Who hasn't read The Book of Tiki? (Not a poll)

There are a lot of new people on Tiki Central these days and a number of the long-time members don't post so much anymore. That makes me concerned that the ratio of those who are fully aware of classic Polynesian Pop (as defined in Sven Kirsten's The Book of Tiki) to those who aren't is tipping (towards those who aren't). Maybe it's all in my imagination, but I'd like to take a poll. Who hasn't read The Book of Tiki? If not, get yourself a copy and read it. Then read it again. As a result, not only will the quality of the posts here generally improve, but you will be helping to keep classic Poly Pop alive.

EDIT: No longer a poll. Read next few posts.

[ Edited by: GatorRob 2006-11-10 12:49 ]

I haven't! i just look at the pictures and read the captions. Just so you know its sarcasm.

[ Edited by: net-tiki 2006-11-10 12:25 ]

I appreciate your post, but I believe it's a tough call to ask people to step forward and admit "ignorance" of ANYTHING, if asked like this, so I do not have high hopes for this poll.
I just would like to contribute two factors: One is that the Book of Tiki has been out of print for many months now (sigh!), the other that (as I said once before) it is inevitable that Tiki will become a self perpetuating pop culture more and more, and that the BOT will become unknown to many NEW Tiki-philes that have entered the Tiki Revival from other points of inspiration, be it because of Tiki Farm mugs, or Shag, or ANY nouveaux Tiki art for example.

I like to compare this phenomenon to movies like "Citizen Kane" or "Hitchcock's" Psycho: When these films came out originally, their style was so innovative, people were shocked and thrilled. All these innovations have since been used so many times and have become such a common part of film language that today's viewers of these films can never see them again with the same enthusiasm than when they were released in their time, we can't be in that place of not knowing.

When I am aghast at how filmmakers are nowadays simply stealing plots and ideas from classic movies, it does not matter to a generation whose idea of a "classic" film (as in vintage) is "Star Wars". To them it's all new.

There is so much Tiki out there these days that many newcomers cannot fathom how the days of absolutely NO Tiki were, to many of them it must seem as if it was ALWAYS around. That today's prolificness of the image and term of TIKI is in large part due to the Book of Tiki is inconsequential here, since it was not there first for them.

I have to accept that, and my best way to keep the ball rolling is to put out ANOTHER book that will be just as much an eye candy inspiration, which I am in the process off doing, thank you very much :)

I haven't read a single word

(...of the multilingual translation sections)

-Randy

what's the book of tiki? :lol:

I appreciate the humor folks, but this was intended to be a serious poll. Based on the few posts so far though, I believe Sven may be right. Maybe I shouldn't have high hopes for this poll either. Thanks for the post Sven. As usual, you have given me new insight.

My intention for this poll was certainly not to embarass anyone by asking them to admit ignorance. But now that you point it out, I guess that's exactly what I'm doing. So if it's not to be a poll, how about simply a request that all newcomers seek out a copy of BOT and soak up every word and every picture. I really do get the sense that many are not aware of it and might not seek it out otherwise. And, I had no idea it was out of print now. That is a shame.

I've read Tiki Style...which I believe is the pocket bible version of the BOT..does that count? ha.
I had no idea the BOT was out of print either! I've known about it for years, but I have Tiki Style, which is almost the same thing, so I was holding off until I had some extra cash to get the full BOT..I got a $25 Barnes and Noble gift card recently, I wanted to use it to buy the BOT..now I can't :(

[ Edited by: hala_kahiki 2006-11-10 13:35 ]

i have been collecting and "into" TIKI long before i knew about BOT,SVEN or TIKICENTRAL. HOW did that happen?

No prob, Rob, thank you for your support of the "true" Tiki word (though let's not go there again, please :) )

I agree that it is a shame that Taschen let the last printing of the BOT run out (I think they are just too busy), I argued with my publisher about it, because it still is a regular seller. His point was that a period of non-availability will increase demand, to which my usual pragmatic point of view is that in today's fragmented pop culture, there is such an overflow of stuff out there, that if a consumer does not find what they want, they get the next best thing, and forget the first, and a sale is lost.
As I said here before, I certainly expect it to be re-printed with the release of my new book in February, because for many THAT one will be their first "serious" Tiki book, and they might want to get the BOT if they like what they see.

But then (not to complain!) I had to put out fires at Taschen with the new book, like its delayed release (lost that one), or the idea to put the bilingual translations after every chapter now (! No kidding, Randy), which I successfully fought.

