walmart spirit of aloha

http://edition.cnn.com/2004/US/10/14/hawaii.walmart.ap/index.html

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/041013/480/hilp10110132146

More proof they are pure evil, they built a store on top of an ancient Hawaiian burial ground.

TG

[ Edited by: TikiGardener on 2004-10-23 09:31 ]

i am proud to say i have never shopped at a Wal-Mart, and i never will!

"placing them in an air-conditioned, darkened trailer"
It sounds like they're heading out to the Paradise Cove Luau!
Seriously bad mana.

Aloha,
:tiki:

Sprawlmart is intent to decimate the competition as well as ancient cultures all around the world:

"Wal-Mart at Mexico Ruins Sparks Protest... residents of an ancient Mexican city protested on Saturday at the construction of a Wal-Mart store on the edge of the ruins. A Teotihuacan pyramid, the archeological site 18 miles from Mexico City.

The sprawling warehouse-style Bodega Aurrera, a unit of Wal-Mart in Mexico, is due to open in December in Teotihuacan, a major archeological site outside Mexico City.

(an area that certainly has their own versions of fabulous tikis...)

Opponents say it will ruin a way of life that dates back centuries. "What they are doing in Teotihuacan is destroying Mexico's deepest roots for short-term interests like lower prices," "This is the flag of conquest by global interests, the symbol of the destruction of our culture."
The Teotihuacan construction site lies less than a mile from the gated tourist park housing the main ruins and is visible from atop the Pyramid of the Sun that has defined the skyline for 2,000 years.

(this may have been covered over in Aztecentral.com)

of course, walmart continues to lie to us and say:

"(issues) now raised against Wal-Mart are simply inaccurate and unfair. From the beginning, we have been committed to ensuring that the final treatment of remains is done in a culturally appropriate, respectful and sensitive manner. We are certainly willing to work with recognized descendants to discuss how to accelerate the process of reburial, obviously, in a way that is appropriate and consistent with recognized practices and beliefs."

and yet, talk with any group here in Hawaii concerned with the safe, respectful care and local repatriation of ancestral remains and they will tell you Walmart simply cares about only one thing.

almost as the Bush/Kerry split, the "walmart destroying the local culture" subject is a very divisive issue here.

I bought two Aloha shirts from the Walmart in Kauai
The Tiki section there rocks.
I hope they build one closer to my house.
I love to go over and have lunch with Gingy
Yum Yum popcorn, hot dog and hot ginger bread action

Hey Bax They got one by me. Its huge. Theres a Mcdonalds inside too. I always grab a double cheeseburger and coke before I fill up my cart. I havent seen any ginger bread though.

You know, I actually was relieved to leave Germany in the 80s, because I am a totally apolitical personality. I was annoyed by the constant heightend awareness of political correctness, and inspired to mock it, because it seemed so selfrighteous. Part of the fun of Tiki for me lay in it's political incorrectness.
But lately, things have been going a little too far in the direction of proud ignorance. I understand that there is a loyalty to ones favourite sports team that makes one root for them even if they suck. It's kinda cool. But this here is not sports, it's your goddamn life and that of your children, and to go ahead and be in denial even when the wrongs to basic human values are so apparent just baffles my mind.

Walmart is out for Walmart. I really wonder what will happen to the remains.

Walmart makes tons of promices, but fails to keep them when the media leaves the scene. In Mobile, AL. Walmart promiced as part of the agreement with the city, to keep 300 year old oaks surrounding the property there. After one year, they decided Walmart was not being viewed well enough for the impulse shopper, so they chopped them down and paid the fine. Did they care that these beautiful oaks have been ther 300 years, NO! Walmart is scary! Not the Halloween scary either!

Please call me when the next anti-Walmart rally starts so we can all stand side by side, instead of just talking about it ?

so is Sam's Club off limits too?

4,400 hawaiian residents are gainfully employed and thousands shop there. Isnt that good for the State of Hawaii's economy and employment rates?

Bigbro...your apolitcal?, If I'm not mistaken didnt you post something last year comparing President Bush to Hitler? I think there was a photo with the post.

In reference to the Walmary opening Craig Nishida, of UFCW Local 480, stated that a big box store would adversely impact the smaller local businesses. Walmart profits made in Hawaii will typically be spent on the Mainland instead of going back into Hawaii's economy.

