What to do with people who have no taste?

I have had these experiences way too often:

A) I pour a friend a bit of my vintage Appleton 20 Year old rum, explaining how rare and fantastic it is, and they take the shot glass and throw it back so that it passes their tongue completely and goes straight to their stomach!

B) I mix up the most perfectly balanced classic Rum Barrel using fresh squeezed juices, fine rums and homemade Falernum and other syrups. I make a really great Navy Grog. I offer them a wonderful Rum Julep. Then I get tired and someone else gets back there and makes the equivalent of Hawaiian Punch, pineapple juice and vodka and they all go ape-shit and think it is the best drink of them all!

What to do? Casting pearls before swine is a tremendous waste of quality rum! Do I make a batch of "Hawaiian Paradise" for them and let them swill that all night while I make real cocktails? I mean, if they prefer that, why would they mind right?

Mixing craft cocktails for people who would prefer something with the word "Bomb" or "Sex" in the title is disheartening to me as a bartender. It makes me angry at them and it wastes my time and resources. But they are my friends and I will have them over.

What do you guys do?

I discovered long ago that most people like the fancy drinks, but nonetheless seem most highly satisfied by tequila thrown in with a pour from the jug of Cuervo Margarita mix.

I'm always reminded of the "Are you chewing gum?!" scene from "Sideways:"

http://www.videodetective.com/movies/sideways-scene-are-you-chewing-gum-/882957

I've vowed to never make Tiki drinks for more than 4 people, tops, as it is a huge pain in the ass and not personally rewarding (usually).

I occasionally have the same issue - I want to make something beautifully balanced and fresh, and some of my party guests find it "not sweet enough" or "weird" (!) or whatever. So I'm now in the habit of having something mid-range and "accessible" for them (think Blue Hawaiians, etc), and a couple of more sophisticated cocktails for the more adventurous and well-versed folks.

Making top-notch drinks for people who are happy with Appleby's-style crap is always going to be a) annoying to you and b) wasteful of your good booze. I think you answered your own questions when you said "Do I make a batch of "Hawaiian Paradise" for them and let them swill that all night while I make real cocktails?"

Yes. That's just what you do. And you can still make good cocktails for them to "swill" - just don't use your most convoluted recipes or top-shelf rum. Use a nice-quality carton of juice instead of giving yourself Carpal Tunnel hand-squeezing grapefruits or whatever. A good solid recipe with mid-range liquor will be fine. I'm guessing after a while you get to know who among your guests might like something a bit more sophisticated, and you can go to town on cocktails for them. Trying to shoehorn good liquor into unwilling palates is a futile waste for everyone.

Look at this way: If all your friends loved your handcrafted cocktails, you'd go broke pretty quickly. Be happy in the knowledge that the good stuff goes to people who recognize and prefer quality, and everyone else is fine with fruit loop concoctions.

S'funny... I've noticed the same thing about quality cigars. It got to the point where if I want to have something to pass around to friends I'll get something cheaper and lighter-weight so that I don't feel that I've wasted the good stuff on 'em.

I'm having my first Tiki party with me making real beverages this weekend, so I'm curious about what it'll be like. Of course, I'm LOVING all of these vintage drinks with their perfect proportions of sweetness, sting, mellowness, spice, etc., but I do wonder if guests will enjoy them as much as I do. If folks would rather something less complex and more sweet, I guess I'll have to concede and console myself with the fact that I'll get to enjoy the good stuff on my own.

Ultimately, in throwing a party I want my guests to have fun, no matter what form of imbibing they want to do, but I admit I will be disappointed if folks don't dig the stuff I've practiced slinging, and that I hold in such high regard...

On 2012-07-26 08:44, Kill Devil wrote:
I've vowed to never make Tiki drinks for more than 4 people, tops, as it is a huge pain in the ass and not personally rewarding (usually).

I agree with that. We seek to limit it to 2-3 people over as guests. That allows for talking and enjoying, and not just churning out drinks and people being annoyed at the pace instead of floored at the quality.

Basic rules of being a host apply in situations like this.... you should make your guests comfortable and focus on making the evening as pleasant for everyone as possible.

If you are entertaining a few people (3 to 5) then you can make a show of making a fancy drink our pouring some top-shelf or rare thing. You can talk story about what you pouring and why.

