that doesn't sell merch and I'll show you a bunch of guys that are broke...even back 20 years ago, every punk band was slingin' merch to try and make a buck, so the comment obviously stems from a misconception (even Fugazi sells merch!). By the way, the baseplayer does the "commercial" website, so it doesn't cost 'em anything! It's a shame some people that claim they're "punk" don't know their history. Oh, all the links on the SF website are to friends and supporters sites.
Sorry for the rant, just a fan, and I hope I don't offend.
Hey Geeky Tiki - Glad you like the site!

Mugs, vintage, bars, hand carved poles, apparel and more!
Everything Tiki at: http://www.bartiki.com

[ Edited by: Tiki Matt on 2004-07-22 17:54 ]

[ Edited by: Tiki Matt on 2004-07-22 17:56 ]

[ Edited by: Tiki Matt on 2004-07-22 17:57 ]

On 2004-07-22 17:52, Tiki Matt wrote:
Just to set the record straight: Shattered Faith was formed in the late 70s in O.C. along with the likes of Middle Class, TSOL, Adolecents, etc.

I guess it's my CRS (can't remember s$@#) acting up! I saw all the other O.C. bands you mentioned, but I just don't remember seeing or hearing Shattered Faith. Perhaps they started becoming well known when I stopped going to most punk shows because of the excessive violence that started happening at shows around 1980-1981.

For those like me who can't make it to the Weirdos and Kids shows in New York, both bands will be doing live sets on WFMU. The shows get archived online at http://wfmu.org - some other bands on the bills will
be on the air too:

Thurs 7/22 - THE SPITS live on Music to Spazz By w/
Dave the Spazz, 8-11PM (Spits probably one betw 8-9PM)

Thurs 7/22 - THE WEIRDOS on Pat Duncan's show,
11PM-2AM (Weirdos probably on around 11PM)

Sat 7/24 - THE KIDS, TAXI (along w/ CLOROX GIRLS) live
on Cherry Blossom Clin w/ Terre T - 3PM-6PM

Subincision (my brother's band)

Subincision rocked! I saw them at the anti-club a while ago and loved their set. Time to pull out their 45 and look for a website...

BTW (and I may catch shit for this, but I really don't care) Shattered Faith is mentioned on a NOFX song off of their "fuck the kids" ep called "Reagan Sucks".

Punk Lives! The "Nest" was the best!!!

Posuers!!!!!!! Arrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!

Ben! I'm glad they've let you out to play. I'd be careful who you accuse of being a Poseur... Wasn't the Nest in Costa Mesa? That was the place for OC punks who's Mamas wouldn't let them go to LA with the Big Boys, right?

Arrrrrrrrrr!!

On 2004-07-22 13:21, freddiefreelance wrote:
I've heard of Shattered Faith. I might even have seen'em, maybe at the Olympic Auditorium? Either that or opening for someone at the Hollywood Palladium.

Olympic Auditorium and the Palladium? Dude. That's when L.A. Punk "sold out" to big venues.

Starwood, Whiskey, Madam Wongs, Vex, 7 Seas,Florentine Gardens,etc.

I can use the word posuer. I started when I was 14 and am now 40. Nuff said. Back to my hole in the ground. L8!

e-mail me if you want to talk about the past.

Good to hear from you Ben. I'm glad you're busy, but I know that you're missed around here.

I'll agree (partly) with the large venue/sell out point, I'd prefer to see a band in the AntiClub or Wong's, but it was the same people promoting bands in Perkin's Palace or Florentine Gardens as in Palladium or Fender's.

I'll email you later & we can complain about how old we are & how the bands suck nowadays...

Ben and freddie...you old so cal punk rockers...all I have to say to y'all is:

This is Boston, Not LA

On 2004-07-22 18:49, thejab wrote:

Thurs 7/22 - THE WEIRDOS on Pat Duncan's shows

DESTROY ALL MUSIC...we just can't use it!

Just back from our tour with The Partisans and surprised to find this thread on Tikicentral.com. Thought I would 'chime in' a little.

Thanks for the backhanded compliment on the 'commercial' web site. For the record, I personally built the site (I'm the bass player) and it is my first & only site. I got so tired of being jerked around by money grubbing whores, I decided to endure the pain and create the site myself (for free - it took me 2 friggin' months!). Please take a look at the site, I welcome constructive criticism.