In Los Angeles the prospect of Walmart Superstores fueled a multimonth supermarket strike, in part, because of Walmart's non-union, low wage employment practices.

[i]On 2004-10-24 18:03, Tiki Rider wrote:

4,400 hawaiian residents are gainfully employed and thousands shop there. Isnt that good for the State of Hawaii's economy and employment rates?

TikiRider,

It appears that Wallmart failed to address senstive cultural issues, which is in keeping with its reputation of using its size as America's largest employer to get its way.

I do agree with you that any additional employment in Hawaii is worthwhile. However, Wallmart pays lower then the average retailer and is not a very good corporate citizen, according to this US News & World Report article:

Wal-Mart takes hits on worker treatment
By Stephanie Armour USA TODAY

There's more to Wal-Mart than bare-bones pricing and a familiar yellow smiling face. The megaretailer is also getting an unwelcome reputation for the way it treats its employees.

At the pinnacle of its success, the company is fending off critics who say Wal-Mart discriminates against women, underpays workers and uses illegal tactics to kill unionization efforts. Never before has the retail empire, founded in 1962, come under such blistering attack.

Roughly 40 lawsuits have been filed by employees who say they were forced to work overtime for no pay. The company is facing a sexual discrimination lawsuit in California that could become the largest such case in history.

And labor groups, which have fought unsuccessfully for years to get a foothold at Wal-Mart, are intensifying efforts. In November, more than 100 rallies captured headlines. Critics want higher wages for workers and support for unionization efforts.

For Wal-Mart — whose 1.3 million workers make it the world's largest private employer — both reputation and money are at stake. Overtime and sexual bias lawsuits could cost the company millions of dollars; similar class-action cases involving overtime claims at other companies have brought verdicts as high as $90 million.

The blows to Wal-Mart's image are coming just as the company lays out some ambitious goals — expanding into the $680 billion retail grocery business and hiring more than 1 million employees in the next five years.

Company officials say they don't know why the attacks are coming now, and they also say the allegations are unfounded. "It's our approach with our associates to treat them right and have a genuine partnership with them," says Wal-Mart spokesman Bill Wertz. "We need a lot of people to conduct our business and fill our existing stores. We couldn't do that if we mistreated our people."

Some Wal-Mart employees agree the flap about labor problems is overblown.

"We have a great package of benefits," says Micheal Hardaway, 37, a store manager in Los Angeles. "Wal-Mart gives people the tools to better themselves. Associates have a voice."

Test of organized labor

But this is about more than Wal-Mart. The battle to reform the company's employment practices is also a crucial test for organized labor, whose membership has atrophied from 30% of the labor force in the 1950s to about 13% today. So far, none of Wal-Mart's roughly 1 million U.S. employees are union members — raising tough questions about how relevant unions are today.

"Unionizing a giant, New Economy employer like Wal-Mart would be as big a coup today as unionizing Ford was to the United Auto Workers," says Erik Gordon, a professor at the University of Florida in Gainesville. "Failing to unionize it is frustrating to the unions and damages their claim that they're needed by today's workers."

Critics want to keep the pressure on because they believe changes in Wal-Mart's labor practices could prompt competitors to make similar concessions. And change, they say, is sorely needed.

"I'd love to see the benefits package changed," says Mary Lou Wagoner, 53, a cashier in Las Vegas at Sam's Club, a wholesale warehouse operated by Wal-Mart. "People can't afford it. A union would help immensely."

But Wal-Mart is fighting back. Company leaders say unionization efforts have failed because its employees are content. How, they ask, could the company continue to grow — it now has 3,371 stores — if it was really such an inhospitable place to work?

Officials at the Bentonville, Ark., home office say Wal-Mart offers competitive wages and affordable health insurance. As an example of the company's commitment to its workers, officials note that more than 60% of Wal-Mart's managers began as hourly employees.

Unions and analysts put hourly pay for non-supervisors at about $8; Wal-Mart declined to divulge salary information. The 1999 annual average hourly earnings for retail workers was $9.08, according to data from the Labor Department analyzed by the International Council of Shopping Centers.

"The question our people have is what the unions' real intent is. It doesn't seem like a genuine membership drive," Wertz says. "It seems like more of an effort to discredit the company and protect those companies that do employ union members."

Adds Ted Connelly, 36, a department manager at a Wal-Mart store in Ocala, Fla: "I never expected the opportunities that are here at this store. The one company that would not need a union is Wal-Mart."