And to reply to the above joking in my usual big brother earnest :wink:, I do not judge anyone who has NOT read the text, because I conceived the book in reverse, as a cameraman telling a story through visuals:

FIRST see the images, THEN if interest is high enough read the captions, and THEN, if one still wants to know more, maybe read the text. I am a visual junkie, that's what got me into Tiki in the first place.

On 2006-11-10 13:30, TIKI DAVID wrote:
i have been collecting and "into" TIKI long before i knew about BOT,SVEN or TIKICENTRAL. HOW did that happen?

That's great, David, none of these posts are negating that. MANY others have collected for years before too, like a lot of my best friends who contributed to the BOT.

I waited for 8 years to find the right way to put Tiki out there in a quality form so that it mattered to pop culture, because I did not just want to hoard my treasures and sit on them, but share them (and not only to the "In-Crowd"). I wanted to have Tiki be recognized and appreciated in a way it was never before, since it was not defined as a style even in its own heyday.

I did that, first, and completely, with the Book of Tiki, and sometimes that seems like a tough pill to swallow for some long time collectors who knew of some of it before, I am sorry.

As noted, the Book of Tiki may be out of print, but the paperback version is still available from Amazon for just twenty bucks, and the original, hardcover version can be found for sale new & used on Amazon starting at $55. The Book of Tiki's identical cousin, Tiki Style (a shrunk-down and slightly re-worked version of the same book) is available for about $10.

The book is simply a must-read -- there is currently no better encapsulation of the very topic that Tiki Central is focused on. For some here, it was their introduction to Tiki, for many here it was a documentation of something they already loved. It is worth tracking down (and really, there's not that much "tracking" involved, it's not hard to find). It is an excellent way to get up to speed with the conversation here.

Other books that are excellent must-reads are Tiki Quest, by Duke & Amy Carter (a loving look at tiki collectibles, especially mugs), and Tiki Road Trip, by James Teitelbaum (a handy guide to tiki bars for the tiki traveler).

Hi, I must admit that I have not read it completely. I own two copies and waited for months for it to come out I still reference then frequently for inspiration. I find something new every time I look. Dawn

Own it, but have not read it completely. Probably have read most of it cumulatively, but not in read in sequence yet. We too were interested in Tiki before getting the book. :)

The softcover edition of BOT is not availble through Amazon right now. I tried to order a copy 3 months ago and it is still on back order.

I was lucky enough to get probably one of the last few of the hard cover. I always worry about ruining it by looking at it to much, but I think I might buy that paperback to solve that problem. Sven hurry with the second book I cant wait for it any longer.

I stand corrected -- it's not very easy to track down, but it is possible -- a few sellers are selling used copies of the Book of Tiki in softcover form for around $40-$50.

Dangit, why won't they just reprint the sucker already! Here's to the hope that the new book will demonstrate that there's a market for the original book, too.

What trips me out is that the market isn't "flooded" with Tiki Books being that it is kinda popular nowadays. We have all these people with major tiki collections but only a few books on the shelf.

ps. Never read the BOT from begin to end. Me skim alot !!

What's the Book of Tiki?

I read part of it on the wall at Mugoomba.

Publishers! Would they let the Bible go out of print? Give us this day our daily Tiki!

I've got my autographed copy of the BOT and I treasure it. It's a beautiful book that I've read quite a few times. Not sequentially, mind you. I enjoyed Sven's lecture at Hukilau 2006 and can't wait to see the new Witco book.

I'm very new to all this. I ordered the soft cover BOT from Amazon in the beginning of September. Every couple weeks I get notices from them that its still unavailable and then a new 2-3 week shipping date is given. I find it hard to justify $50-$60 for a used/new hard cover copy however that may be the last resort.

Am I wrong to assume that its not being published due to lack of interest. Obviously people that come here to TC have the interest but just how many others would buy this book?

Hopefully after reading it I'll be a properly educated TC'er with more positive quality posts, thats it from here a total Tiki Neophyte. Uncrichie...

Will it be out on CD anytime soon?

On 2006-11-10 19:33, TikiLaLe wrote:
Will it be out on CD anytime soon?

Or.....Virtual Reality!?!?!? ( that would rock!!!)

Here's a link to Tiki Style at Amazon, which says it's currently in stock. It's not quite the Book of Tiki, since it's kinda the Readers Digest version, but it's a great value at $9.99.

http://www.amazon.com/Tiki-Style-Icons-Sven-Kirsten/dp/3822839191

On 2006-11-10 19:07, uncrichie wrote:
Am I wrong to assume that its not being published due to lack of interest. Obviously people that come here to TC have the interest but just how many others would buy this book?