Bobby T
[email protected]
http://www.shatteredfaith.us

p.s. for the record, we sell nothing on our site, the skateboards are sold by teamgoon (direct link).

p.s.s. our guitar player is Kerry Martinez of the U.S. Bombs. We have all known Duane Peters (since the 70's). Ya ought to pick up a pair of his skate shoes - they kick ass!

Polynesiac, I don't know wether subincision has a web site or not...probably, because they are a signed band....

But I will see my brother exactly one week from now...

I don't like punk anymore (when I did, it was bands like shattered faith, tsol, fear..ect...the REAL shit!)

The punk bands of today like "new found glory" and blink 182, basically sound like "journey" on speed...happy melodies!!!Punk should not be happy, but it should very much be the soundtrack for urban decay, disenfranchised youth, and a reaction to the corporate world!!

Listen to "rise above" by black flag, to hear what punk used to sound like!@!

My bro's band has happy songs too, but we both grew up together in OC, early 80's..and listened to everything that was happening!

Anyone remember 45 grave?

Anyone remember when S.D. used to practice at the Church in Foolerton???

I loved 45 Grave....haven't thought about them in years.

Anyone remember Goodies in Fullerton. In conservative infested North O.C., Goodies was a cool place to see bands...and they had huge beers (that were also cheap). I'm pretty sure Mai Tais weren't on the menu (though I could be mistaken!).

On 2004-08-04 17:31, tiki mick wrote:

I don't like punk anymore (when I did, it was bands like shattered faith, tsol, fear..ect...the REAL shit!)

Punk should not be happy, but it should very much be the soundtrack for urban decay, disenfranchised youth, and a reaction to the corporate world!!

Hola,

I must respectfully disagree.

I always saw punk rock as a reaction to the bloated beast that popular music had become.

Punk seemed more interested in making things simple again, but it was still song based - verse, chorus, verse, chorus, verse, chorus chorus - or something like that. No different than pop music before it.

Punk also had a more DIY kinda thing. No symphonic orchestra required for a group to bang out what they wanted to say.

I always thought that punk had very positive underpinnings, pointing out what was wrong. It was political and straightforward.

Heck, you could dance to The Ramones and The Clash, even the Sex Pistols. :)

Weird how the Sex Pistols were really just an invention of a corporate/style genius, but anyway...

Punk was pissed off about where things were socially at the time, but didn't seem as 'fuck-all' as you describe.

I get more of a Goth/Speed metal kinda feel from your take on punk.

I just don't picture punk in its day as including white face make-up and Rocky Horror wardrobes. More like greasy hair and black 50's style motorcycle stuff, if anything.

Then again, The New York Dolls seem kinda proto-punk and they certainly had fetish style clothes.

Actually, the more I think about it, there was plenty of costuming in the punk era...it just struck me as a movement with more of an "anti" look more than a consistent fashion.

That's a tough one.

Anyway, I agree that Blink 182 and Green Day style punk doesn't seem to fit the vibe.

Maybe Rancid? Bob Mould?

It's hard to come up with good current examples that get any kind of airplay.

Punk seems more vital at the subculture level than mainstream, anyway. Which is the best way, eh?

Yeah Dinah Cancer rocked! I believe they had an off-shoot band called vox-pop?

The guy in their liked to pull out pubic hair with plyers on stage! Nice!

I have been in many, many bands, (like my brother) and we both played at goodies more times then I can remember, although the bands I was in are hardly memorable!

I also played at what goodies turned into: Club 369.....one time, I was playing in a lesbo-punk band (I was the only guy in the band) and Gabby from cadillac Tramps walked up to the stage and handed me a shot of tequila! But he had changed the band's name to "drive by smile" at that point. Nice guy...big scary looking guy too!

I also once left my bass propped up against the outside wall overnight, and drove all the way back to "foolerton" the next morning, and the thing was still there!

On 2004-08-05 11:08, Geeky Tiki wrote:

It's hard to come up with good current examples that get any kind of airplay.

Punk seems more vital at the subculture level than mainstream, anyway. Which is the best way, eh?

I agree with your opinions completely Geekytiki. The best thing about 70s punk was/is that it brought the fun back in rock 'n roll after bands like the Beatles (after Sgt. Pepper) and the Eagles took all the fun out of it. The political message was important too, but the humor was always there.