Competitors that have some unionized workers include grocers Kroger, Albertsons, Safeway and Royal Ahold, union officials say.

But the anti-Wal-Mart campaign is spreading. Some allegations:

•Union busting. Since November 2001, Wal-Mart has been a defendant in 28 complaints brought by the National Labor Relations Board citing anti-union activities such as threats, interrogations or disciplining.

Critics say Wal-Mart moves quickly to block organizing. In 2000, a majority of meat cutters at a store in Jacksonville, Texas, voted to organize. Shortly after the vote, the company closed its butcher departments at Jacksonville and other stores. Organizers say that was done to quash the union; Wal-Mart says it was part of a long-term business plan to move to prepackaged meats.

•Sexual discrimination. A lawsuit filed in San Francisco claims Wal-Mart discriminates against women in promotions, job assignments, training and pay. The lawsuit, filed in June 2001, allows for claims going back to December 1998 — potentially involving hundreds of thousands of current and former Wal-Mart employees if certified as a class action.

Stephanie Odle, 31, of Norman, Okla., is a class member in the case. She says women were paid less and treated differently. Odle says she learned that a male manager with less experience was earning $20,000 more a year. But when she complained, Odle says, she was told that the man was raising children and was the sole financial support for the family.

"They have a blatant disregard &ellipsis; they can't continue to treat people that way," Odle says.

Lawyers and activists say that more than 70% of Wal-Mart's sales associates are women, while less than a third of store management employees are female. Company officials declined to divulge statistics due to pending litigation.

•Employment practices. Critics contend that Wal-Mart is profiting at the expense of workers' benefits and wages.

Two-thirds of workers don't have health insurance because they can't afford it or don't qualify, according to the United Food and Commercial Workers Union (UFCW) — a statistic Wal-Mart disputes. Employee pay averages about 30% less than union members in the retail food industry, they say. And the company is also facing lawsuits from workers who say they were made to work off the clock, in some cases claiming they were locked in stores. This year, Wal-Mart lost the first of those overtime lawsuits to go to trial — a case involving employees in Oregon. Damages have not yet been determined.

"Wal-Mart has a crummy health plan, it's very expensive, and every year, premiums go up," says Linda Gruen, 53, of Federal Way, Wash. The former Sam's Club cashier quit in August and became a union organizer. "We need to do something."

To demonstrate that their campaign is making a difference, labor groups point out that Wal-Mart was not among Fortune magazine's list of the top 100 companies to work for. The company was on the list in 1998, 2000 and 2001.

"Clearly, the pressure is having an impact. They fell off," says Jill Cashen at the UFCW.

But company officials say they weren't shunned. Rather, they say, Wal-Mart this year chose not to participate in the annual ranking, which is based in part on employee surveys.

Wal-Mart's benefits

To counter union attacks, Wal-Mart officials say that about 75% of employees are eligible for health care coverage. (The remaining 25% are in waiting periods, which are six months for full-time employees and two years for part time.) Of those eligible for the health plan, about 60% sign up.

The company picks up two-thirds of the cost. While unions say that's less than some other companies, Wal-Mart points out that the majority of its employees are full time, so more are eligible for coverage. They also say the coverage might cost more, but it's more comprehensive, and there are no caps on benefits.

Other perks include a profit-sharing plan and a 401(k) plan that the company contributes to even if the associate does not. The company contributes an amount, up to 2% of employees' pay, depending on profitability. There is also a store bonus program. Employees in stores that meet specific criteria, such as profitability and customer satisfaction, share in yearly profits.

But as the finger-pointing escalates, some labor experts say unions might be targeting Wal-Mart because they see the company's growth as a threat.

Labor has "unionized stores like Safeway and Kroger," says Satish Deshpande, a management professor at Western Michigan University in Kalamazoo. "But those organizations are now asking the union for wage and benefit cuts because they say they can't compete with Wal-Mart, whose labor costs are so much lower. So their only option is to go after Wal-Mart."

For critics, getting the message out has become a coordinated campaign with professional anti-Wal-Mart videos and Web sites, such as http://www.walmartwatch.com and http://www.walmartyrs.com. The National Organization for Women in September named the company its fifth National Merchant of Shame over labor issues.

Some say such attention is overdue. Gretchen Adams, 56, is a former Wal-Mart supervisor. Women used to come to her office in tears, she says, because they couldn't survive on company wages.

