"Building a Tiki Experience - What's important, and how to do it?"

Prikli I don't think you're way off base at all and I think you summed up a lot of what others have said here as far as making sure you create a menu and environment which allows you to stay in business and lure in customers who may not like the more hardcore tiki stuff or be willing to give it a try right off the bat.

It's funny you write all of this out tonight since I started writing out what I actually want on my opening menu this evening (while listening to Trader Sam's music) and I'll just go ahead and list off some of the stuff that's on there that might interest you.

A traditional Daiquiri
A hurricane
A standard, non-fancy grog
A painkiller
Then all of the classics

I also plan on having three beers on tap at the moment. A miller, coors, bud, light style. A Blue Moon style craft. And then last but not least a Kona because it fits the theme. I know beer sales can be a huge boon, so I was already planning on having those.

Finally, I have in mind a few different ways to engage customers in loyalty type programs. I don't want to give too much away but one involves what I'm calling for the moment a "Grog Log". Where a customer will try all of our on menu Grogs and then a few off menu with different types of rums, but the same ingredients everywhere else as an introduction to the way different rums taste and how that affects what you taste in a drink. For instance, a dark rum grog pulls out the demerara flavor more from the syrup that's included.

I also have ideas for a loyalty program that gets customers to drink through our menu, but I'm still trying to decide how exactly I want to do that. Either way there will be rewards at the end of the rainbow for either of these and I think they both have great potential to keep customers coming back and trying new things. I fully realize that the most important thing I can do is create a feeling of "This is my go-to place" for our guests.

That Grog Log sounds great! I know I've been going out of my way to try new rums and compare the differences. Again with the gateway thing, I started out with Puerto Rican rums not knowing much about the liquor. I now know this type has a mild profile overall, and I'm gravitating more and more to those with a more robust flavor. Evolution in action, as it were. Were I up in your neck of the woods, your Grog Log would be very appealing to me!

On 2017-03-14 16:29, tikiskip wrote:
That's why Restaurant owners LOVE smokers they EAT, they DRINK, and they don't want water with a dam lemon in it.
Smokers want dessert too because their not on a diet cus they know smoking is going to kill them so live now.

:lol: BRILLIANT!!!

I know there are bars with an "incentive program" to try all the drinks. The Tonga Hut has the Loyal Order of Drooling Bastards for anyone who tries all 78 drinks of the Grog Log.

They're.
Grammar cop must be twitchin.
"Twitchin" damn I just pissed off a spell cop.

They're is a contraction of they are. Note the spelling: The a from are is replaced by an apostrophe.

"Okay, I'm going to risk ostracism here because I know this is going to be heresy in some quarters. But I'm a relative newcomer to tiki culture, so maybe I can get away with it as I offer a newcomer's perspective"

It's good to hear input from this perspective as it can give insight to the bulk of who would come to a new tiki joint.

"I started writing out what I actually want on my opening menu"

Damn, you left out a Mai Tai the gateway drink for all tiki bar drinks.
People know of this drink too, the Mai Tai is the tiki drink that will hook em.

Damn, you left out a Mai Tai the gateway drink for all tiki bar drinks.
People know of this drink too, the Mai Tai is the tiki drink that will hook em.

No, no, no. The Mai Tai is included in the "Classics" section with the Zombie, the Singapore Sling, and others. It's on there, I promise. :)

On 2017-03-16 20:14, Prikli Pear wrote:
Okay, I'm going to risk ostracism here because I know this is going to be heresy in some quarters. But I'm a relative newcomer to tiki culture, so maybe I can get away with it as I offer a newcomer's perspective. :lol:

Maybe I'm way off base, but I would think attracting the general public and having an opportunity to educate them and cultivate their taste in cocktails is a necessity for survival.

Prikli Pear, you're right on target! The "training" definitely happened to me when I was first introduced to the resurgence of interest in Polynesian pop. (It was greatly accelerated by attending the Hukilaus over the years.) I'm glad you added this to this thread, because I think it gives the whole thread some very helpful additional dimension and perspective.