The best current bands don't get mainstream airplay, but do get exposure on internet radio and some independent radio stations. And I would bet there are more independent labels now than there were in the 80s. Rock n' roll is thriving and there are no signs of it going away. Like it did back in 1980 it just takes a little digging to find the good stuff.

Sure, many of the new bands are often imitating the 70s bands, but the 70s punk groups were a derivitive of 60s garage/punk groups.

Well, I agree and disagree......

I was 16 in 1979..Punk was current chronologically, but people were already saying "punk is dead"

There were bands that I considered to be punk at the time, that actually were the forunners of goth....

Christian Death, catholic discipline, 45 grave, the cramps..etc....

Remember, i was 16 at the time...all the different genres were not so evident back then.....Frankly, to me there was prog/70's rock, disco, and punk/new wave....three things!

I just yesterday listened to one band that crossed those lines, even on one album....I am talking the first Pretenders album...first track is very new york dolls-ish..and then they do a straight out pop hit "brass in pocket"

Spandau Ballet started out as a new wave, then mutated into blue-eyed soul....

I guess my point was that the current "punk bands" (with the exception of Rancid, who I watched play at Cloyne court, a berkeley co-opt about 10 years ago) are bands that are to me, as corporate sounding as say, Journey!!

If you take the chords they play, and do it on an electric piano instead, you will find standard musically correct songs! And that is not supposed to be punk!

Punk should be for amateurs,by amatuers and I never knew a punker who was a happy person on the outside....greasy hair, monochromatic clothing....yeah, we wore that kind of stuff back then...(I had my head shaved in '79, long before it was vogue)!Punkers I knew did have the "fuck all" attitude, cause if they didn't, they got there asses beat by the jocks!! A lot of my friends were obssessed with decay and death, destruction and anarchy..that was what punk meant to us! Nowadays, that kind of sentiment seems to be the exclusive domain of the goths.

The movie "suburbia" exactly captures the essense of punk rock culture..so does the movie "decline" and if you think Darby Crash was anything like today's crop of punker poster boys, you are way off!! half of today's dudes wore LONG HAIR back 90's, and listened to GNR!!!!

And for the record, I never, ever listened to speed metal!!!!!!

Unfortunatly, (and here a lot of SoCal people will get mad at me) it is bands like Dramarama and bad religion and sublime, that have most influenced today's crop..and my opinion is that those bands are basically melodic rock bands with short haircuts and hessian tattoos...with slightly faster tempos!

If I'm lyin I'm dyin!!!!

You all have good points, but how do you define "punk"? Is it an attitude, lifestyle, music, fashion, etc? I'm not sure.

If it's an attitude (as is the popular opinion), then I guess our founding fathers were the godfathers of punk. Were anti-establishment hippies punks? What about Elvis, Johnny Cash, Chuck Berry - Punks?

I guess the punk thing to say is that music today isn't punk, I disagree (am I being punk?) There's plenty of bands out there that are playing for the love of music, are unsigned, and actually have something to say. Don't ask me who they are, I only listen to sports radio (does that make me punk?).

Anyway, I hear a lot about bands that sell out and how that makes them un-punk - Isn't Rancid on a major label? Was the Clash on a major? What about the Sex Pistols?
If Green Day or Blink 182 were unsigned and you saw them in a little club, would you think they were punk? I'm not saying they are or aren't, just trying to put a different spin on it. Don't blame the band for being signed and getting popular.

In my opinion you should listen to what you like, regardless of genre (hell, I even liked TSOLs 'Beneath the Shadows').

If you're in the L.A. area, do yourself a favor and listen to Steve Jones' show on indie 103.

Decide for yourself. Shattered Faith is playing 2 shows this weekend (with the original guitar Kerry Martinez - now with US Bombs & Bad Luck Charm).

10/1/04 at Fitzgeralds in Huntington Beach,m Ca with The Crowd

10/2/04 at The Galaxy in Santa Ana, ca with El Centro & Deadbolt.

http://www.shatteredfaith.us
(for more info)

Awesome! I will try to make it out there!!

As far as what Punk Rock is I'd say that the sum is larger than the parts. Punk Rock WAS, and I stress WAS, a movement that involved music, and attitude. As Dee Dee Ramone wrote in his biography 'Labotomy', rock music is not a 'civilized art form'. It came from and was invented by social outcasts. As somebody mentioned in an earlier post, the film 'Decline of Westen Civilization' is a great example of the punk culture. That culture DOES NOT exist anymore regardless of what anybody says. Just like all the wanna be hippies that go to see The Dead these days (without Jerry Garcia). Hello! Hippie days are OVER and have been over for a good 30 years now. People can call themselves whatever they want, but the times we live in do not involve or forward the unadulterated forms of these cultures.