"It's terrible what they do to people," says Adams, of Navarre, Fla., who quit in 2001 and became a union organizer. "I had women who would come to me worried about how to make ends meet because they couldn't afford the health care. For a company that is the nation's largest, how can they let that go on?"

On 2004-10-24 18:03, Tiki Rider wrote:
Bigbro...your apolitcal?, If I'm not mistaken didnt you post something last year comparing President Bush to Hitler? I think there was a photo with the post.

On 2004-10-24 15:24, bigbrotiki wrote:
But lately, things have been going a little too far in the direction of proud ignorance. I understand that there is a loyalty to ones favourite sports team that makes one root for them even if they suck. It's kinda cool. But this here is not sports, it's your goddamn life and that of your children, and to go ahead and be in denial even when the wrongs to basic human values are so apparent just baffles my mind.

The only part I'll chime in on is the Wallmart being put on a Hawaiian burial gorund, wethetr it employs people or is hopworthy or not, I'll leave that to you guys. I was fortunate enough to get to visit Italy this year. I went through allot of cities in Northern Italy and saw places that wer a thousand years old. One of teh memories that is the most deeply burned into my mind after my return is the vast amount of McDonalds. Everywhere you look there was a McDonalds. I went to this city on toip of a mountain that was over a thousand years old. The place was gorgeous. As you are coming up the front gates that are the only way in or out what is sitting right outside to the left of teh gate? Thats right a McDonalds.

I bring this up because I think we should have a ceratin amount of respect for some things, wether its' architecture or places with spiritual relevance. It's fine that we want the conveniance of having an easy to shop at place or fast food on every corner, but I think we are really robbing ourselevs in teh long run if that is all that we have, Wallmarts and McDonalds. If the Wallmart would emplot lots of people and the communitty wanted it then fine, just put it somewhere else.

You all got some points...but I dont see anyone being forced to shop or forced to work for the evil Walmart. They filled 800 some jobs and had crowds surging in to shop. From reading everything though it appears the majority of the people are in favor of it being there and shopping there.
By the way who owned the walmart land originaly? They sold the burial ground to walmart. Shouldnt they be at fault too?
Any large company union or not can have the same charges leveled at them. Low wages payed to women is universal and valid complaint. Thats a known fact that women earn less than men. Unions want their foot in the door anywhere. sexually harrassment can happen in any workplace.

and bigbro..judging from your response quote then I take it that was your post comparing President Bush to Hitler.

Now now, that is a political question...

I frankly don't remember. But if I did, shouldn't I know what I am talking about?

Hefe Weizen!!! (no lemon pleaze!)

On second thought, that couldn't have been me, the comparison doesn't stick:

(I'm just talking about Hitler here, that's history, not politics!)

1. He wore a moustache

2. He was an evil SMART guy

3. The country he invaded under false pretense was POLAND

4.Hitler was elected.

And as I recall he had German troops dress in Polish Army uniforms, and attack a German outpost, so he could claim Poland was a threat to him. I think thats how he did it...

Just noting history, thats all.

And I guarentee that if HellMart were to try and build a box on my fathers grave I'd burn the bastard to the ground. You're mileage may vary.

[ Edited by: TikiGardener on 2004-10-24 22:17 ]

[ Edited by: TikiGardener on 2004-10-24 22:19 ]

[i]On 2004-10-24 19:02, christiki295 wrote

(article snipped to save space and bandwidth.)

Chris, and excellent and balanced article!
Thanks for posting it.

On 2004-10-24 18:03, Tiki Rider wrote:
4,400 hawaiian residents are gainfully employed and thousands shop there. Isnt that good for the State of Hawaii's economy and employment rates?

This would seem to be the case on the surface, but look deeper. Yes, 4,400 Hawaiians are employed, but the amount of money spent in the WalMart stores in Hawaii far outweighs the salaries of the workers employed there, obviously (or else the store wouldn't make profit). All of that cash made in the store is not staying in the local community, it is lining the pockets of WalMart executives in other states. A tiny percent of the store's income is going to salaries of the workers, but the vast majority of the money spent by locals is going to WalMart's profits elsewhere. So in reality, the Wal Mart stores are sucking the ecenomy dry, not helping it. The only way to help ANY local economy is to open businesses and put people to work for companies who are locally-based.