If you are entertaining a small group (3 to 10) then you can't spend as much time focusing on what your pouring so it is probably a good idea to keep it simple. Have something that will make the most amount of people happy and then 'get fancy' when asked or when the time is right.

If you are entertaining a large group (10 or more) then you are hosting a completely different kind of party and shouldn't spend any amount of time behind the bar because that is time spent away from your guests and as the host it is your responsibility to make sure you get to spend as much time as you can with each of them. It is usually a good idea to put your best booze out of reach for large parties so the guest who ventures behind your bar doesn't start pouring shots out of the lemon hart bottle with the teeny-tiny little red triangle on the label .

Basically it comes down to what makes your guests happy.... If you guests are happy with the mixer-and-a-shot drinks then line up the shot glasses and get to pouring.

Fortunately, I haven't had that happen... yet. I agree with some of the other comments and your own example of making "Hawaiian Paradise" for those who don't really appreciate the more intricate drinks. If you know they don't have the palate for the finer drinks then have something already prepared "just for them". You might even make them feel special in the process. :wink:
I guess you just have to go slowly until you figure out whether their tastes will warrant the good stuff or not.

This is a bit off topic, but I am having a similar problem where family or friends are now buying me tiki decor. I politely accept and thank them, but it is all cheesy brightly colored schmaltz (that's a fun word!) from Big Lots or some other discount store. What in the world am I gonna do with these things and how do I make them stop? One is from my son and daughter, one from my sister and one from a friend. They were all quite pleased with themselves that they had found me something "Tiki" and I don't want to hurt their feelings because it was a very nice gesture, but now I don't know how to deal with it.

On a side note... The rums you let me taste at The Hideaway were outta sight! I really enjoyed that.

Cheers!

David

One of sour, two of sweet, three of strong and four of weak.

[ Edited by: Q-tiki 2012-07-26 10:38 ]

You take your tiki bottle opener...
and open 'em a beer. Or a Seagrams Ice.

Most people just don't have the palate to appreciate a complex cocktail
I make a pretty classic Mai Tai, But many think it to strong or tart

So when having a party I mix batches of "Tropical Mai Tai's" the fruit juice based version
you get in Hawaii or a batch of my Kraken Killers, Sweet drinks do appease the crowds

I save the proper Cocktails for my friends who appreciate it.

[ Edited by: Atomic Tiki Punk 2012-07-26 12:24 ]

I agree. So I usually do drinks depending on who's visiting too. I'll work hard on the cocktails when I know they'll be appreciated for what they are. When the crowd is not receptive of don't care, I mix rum and pineapple with a little float, or do ti punch (white agricole is way cheaper here).

(or beers, but I have the same problem when I take out my finest belgians and people drinks it like its heineken)

best reception i've gotten to a tiki drink at parties is the scorpion bowl.

everybody always loves the scorpion, especially drinking it out of communal bowls with straws...

I can’t imagine serving my friends anything other than what I personally drink. If I had to stock liquor and additional ingredients of a lesser quality, I would need an entire additional bar.
My guest all having the same quality of drink allows me to have a better understanding of how they perceive the drink.
If I am three hours into a party and find myself in a conversation about the Jet Pilot, I don’t want to be thinking “are they drinking the good one, or cheap one?”
I have found that what a “tiki” drink is served in has a big influence on a guest perception of a drink, served in a solo cup…pretty good, in a unique tiki mug…damn good, in a hollowed out pineapple with all the bling hanging off the side…off the freaking charts! I say hollow out some pineapples, pour the good stuff, and party on! When it comes to your friends, go all in. Anything less is……well, less.

And hey I like Heineken!

You have to quit trying to change people. I have my craft cocktail friends who I geek out with (admittedly I have Smuggler's Cove nearby so I can get this out of my system). And then I know folks who just want to get drunk. They get the Meyers and beer. You need to separate your groups not try to mash them up. Trying to expose your non tiki friends to tiki stuff when they do not express much interest will just lead to gifts from the party store.

What to do with people who have no taste?

Spit them out...

They get the Meyers and beer.

True story: I know someone that drinks just that. A Natural Ice with a big gulp taken out of it and a float of Myers's on top. He refers to it as a "flavor enhancer."

Trying to expose your non tiki friends to tiki stuff when they do not express much interest will just lead to gifts from the party store.

Ha! Too true. After making my MIL an equivalent of a $100 mai tai, the surge of Jimmy Buffet paraphernalia and plastic tiki masks ensued.