Just to do a quick recap.

1. Service is of the most paramount all around. Especially after reading reviews on here and Critiki about how even at places like Smugglers Cove poor service can put a bad light on the night.
2. I'm going to list service here again. Because that's how important it is.
3. Decor and music. You need to draw in the guests with a new and inviting atmosphere that is all encompassing and makes them want to return to discover something new.
4. Drinks, something that I thought would be the most important is really not. As you guys have said, they can be a great way to round out the theme completely, but having the absolute perfect drink may not make up for failings in numbers 1-3.

I should have my business plan finished by the end of this week to send to my SCORE advisors to see what they think. Personally, I think the numbers look good. But the upfront cost, is higher than I expected, even though I did over estimate on purpose.

Thank you ALL again for your help in this thread. It has been huge for me.

You know if you get to know your customer and talk to them know their names you will find that they cut you a lot of slack if you have a busy day or are off in your service.
Knowing your customers will also help as they can tell you of problems your place may have that you don’t know of.

Things like “hey that bartender is stealing” or that “person can’t make change” “I came in the other night and…”

Plus people like knowing the owner.
And don't do that BS "Hey how is everything tonight?" or "How's your food tasting"
Get to know them and talk as you would to a friend.

I see when places are failing the owners will hide stay in the back cuz hey who wants to face that, or even not come in at all.

But that is the time they are needed most to try and fix things, help out.

This could also be a “manager” but it’s hard to find a manager that will care as much as the owner and many times the manager is part of the problem.

In the old time successful places I see the owner is watching everything and working/helping.
Most times right next to the cash register watching the money.

The smartest thing I saw my sister do was introduce other customers to each other, now they come in to see each other.
And you don't need to entertain them as much as all their new friends are there doing it for you.

Good points, Skip. I like the idea of introducing guests to each other - you build friendships and camaraderie that way.

Reminds me of the "community table" at Trader Sam's in Orlando. You are made to sit with people you don't know, and most of the time you have a good time together and get to talk.

My mom used to do that, she would sit strangers together some time ago at Jacks.
you can't get away with that so much now.

My sister knew what half of the people who came to my place wanted before they said anything.

It was so hard when she went crying down the ally and quit one day for the 20th time.
People would want the new girl to know what they wanted the same way.

Just wanna say this has been a GREAT thread. I and friends have entertained thoughts of starting our own bar or gallery/bar, but more to indulge in the fantasy of conversation and how we'd do it. I have incredible admiration for all who follow through with their passions and wish Hale Tiki and Mikehooker sincere good luck. I hope to make it to your respective establishments one day.

The only tangental advice I can offer comes from part time consulting with my brother in law's business. After several years of r&d he formulated an excellent way to "freeze" alcohol and make true alcohol infused ice cream and sorbets. The kind you have to be 21+ to buy. Not just flavored or with deminimus amounts of spirits. Ice cream. Alcohol. What's not to love?

And that's what EVERYONE said to him while in r&d and especially when he began taste testing his products. But when it came down to actually selling the product it became a whole other challenge. Sure people liked it but would they change their habits to buy it. And buy enough and share it enough to make the business model viable? That has been a whole other challenge. Things people said would work do not always apply in practicality. You HAVE to know who you are selling to and why they will continue to patronize your establishment. Otherwise you are wasting a lot of time with what amounts to shots in the dark. And as an owner, time = money.

I also agree and would reiterate what others have said here: start smaller and let things evolve organically. Whether that's decor, an international Rum selection, or in the size of your menu or leased space. Get AMAZING at what you do first. Of course, just make sure you've got enough capacity to be sufficiently profitable. You don't want to figure out you need to do X amount of sales per week/month only to realize you'll have to be open and fully staffed 24/7 to break even.