I haven't partonized a Wal Mart, Blockbuster, McDonalds, etc, since the 1980s. I spend my money at locally-owned businesses as often as I possibly can. It is sometimes more expensive, but I like keeping my money in my local economy. I like seeing my neighbors and friends all get ahead a little and put shoes on their kid's feet, rather than have some mega-corpoation build more skyscrapers and ruin more landmarks.

Hefe Dunkel!!!

Affligem !

Hey, next can we go after the third world countries that put the Hawaiian sugar cane industry out of business.
That just pisses me off.

On 2004-10-25 07:34, thebaxdog wrote:
Hey, next can we go after the third world countries that put the Hawaiian sugar cane industry out of business.
That just pisses me off.

When I visited the big island a few years back, I was able to visit a couple who helped set my parents up. They now live in Kona, and she is a volunteer at the Hospital. She is pushing for more marijuana used for medical purposes. She even wanted to send me home with some 'special' brownies for my parents, (both with serious health issues) I didn't want to go through agricultural customs with those. Yipes!

Well, she thinks all the land which used to grow sugar cane would be perfect for medical marajuana crops. I think it's a great idea. Talk about a boost to Hawaii's economy!

Youre right bigbro. you should know.
I hereby humble-ly withdraw my political question.
say Wasnt hitler a painter too?

Awchoo!

A good analysis of the impact of WalMart on our communities and our society that Congress published last winter:

http://edworkforce.house.gov/democrats/WALMARTREPORT.pdf

I haven't entered a Walmart since the early 90s when I was followed for quite a while in the store by undercover security. I confronted the person and they admitted they were following me. I guess I didn't fit the profile of the typical Walmart shopper so they decided I was shoplifter. The whole place gives me the creeps. I can't even visit modern suburban areas without sinking into a state of depression and gloom. The monotony of those neighborhoods is so oppressive.

On 2004-10-25 11:13, Unga Bunga wrote:
(rapa nui/wal-mart image)

(shudder)

This hits a little close to home... reminds me of the 'debate' that Christiki295 and I had on another thread earlier this year.

This one:
http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=6130&forum=1

[ Edited by: tikibars on 2004-10-25 11:46 ]

I highly recommend this book:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0812963776/qid=1098725553/sr=8-10/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i10_xgl14/102-1320796-1391313?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

I felt like I got a real sense of the man who started WalMart after reading this... It is pretty even handed, but I still felt like Sam walton had an addiction when it came to his business (by that I mean, he couldn't stop growing it - no matter the cost, financial risks & public perception be damned...) And I do hate what WalMart has done to the small businesses of this nation - not to mention the many abuses of it's employees...
Interesting read, anyway.

A good parallel to the subject:

The History Channel aired this very comprehensive and eye-opening documentary now available on DVD. It details a history of Hawaii's development as a nation through the overthrough of it's parliment inspired government by a handful of American businessmen.

May the Tiki Gods Bless You TikiGardener!
-FB

http://store.aetv.com
search:  Conquest Of Hawaii DVD (History Sunday)

[ Edited by: FreakBear on 2004-10-25 12:11 ]

On 2004-10-25 12:06, FreakBear wrote:
A good parallel to the subject:

DVD. details a history of Hawaii's development as a nation through the overthrow of it's government by a handful of American businessmen.

This is one of the best books on the subject:
To Steal a Kingdom

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/096334840X/002-7173424-5036808?v=glance

In respnse to:
"4,400 hawaiian residents are gainfully employed and thousands shop there. Isnt that good for the State of Hawaii's economy and employment rates? "

and

"I dont see anyone being forced to shop or forced to work for the evil Walmart. They filled 800 some jobs and had crowds surging in to shop. From reading everything though it appears the majority of the people are in favor of it being there and shopping there. "

May I submit:

They over run ancient civilizations. They destroy local cultural sites and they desecrate graves sites;

http://www.counterpunch.org/carlsen10152004.html

It is a depressing prospect to think we live in the day and age where something like this: "Proponents of pyramid Wal-Mart argue that it will create jobs and serve consumers cheaply-the hallmark of the store's reputation." justifies the destruction of and lack of any respect for ancient cultures.

they create thru advertising and their stores being everywhere fulla junk at low prices, a mass lemming mindset of the proletariat that, when Walmart makes excuses and justifications of these culturally insensitive actions, the masses respond with absolute acceptance and belief.