For the most part both of these movements were a reaction to the previous generations who were mostly baffled by what their kids were up to. The older generation now is the boomers that were hippies back in the day. They've sat through the counter-cultural movie, and they're not going to be so shocked by what kids do for escapism now. I see alot of displaced/misdirected youth hanging around the East Village, tatooed and pierced and looking like they're one of the members of Rancid. For lack of a better term I call them 'Squatters'. They literally have no place to go because culturally speaking there aren't rock clubs and shows, and things of that nature where they can be with their people. They're just hanging around, self conciously involved in their own escapist fantasy. I'm sure some of them honestly come from broken homes, etc. but I think for most it's just a put on.

Now, are Blink-182 or Good Charlotte or Simple Plan punk rock? No fuckin' way!!
Anybody who has a trailer backstage at the MTV Music Awards is NOT, NOT, NOT Punk. And I'll bet good money these guys have their catered little trailers at all the TV shows they play on. Their music is at best rooted in the punk sound, but these guys are as Punk as the Pope is Jewish. Another major offender is the god-awful Avril Lavigne. She, and all of these bands I mentioned basically picked up a copy of 'Punk Rock for Dummies' read it back to front and are now laughing all the way to the bank!

(ya heard?)

Anybody who has a trailer backstage at the MTV Music Awards is NOT, NOT, NOT Punk.

...any band that has a "stylist" and a clothing sponsor also is not punk. Mascara and eyeliner, spiky gel and black clothing with zippers do not make you "punk".

Amen to the last few posts! Y'all definitely get it!!

CODE BLUE!!

it seems the eyeliner and mascara is back Mike Ness has gone back to that look . Seeing SD in 2 weeks in Philly . Trying to see the Cramps the week before , they have always rocked . Has anyone seen the concert video now on dvd of them playing a state mental hospital in the 70's it's a classic with all the patients just wondering around some even dancing hahahaha

"that stupid punk rock!"

On 2004-10-01 20:23, Mai Tai Matty wrote:
Has anyone seen the concert video now on dvd of them playing a state mental hospital in the 70's it's a classic with all the patients just wondering around some even dancing hahahaha

I had (have?) that on a video bootleg. I haven't seen it in probably 15 years. Thanks for bringing it up, I'll have to try and find it. Truly a classic!

they sell it at Borders bookstore , it seems everything is marketable these days

Yeah, for that Cramps show, the audience was truly captivated...

...any band that has a "stylist" and a clothing sponsor also is not punk.

The Damned are/were sponsored by Hurley and Vivien Westwood was the stylist for the Sex Pistols

[ Edited by: cheekytiki on 2004-10-03 05:32 ]

alittle news for anyone into the oldies FANG yes I said FANG is playing in Delaware on Oct 30 and in Philly the 31st. It's been along time for them after all slamming sammy is out and has been for awhile(out of jail for that silly little murder he did way back when) .They are a classic punk band

punk rock the way it was meant to be
is the clash and the ramones!

On 2004-07-22 13:19, Nui Nui 2 wrote:
Back in 1981 my band (Civil Disobediance, which nobody has ever heard of either) was on a compilation album with Shattered Faith who were much more established and popular around Orange County. Also on the record was a band Called Political Crap which was Duane Peters first band. Ohyeah, the name of the record was a very punk WHO CARES on American Standard Recorrds. Long out of print.

My first EP was on "American Standard Records", never saw a penny
I have known Duane Peters since he was a tadpole running around Newport in the 70s,he has done good for himself last decade or so.

Didn't Civil Disobediance play Radio City gigs,I have a faint memory of them opening for us at a Radio City gig?
It sounds like most of the other posters on this thread where second generation punks from their remarks?

Reading some of the earlier posts on this old thread made me laugh. How could you not know about Shattered Faith if you are into punk rock? I mean I guess they were sort of regional, but they are not some obscure one 45 band.
I think I went to that show mentioned in the first post. They were great and I think Smogtown opened up for them in the Bay area. Spencer also later did vocals for the Pushers and the Main, both released on my favorite Hostage Records.