On 2012-07-26 16:00, Psycho Tiki D wrote:
What to do with people who have no taste?

Spit them out...

Try some HP Sauce. It makes everything better.

On 2012-07-26 16:00, Psycho Tiki D wrote:
What to do with people who have no taste?

Spit them out...

Have you tried various seasonings?

I must admit, I am not a connoisseur of rum, but I do appreciate a very finely made cocktail and enjoy the wonderful flavors. I will not be able to tell you what brand of rum you used, but if you used a high quality product and let me know you did, I would savor the experience and not just slam it back without respect of the mixing craft.

"Oh waiter, another cocktail please!!!"

[ Edited by: VampiressRN 2012-07-28 11:52 ]

Sometimes the trick to making successful drinks is in understanding the tastes of the people you are making them for, and either selecting drink recipes that naturally will follow those tastes, or figuring out how to modify other recipes accordingly without damaging their fundamental character.

For the folks that like knocking their short drinks back, maybe something with a long lingering aftertaste? (Perhaps something heavy on the Herbsaint?)

Or take the folks that raved over the vodka pineapple juice - why do you think it was so popular? Perhaps it was a group who dislikes the taste of heavy rums? In that case going for lighter, whiter rums might be the solution. Alternately, there are many tiki drinks out there that call for vodka.

Was it the color it had when the Hawaiian punch was added that drew them in? Sometimes, it can be a case of presentation. Many people drink with their eyes. If one drink has a more impressive presentation, it may get more applause than one that is really more interesting flavor-wise, but served in a simple manner.

If that's the case, maybe bust out some of the trick pony drinks. A Shark Bite using one of those grenadine-filled sharks. Ice cones. A drink that you set on fire. Something with dry ice. Cheap showmanship, sure, but definitely part of a certain type of tiki culture. :)

I understand the issue and it can be frustrating. Recently I had a party and I knew upfront that most had not experienced a well-crafted tiki cocktail. Being in Florida people are used to the beach drinks. I decided that I would introduce people slowly and have more accessible drinks available. I made painkillers and Mai Kai tribute recipe Jet Pilot. Granted the Painkiller moved quick, but the Jet Pilot's had the desired effect and sparked peoples interest. As the evening went on I had conversations about different drinks and soon I was helping my friends make 1934 zombies. More than one taxi was called...

I am always amused at how fast people succumb to the effects of Tropical Cocktails
who are not used to them, even after Stern warnings of the liqueur content.

Just be sure to get those car keys up front, foolish light weights!

On 2012-08-05 14:06, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
I am always amused at how fast people succumb to the effects of Tropical Cocktails
who are not used to them, even after Stern warnings of the liqueur content.

Just be sure to get those car keys up front, foolish light weights!

The slogan is just as wise today, as when The Master first included it in his menu, for select items:
"Don will not serve more than 2 to each person."

It's a heartbreaker sometimes. I remember hauling two porta-bars (those 60's-70's briefcase-bars w/the mixing tools etc) and fresh ingredients along a 2-hour Greyhound trip to relatives and mixed up a batch of Mai Tai's. My beaming face was met with, "kinda sweet...","a little too tart..." and varying qualities of indifference. Won't be bothering with THAT again.

Now I'm not saying I'm above slamming back crap for a quick drunk, but I got taught a lesson, anyways: keep the best for those you know will appreciate it.

It is somewhat unfair and difficult to be satisfied if you expect your friends and guests to have the same level of interest in your drinks that we all have. We're the weird ones, they don't have to be, even if they are uncultured. I agree with Chip - the whole reason for doing this is to be a host and if your guests enjoy Hawaiian Punch then that's what they enjoy. Kick them out and invite different guests, or serve them Hawaiian Punch.

I do however, think it is fair to want to try to elevate the taste of your guests. I have had varying degrees of success at parties getting folks out of their comfort zone. Typically, I serve very little beer (and when I do, I serve something out of the ordinary) and a series of mixed drinks. Some go over well, some don't, but people know they're going to get something different when they come to my tiki bar and they seem to enjoy that. Even if they do want their Genny Cream Ale when they get home.