For each and every Walmart that opens in a town, 2 grocery stores close down.
The rationale that welcoming WM into a community will create more jobs is fallacious...all it does is move customers around and close down other businesses, so the net result is 0 or next to 0 gains in employment opportunities.

For each job they 'create" two jobs are lost.
Do any kind of google search on Walmart's effect on local businesses. See how they decimate the local business economy

Wal-Mart Stores Inc. discriminates against blacks seeking truck-driving jobs, resulting in federal lawsuits

many large and small companies struggle even more, after getting in bed with Walmart.
http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/77/walmart.html
http://www.forbes.com/home_asia/global/2004/1018/026.html

WM forces overtime for which the complainants say they were not paid.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2002058257_walmart09.html

And, on PBS Hawaii channel 10 show, a few nights ago;

based from Jefferson Wisconsin wherein they review the debacle of walmart coming into that town and they cover some evidence;
each sprawlmart that enters a town on average causes TWO grocery stores in that town to close.

many wage earners working for walmart are required to supplement their income with foodstamps (to even afford groceries at the very place they are employed!) as well as require other govnmt assisstance.

With all the concessions, tax breaks etc. handed to walmart by each state city and county they enter, along with the assistance local state and federal governments hand their low wage earning employees, it is estimated approx. 2.5 million a year is the cost to the government to have each walmart in the town.
Old longstanding beautiful historic buidildings are torn down, replaced with parking lots.
Many old established businesses shut down; customers flock to walmart to buy the same thing cheaper but that's just part of it; To stay in business manufacturers alter their sales and distibution format and are forced by walmart to implement parameters on their business to the extent this is a standard example; a Jefferson Wisconsin shoe store was told by Converse their buyer must now purchase $3000.00 of shoes per month or they will no longer sell to that retailer. This breaks the retailers back and along with many other factors, effected by the introduction of walmart to town, they go under.
Just as in Honolulu; many want the convenience and low prices of the Big Box stores, but when we invite this behemoth to town to satisfy our addiction to consumerism, we lose something else that is far more important; a quality of life and a character of the community.

So we saw on the show the other nite; a beautiful old town with fabulous architecture, slowly die. Crumble to dust. Old buildings previously the backbone and center of activity of a town, piece by piece get bulldozed and the remaining storefronts shuttered up, with all the small businesses gone. It's a sad shallow hollow empty shell of a ghost town devoid of life and sipirit just as is the heart of the giant walmart.

Now, it's not so much as a simplistic "we hate walmart" that is the view as much as the widespread easy mental and economic control they have effected on the populace. monster companies like walmart have created other tiny minimonsters, zombies... plodding to the stores on a religious basis regardless of any other evidence or information there is out there to enlighten these minions and show them there it a "better way".
Picture the Eloi silently, mindlessly ,obediently walking toward the huge structure as the sound of the wailing siren beckons them in the Rod Taylor movie; "Time Machine".
They (walmart) have taught (brainwashed) the proletariat with the funny cute family style ads on the telly, that walmart is everyone's friend. So, the masses flock to walmart with blinders on. It becomes an internal conviction as strong as a religious choice or a political affiliation.

more:
http://www.pbs.org/itvs/storewars/talkback.html

http://www.honoluluweekly.com/cover/detail.php?id=21

funny stuff here!
http://www.phonelosers.org/wal-mart/

Let us not forget that the tradeofff for lower retail prices at Wallmart is the wholesale exportation of US jobs overseas ( and the inevitable destruction of more than a few families in the process).

As set forth in the "Fastcompany" link, Walmart "is helping accelerate the loss of American jobs to low-wage countries such as China. Wal-Mart, which in the late 1980s and early 1990s trumpeted its claim to "Buy American," has doubled its imports from China in the past five years alone, buying some $12 billion in merchandise in 2002. That's nearly 10% of all Chinese exports to the United States.

. . .

Steve Dobbins has been bearing the brunt of that switch. He's president and CEO of Carolina Mills, a 75-year-old North Carolina company that supplies thread, yarn, and textile finishing to apparel makers--half of which supply Wal-Mart. Carolina Mills grew steadily until 2000. But in the past three years, as its customers have gone either overseas or out of business, it has shrunk from 17 factories to 7, and from 2,600 employees to 1,200. Dobbins's customers have begun to face imported clothing sold so cheaply to Wal-Mart that they could not compete even if they paid their workers nothing.