Hi Uncrichie, it is not completely uncommon for a regular selling book to be out of print for a while. Part of it might be from underestimating how many copies to print on a particular edition and therefore they run out before they anticipated printing a new edition. The company puts more priority on getting its newer titles out to fulfill contracts with authors and, of course, to capitalize on any current trend.

The other part of it is to increase demand for the product. (Remember Cabbage Patch dolls and Beenie Babies?) The very first book published by the company I work for is currently out of print. In fact, even when we do go to reprint it, we will be revising it partly to improve upon it and partly to make the original worth more.

However, although this may be how things are run in the marketing world (and I'm sure there are experts that have this all figured out) I'm not sure I totally agree with the practice and, like Sven, I agree about our culture being fragmented and the high possibility of losing a sale simply due to our society's short attention span and obsession with immediate gratification.

Which, by the way, I myself, am guilty of as I have not read the entire BOT (sorry Sven), but rather enjoy the ecstatic visual smorgasbord that it is while reading the occasional caption and paragraph here and there.

On 2006-11-10 20:09, RevBambooBen wrote:

On 2006-11-10 19:33, TikiLaLe wrote:
Will it be out on CD anytime soon?

Or.....Virtual Reality!?!?!? ( that would rock!!!)

Sorry, no plans for that...as my motto is:

:) Less virtual reality, more ritual virility! :) (...thanks, Ben!...and Laura)

I am glad to see that some talented people are "coming out" and admitting to not have fully read it. As I said, the BOT, and also the upcoming book, are telling the story VISUALLY first, in images strung up like a movie (yet the books can also be opened in the middle, or at any page, and viewed backwards)...or perhaps, the BOT is the modern equivalent to the Rongo Rongo tablets, intriguing, but not all explanatory, keeping the mystery alive. :)

[ Edited by: bigbrotiki 2006-11-10 21:52 ]

I think I first saw it in 2002 or so - it was in the library when I was at "Rock Carving School", but rather than being filed with the books on Maori and Oceanic art it was with the builder's resources on architectural styles and landscaping.
We definitely had our own version of "Polynesian Pop" here in NZ, with imagery and paraphernalia based on an idealised European version of Maori culture, complete with strangely rendered hei-tiki and souvenirs aplenty, but I was really taken by this American version - particularly the lavish palaces and ritual vessels from Tiki's heyday. Another thing that struck a chord with me was the photo of the tiki hidden inside the bush, and the whole concept of "urban archaeology". Since then, I have steadily collected whatever odd items may turn up on these shores...mostly from Hawaii it seems. All 3 of my vintage mugs are from there.
I finally got my own BoT in Australia last year which I have read cover-to-cover 3 times since then, and dip into frequently when researching carving concepts., Rereading it led me to seek more knowledge via the net, which brought me to TC. So, Sven - thanks for providing a resource that has certainly influenced my creative work, and allowed me to daydream about an era and places that I never got to experience.

On 2006-11-10 18:34, dibroc wrote:
I read part of it on the wall at Mugoomba.

I read mine in the bathroom at Purple Orchid.

[i]On 2006-11-10 21:34, bigbrotiki wrote:
perhaps, the BOT is the modern equivalent to the Rongo Rongo tablets, intriguing, but not all explanatory, keeping the mystery alive. :)

Hopefully it will last as long.

However, even better, unlike Rongo Rongo, it will never fade away, just so long there is one copy left.

....and when those kids with ties and white shirts come a marchin at my front door.... it's always fun to pull out my.....Book of Tiki!

(ps. say this in Basement Kahunas Voice!! It's a blast here in LA )

I skipped to the last chapter and read the German and French translations :lol:

Actually, it is a great book, and there is no equal from a content standpoint.

But I always found that the way the pages were laid out made it difficult to read. For example, you have black text on a purple background (pg. 103). Try making out that text while sitting in a dimly lit bar and with four Mai Tais inside you!

HumuHumu, thanks for the heads up on Tiki Style at Amazon. Just ordered it to hold me over until BOT arrives.

Vintagegirl, thanks for the explanation on out of print books. I'm sure it will go to print the day that Amazon locates one for me, my kinda luck ya know! Uncrichie...

I'm still on the page with the bare breasted lady.

I'm waiting for the movie, I cant sit still long enough to read. oh hell, who am I kidding, y'all know I caint read.