Cosmogirl and I are trying something new that is proving to be somewhat successful. We're doing a cocktail tasting party. All guest are expected to bring a cocktail (with enough to serve a small amount to most guests, maybe the equivalent of 8 normal drinks) and to send their cocktail recipe ahead of time. They will serve their recipe at the party. In return, we provide food and a drink as well, and compile all the recipes into commemorative recipe books. All guests at the party get one that contains all the drinks that were served.

The party is next week, but response has been good. We got a little pushback initially but when we stressed that this was the type of party it was, every guest pushed themselves to provide a recipe. Several guest who couldn't come have also sent cocktail recipes, and we'll be sending recipe books on to them as well even though they cannot attend and their drink won't be served.

In short, this turned out to be a great way to create some interest in some cocktail culture and folks really seem to be enjoying it. Some recipes are complicated (we have a French Martini, a cosmopolitan, a tequila fizz, and some homemade limoncello among other things) and some are pretty straightforward (liquid pants remover, apparently discovered during a camping trip, 1 shot raspberry vodka served with 8 oz. diet berry soda). But in the end, our guests really got into the project and it is turning out to be a fun way to have a unique party. We didn't have to do all the work, and our guests seem to really like the idea.

dcman

By the way - Cocktail Tasting Party was a HUGE hit - people loved the process and the different drinks, and really loved getting a cocktail book at the end of the night. It was a great way to get people into cocktail culture.

dcman

I retired (moved on) from pro bartending, and now I just do it for private parties- friends and referrals. I get much praise for my classic tropical drinks and prohibition cocktails at the private parties, and I think it's because many folk out here in LA were pre- primed by the mixology craze. They know what they're tasting after a while. Conversely, in the bar business, writing cocktail menus was a struggle in the good taste department. I often found management was scared or out of touch with progressive taste and I was usually forced to reign back anything complicated, until my last menu contributions when every bartender hated me for making them actually work for the drink. But I can commiserate with the pervasive trend in most folk being absolutely clueless when they taste something- especially with bitters- they say it tastes like "old man" or "too sour." Surprisingly its not the rude tudes or dog eat dog that bums me out as much as comments like those.

Do Cannibal's even eat people with no taste?

On 2012-08-21 23:33, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
Do Cannibal's even eat people with no taste?

Non-Tiki cannibals don't even care if the people have taste. Or garnish. They just want to get full.

Pack of un-cultured slobs.

What usually works for me is to work from something people already know. I ask them for a cocktail, any cocktail, that they have tried and liked. I then proceed to make it for them "the right way". From margaritas to martinis to heck, even a rum and coke, having a drink made the correct way with good ingredients usually impresses them enough for them to trust me with the next choice and so on.

What's really satisfying is after a few visits, they will be asking for a something "strange" like a sazarac or Negroni (or most recently a Mary Pickford) without any prompting at all. I think the biggest problem is just education and exposure. We insulate our kids completely from cocktails growing up and then send them off to college where all they learn is liquor and soda or horrible punches made in a garbage can.

On 2012-08-23 09:57, TikiHardBop wrote:
What usually works for me is to work from something people already know. I ask them for a cocktail, any cocktail, that they have tried and liked. I then proceed to make it for them "the right way". From margaritas to martinis to heck, even a rum and coke, having a drink made the correct way with good ingredients usually impresses them enough for them to trust me with the next choice and so on.

What's really satisfying is after a few visits, they will be asking for a something "strange" like a sazarac or Negroni (or most recently a Mary Pickford) without any prompting at all. I think the biggest problem is just education and exposure. We insulate our kids completely from cocktails growing up and then send them off to college where all they learn is liquor and soda or horrible punches made in a garbage can.

So your giving your kids well crafted cocktails? :wink:

No, the only kids we have are Cavalier King Charles Spaniels and only one of them drinks and she only drinks Guinness!

My point is that it is possible to have kids grow up around alcohol and have an appreciation of it without dire side effects.

I always think of the great scene from Auntie Mame when nephew Patrick makes a martini:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzshzHKSYfk

But on the other hand:

Do not allow children to mix drinks. It is unseemly and they use too much vermouth.

• Fran Lebowitz

I had one guy who told me he never had a tropical cocktail before. So I made him a Boo Loo pineapple out of the BeachBum Berry book and that made him a firm believer in tropical cocktails. Plus it kicks your ass like a zombie. But everyones taste will be different. Us Tikiphiles know how to appreciate a great exotic cocktail. :D

I avoid them . . . and don't invite them to my gatherings . . . in case it's contagious!