"People ask, 'How can it be bad for things to come into the U.S. cheaply? How can it be bad to have a bargain at Wal-Mart?' Sure, it's held inflation down, and it's great to have bargains," says Dobbins. "But you can't buy anything if you're not employed. We are shopping ourselves out of jobs."

[ Edited by: christiki295 on 2004-10-25 18:54 ]

On 2004-10-25 10:32, Tiki Rider wrote:
Youre right bigbro. you should know.
I hereby humble-ly withdraw my political question.
say Wasnt hitler a painter too?

Awchoo!

And, much to my chagrin, a vegetarian...

On 2004-10-25 10:32, Tiki Rider wrote:

Youre right bigbro. you should know.
I hereby humble-ly withdraw my political question.
say Wasnt hitler a painter too?

Awchoo!

Tiki Rider:

Why are you trying to ridicule Big Bro Tiki?

He, if any among us, is deserving of a lot more respect.

It also weekens your somewhat valid points:

a. if all of the Hawaiian shoppers have overlooked the Walmart's actions, then shouldn't we as well? and

b. aren't the developers to blame, also?

I disagree with you on a.

I think we should always stand up for the protection of the tiki spirit, particularly as it relates to bones buried in the Hawaiian land.

This issue is bigger than Walmart.

Hawaiian bones and artifacts in general should be treated with the utmost dignity and respect, as they are the holder of Hawaiian mana (just the Father Damien burial story). Therefore, I must condemn SprawlMart's actions.

I agree with you on b.

Yes, the developers are to blame (and maybe the government if they failed to consider these strong cultural issues when approving this development).

This is also consitent with the issue of the Hawaiian artifact dispute, when a similar issue arose and I posted:

I thought that the state and the developers learned this lesson over the dispute regarding the location of the Ritz-Carlton. Unfortunately, not.

The so-ca1led Battle of the Bones erupted in the mid-1980s when a Ritz-Carlton hotel was proposed at Honokahua on a burial ground. Protests were so strong that in 1989 the planned hotel was moved back to preserve the sanctity of the site, and new laws were passed to prevent buildings from desecrating ancient Hawaiian sites.

http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic=5643&forum=1&start=15

[ Edited by: christiki295 on 2004-10-25 19:15 ]

[ Edited by: christiki295 on 2004-10-25 19:25 ]

Wal Mart Press Release:
"This new store means that for the first time in central Honolulu, we'll be able to offer customers what they've asked for -- quality merchandise, low prices and Wal-Mart's spirit of aloha."

Aloha, aword that means Hello, Good-bye and fuck you and your dead ancestors

CT
a. my question about bush being compared to hitler was to big bro not you.
b. I withdrew it in case you overlooked that point.
c. I was not trying to disrespect bigbro or anyone else at tiki central.
d. My points about walmart were separate from the quetion to him. He answered me so why are you butting in? He never put himself on a pedestal or above the rest of us, or complained of any ridicule.
Maybe youre just trying to stir it up?

Aloha
now buy me a lapu lapu and I'll buy you a mai-tai.

[ Edited by: tiki rider on 2004-10-26 03:57 ]

On 2004-10-25 19:13, Alnshely wrote:

Wal Mart Press Release:
"This new store means that for the first time in central Honolulu, we'll be able to offer customers what they've asked for -- quality merchandise, low prices and Wal-Mart's spirit of aloha."

Aloha, a word that means Hello, Good-bye and fuck you and your dead ancestors

Bwahahhaaa! yea. now it does!

Ok, broke a rule of mine which dictates
Don't go to, or anywhere Walmart.
so, sad to say I went to walmart today.

observed:
initally, front entrance rug was trashed. all busup arready.
Dept on left; Hawaiian products and handcrafts.
ok, stuff je'like da kine at Longs.
nothing new here. Same price points.
Aloha shirts; Only one local brand. the rest of the aloha shirts were da fake kine from Thailand. junkalunk designs. (tourists might like 'em.)

Saw some cool lookin bamboo and palm tree motif tableware; plates, bowls etc.. but upon handling them saw they were light cheap plastic. aaagh!
MiniDv camera dept; only had a few models. Not much choice here. mo bettah li dat you go local store. savings? wot, maybe 20 bux per model...

did not notice much at all; any high quality brand name merchandise. This is the evolutionary stage we see wherein as reported on many walmart info web sites:
WM beats the manufacturer's price down til they can not make a profit or stay in business, and when the manuf. can't lower their costs any longer, WM creates a knock off in China (or sometimes India). heck, WM does their own knockoff anyway. The name brands help to pull some customers to the location, and the cheaper WM private label stuff goes home with the customer.