I too, like some of the other replies here, have been collecting Tiki for years without ever having read the "Book of Tiki". I have ordered it from Amazon and it has been months with no book. I do have Duke Carter's "Tiki Quest". I read a lot and I have been reading my whole life. I have read "Kon Tiki" by Thor Heyerdahl (a couple of times). I read "The Happy Isles of Oceania" by Paul Theroux. I have read "Return to Paradise" by James A. Michener. I took a date to see the movie "Hurricane: Forbidden Paradise" when it was released in the 1970s and I liked it. I could go on and on with the things I've read and seen that have brought me to where I am today in my Tiki collection and in my appreciation of things Tiki. We have all had different journeys to get to the same place and when we're here, because we've all had those different journeys, we see the same things differently. Consequently, we're never really in the same place are we? That's diversity and it's great. Celebrate difference! I shouldn't comment, I suppose, because I haven't read "The Book of Tiki", but I will anyways. I look forward to reading the BOT and I'm sure I'm going to get a lot out of it. However I'm wary as I've heard it described as the 'Tiki bible' and I can tell you right now I don't have a bible. I'm a free thinker and proud of it. And, I can change my mind. I'm open to new ideas. We don't all have to have read the same book and to be on the same page in order to share ideas. That's why we share ideas because we're not all on the same page. That's my two cents on the subject.

On 2006-11-10 12:22, bigbrotiki wrote:
I appreciate your post, but I believe it's a tough call to ask people to step forward and admit "ignorance" of ANYTHING, if asked like this, so I do not have high hopes for this poll.

Sven, just help me to understand something so Myself and others reading this thread don't get it mixed up...But it looks like whoever is into tiki and HASN'T read BOT is ignorant?
When reading this thread, that is how I read it. "Admitting ignorance" at least in this thread would mean people coming foward and saying "I haven't read the BOT yet", correct or am I reading this wrong?

Uh oh, here we go again.

On 2006-11-12 09:58, Tom Slick wrote:

On 2006-11-10 12:22, bigbrotiki wrote:
I appreciate your post, but I believe it's a tough call to ask people to step forward and admit "ignorance" of ANYTHING, if asked like this, so I do not have high hopes for this poll.

Sven, just help me to understand something so Myself and others reading this thread don't get it mixed up...But it looks like whoever is into tiki and HASN'T read BOT is ignorant?
When reading this thread, that is how I read it. "Admitting ignorance" at least in this thread would mean people coming foward and saying "I haven't read the BOT yet", correct or am I reading this wrong?

I believe Sven was using "ignorant" in the sense of not having knowledge of something in particular, rather than a general ignorance.

sometimes i think ,every now and then someone here steps up ,puts a couple rounds into the air ,jumps back and watches the watches the fun.

"I believe Sven was using "ignorant" in the sense of not having knowledge of something in particular, rather than a general ignorance." I thought that statement was a little blunt but I then thought I guess if you haven't read the book you are without the knowledge. But that would make me and anyone in the world ignorant more than not.

"So, if you don't read this book, your ignorant."

and what a selling point that is.

[ Edited by: teaKEY 2006-11-12 13:05 ]

Look, this seems to always be an issue with confrontation. All that I asked for was a reply to what Sven meant FROM Sven. Very simple. I am trying to see his point of view clearly and not misconstrued, and I'm sure everyone else who reads this thread in the future would also like to have this made clearly. I'm not digging for other posters to guess what Sven meant in his statement as only he would know what he meant.

I would say that Sven has an inflated feeling of pride for writing the book of tiki, oops "The Book of Tiki", I meant. I love that Indian Larry, a motorcycle builder, claimed to be the best. It was a part of his personality and probably made him come off as a better builder. (Was just thinking this last night, just read this posting today.) As far as others, likes actors, they usually play the humble card. But Sven is just being Sven. He probably is the most knowledgeable about the history of Tiki in American.

I've read mine but still haven't figured out what "Linie raus-schaben!!!" means.

GROG has read most of The Book of Tiki, but GROG mostly like looking at all the pretty pictures,
and there's ALOT--thanks Sven.

GROG was into TIKI before GROG ever bought the THe Book of Tiki, so it wasn't responsible for getting GROG into Tiki, but it definitely feeds the fever and is an indespensible source of reference, history, and enjoyment, and GROG defintely looking forward to Sven's next book. And, even though GROG is a primitive in modern day, GROG doubt that the book will influence GROG to collect Witco.