I noticed much China and India origin merchandise.
and the much ballyhooed LLOOOOWWW prices, nah. same as at Longs and Daiei.
(which is a Walmart target; they wanna buy them out.)

Oh wait what's this? "marykate'N'ashley clothing line. A name brand. ok; upon close inspection; looked like a cheap one time use china-made halloween costume quality level piece of cr... clothing...

the Alnshely quote from above: "This new store means that for the first time in central Honolulu, we'll be able to offer customers what they've asked for -- quality merchandise, low prices and Wal-Mart's spirit of aloha."
this is a typical WM spin-doctor/marketing insult to merchants in the area who for years, have offered good quality stuff at good prices. and to add insult to injury, of course, the local merchants are dropping like da cockaroach on da wall hit wit da slippah.

Upon leaving the 4 story parking structure.
Cold design. Tight parking spaces, tight lanes.

People are honking. Hate to see that begin here. Noticed an ocular products and services shop x the street with a going outta business sign.
They been there on Keeaumoku for years.

Just don't like the idea of a huge monolithic mausoleum taking up a whole block in the heart of our Honolulu.
State shoulda created a mini Polynesian Cultural center kine o thing on this block. Or help subsidize a local vendor/maufacturer's shop/village in the old style.

Yes, the state is to blame. They believed the propaganda; Walmart will bring planny jobs to Hawaii. Lotta tax revenue. THAT is all the state cares about. Not the repercussions.

[i]On 2004-10-25 20:59, lanikai wrote:

Yes, the state is to blame. They believed the propaganda; Walmart will bring planny jobs to Hawaii. Lotta tax revenue. THAT is all the state cares about. Not the repercussions.

The tax revenue generation is true of big-box stores like Walmart & Sam's Club.

[i]On 2004-10-25 20:30, Tiki Rider wrote:

CT
. . .

Aloha
now buy me a lapu lapu and I'll buy you a mai-tai.

First rounds on me.

On 2004-10-25 11:41, tikibars wrote:

On 2004-10-25 11:13, Unga Bunga wrote:
(rapa nui/wal-mart image)

(shudder)

This hits a little close to home... reminds me of the 'debate' that Christiki295 and I had on another thread earlier this year.

This one:
http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=6130&forum=1

Tikibars:

Did you post that from Easter Island - Are you there now on vacation?

[i]On 2004-10-26 18:44, christiki295
Did you post that from Easter Island - Are you there now on vacation?

Not yet.

I leave this Thursday (Nov 4) for San Francisco, spend the weekend there, and then leave for Rapa Nui.

I come back on Tuesday the 16th... depending on the outcome of the election. If a certain person wins, I might just stay on Rapa Nui...

I'd just like to say that this thread should prove that Tiki Centralites are capable of spirited discussion without a total china syndrome of flame wars.

While it has balanced on the razors edge, the people of tiki central have proven that above all they are reasoned adults.

A mai tai of admiration raised in your direction TC.

On 2004-10-24 22:05, TikiGardener wrote:
4.Hitler was elected...

Hitler never won the popular vote but used a series of backroom deals to get appointed to the position the position of Chancellor.

On 2004-10-25 10:32, Tiki Rider wrote:
Wasnt hitler a painter too?

"Hitler... there was a painter! He could paint an entire apartment in ONE afternoon! TWO coats!"

Franz Liebkind

On 2004-10-24 16:44, thebaxdog wrote:
Please call me when the next anti-Walmart rally starts so we can all stand side by side, instead of just talking about it ?

Walmart suppliers pay employees - many of whom are dedicated and only do Walmart contracts - less than .54 cents per hour.
Probaly not pure evil, but very, very bad.

http://www.ips-dc.org/projects/global_econ/walmart_pay_gap.htm

To be fair, here is a site dedicated to putting a positive spin on Walmart in Hawaii.
http://www.walmartfacts.com/StateByState/?id=11

A story about how Walmart handled, or mishandled, the burial remains:
http://www.nationaltrust.org/Magazine/archives/arc_news_2005/112105.htm

[ Edited by: christiki295 2007-05-19 00:06 ]