Haha, "Linie rausschaben" means that you got the first printing: It means "line to be scraped out" in German, and I believe the printer forgot to take it out of two illustrations in the book's first run...which was around 18000.

And indeed, (thank you, Humuhumu), even though I was aware that the use of the term "Ignorance" might be over-interpreted, I couldn't think of a better one, and instead of chickening out trying be overly PC, I used it. Do you know a better word? Not-knowing? Lack of knowledge, maybe...but the formulation "admitting ignorance of..." just seems to me the best English for this purpose.
I tried to make clear by putting ANYTHING in capitals that I did not mean to call people unfamiliar with the BOT "ignorant". But there is a certain touchiness here about my statements that easily interprets them as self-aggrandizing, even Teakey thinks so.

And yes, here we go again:

Look, what am I supposed to say. I have been watching the growth of the Tiki Revival from day one. I was there before the BOT, and after it came out. I believe I have a good eye, and, though certainly not objective, I have a clear sense of judgment.

Why is it an inflated sense of self worth when I state the simple truth that 98% of the new Tiki Bars, be it in Vegas, New York, Atlanta, Waikiki, Berlin, London, Prague, and so on, were inspired by the Book of Tiki, and WOULD NOT EXIST otherwise? (and I am quite saddened by the closing of some!)
That goes for the larger percentage of home bars, too, and many, many new Tiki carvers, designers and artists. That is just a FACT. Am I not allowed to mention that ever, and rather should deny it?
Why should I not be thrilled and ecstatic about my book having caused such a wave of creativity? Yet it continuously seems to be taken as self-aggrandizing by some.

Neither am I denying that there were people that were into Tiki BEFORE the BOT came out,and now, many will be joining in who are ignorant of it. I did not invent Tiki, I just defined it, and for more people than not so far, I caused it to be put on the map!

I believe that some folks just have no idea of HOW little Tiki was out there before the BOT came out (see earlier post), and cannot fathom that the above might be true.
Well, I am very grateful that I played a decisive part in creating a pop culture genre, and feel not un-humble in taking credit for it, thank you very much.

..and Grog, let's talk AFTER you have beheld it, hehe :)

Personally, (and here goes an earful of BK, love me or hate me)I think it should be a prerequisite for even bothering to be here. I was into tiki as far back as 1991 and saw it as a cool old throwback to much cooler times but the B.O.T. was the first concise piece that brought it all full circle for me. Then I bought every back issue of Tiki News I could round up. That made me seek out other nuts who were building home tiki bars and collecting any tidbits from old sources they could find and I found TC. There's a huge sense right now going around a behind a lot of the green doors that the clowns have taken over the circus, and it's just not as intimate or fun as it used to be, because half of the people don't even have a clue where all of this came from, and really could care less. It's a great party, but with any great party soon there are a lot of crashers. The history, culture, and background run deep and fascinating. A lot of the great old places are still closing. A lot of adulterated, mish-mash corporate crap is calling itself tiki, and people are smiling and nodding, because they don't have a clue what tiki was or is; only what they piece together from who-knows-what. We're still losing the pure old tiki style at an alarming rate, and the byproducts are bona-fide crapola. Trader Vic's Chicago gone?? We need an old style tiki tent revival around this joint. Period. Either that or a class field trip.

Anyone have any old Tikinews that I could get off them. I check EBAY all the time and find nothing. I know that this stuff doesn't get thrown away. Only the people that love tiki would have bought the tikinews. PM please

I just what more written tiki info. The tiki magazine is probably the best current source and helps to pick up where the BOT left off. Just not enough

On 2006-11-12 12:50, Tom Slick wrote:
Look, this seems to always be an issue with confrontation. All that I asked for was a reply to what Sven meant FROM Sven. Very simple. I am trying to see his point of view clearly and not misconstrued, and I'm sure everyone else who reads this thread in the future would also like to have this made clearly. I'm not digging for other posters to guess what Sven meant in his statement as only he would know what he meant.

Aloooha Tom,

You need to hang out with Sven to Understand Sven. I'm sure he'd be up for you bringing over a bottle of good rum and hanging out and getting to know each other. He's a pretty cool dude. His pompass ass way of saying things is just who he is. He's also from Hefe-wise-ass land! aka Germany. Have you met German Joe yet?? He's a nut case!!

Trust me Tom. Sven is a stand up guy! No matter how he comes across.

Back to Reading the BoT.
( I still can't read the whole thing without getting side tracked!!!! )

We need MORE TIKI books!!!