But it sounds like you're heavily into the analysis and budgeting conservatively and as long as you keep your eyes open to what's actually going on AND since it sounds like this is your first venture of this kind, keep attuned to what others with industry experience are telling you about what's working. When you think you've got it figured out, that's when it's easiest for something to sneak up on you.

But I don't mean to end on a dour note so please keep us updated on your progress. And best of luck!

Cheers!
:drink:
Ryan

[ Edited by: finky099 2017-03-24 22:34 ]

And a very big YES to the loyalty club idea!

I'll disagree that the drinks are less important. Yeah, you're selling an "experience," but ultimately, bars sell drinks. When I go to a bar and pay money for a drink, I expect it to be good.

Service is very important. I think a bartender should be attentive (but not TOO attentive,) approachable, knowledgeable, and sure, enthusiastic. But what I really need is for him to make me a good drink. If the cocktail he sets down in front of me isn't good - or isn't a good value for the cost - I'm probably not going to stay for a second round, no matter how lofty the service. Competence is key.

It sounds like you are planning quality drinks so I don't mean to state the obvious, but it caught my eye to see drinks moved way down the list of importance. If the quality isn't there, I'm just going to think of the bar as that place that 'looks good but has lousy drinks' (Hello, Tiki Iniki) and I'm not going to return often. When I'm in a place like that I always think it's such a shame. It doesn't take that much more effort to do it right.

I think everything is important. No place is going to hit 100% perfection on every detail for every individual customer; there just needs to be a good balance of all these elements to encourage all those different people to return. As you implied: appealing to folks who aren't into "Tiki," yet inoffensive to those who are.

A place that seems to do this well is Psycho Suzi's in Minneapolis. Obviously that's a huge restaurant and beyond the scale of what you're planning, but I think it's a good example of a place that has that balance. It's not exactly authentic Tiki, but we still look forward to visiting when we're in town. On Weekends they open the upstairs, which I think is a big step up - more serious drink options, darker atmosphere, and even a live exotica band. The place will be packed - and with all manner of people: young tattooed people, after-work happy hour people, dressed-up date-night couples, families celebrating a Grandmother's birthday. All enjoying the same place. It reminds me what it must have been like at the classic bars/restaurants decades ago.

They have a gigantic tiered gimmick bowl drink that they sell a ton of - sounds ghastly to me, but really appeals to those big groups of non-purists. But they also have some nice quality-rum-focused drinks for me. In fact, the majority of the drinks upstairs. I don't think it has to be overly serious or 100% historically accurate to appeal to the enthusiasts. But it also isn't necessary to dumb it down to appeal to newcomers or casual visitors. If people can get a good drink at a fair price in an appealing atmosphere, they're likely to want to return. But it's a cocktail bar. Drinks are important.

Here's a Facebook video about hula dancing I found which really hits on the "authentic" side of things.

https://www.facebook.com/greatbigstory/videos/1668244596811300/

Just sharing this cuz its cool -- I'm not suggesting that anyone open a museum which serves drinks and food. (But if you did, I'd go!!!)

Quick update on this front. Things have definitely slowed down. While writing many other things, such as fiction, comes fairly easy to me, writing a business plan definitely does not. Also, my contact at the SBA went on vacation which kind of slowed me down a bit.

After visiting Tiki Ti over the weekend with the wife however I think I'm definitely on the right track on the size of the bar I want with it being smaller. I actually think we could be okay with going smaller than I was originally planning on budgeting for.

Just wanted to stop in and give you guys an update. I'm really hoping to keep on top of this and it's definitely not dead.

“When I go to a bar and pay money for a drink, I expect it to be good.”

Good is one thing but paying way too much for an ok drink at a boring place
Is not good.
For me most of the newer places are like this overpriced ok or bad drinks.

So if a tiki bar had GREAT drinks the best ever, but the bartender was a d!ck and the place was not fun with nobody there would you go back time and time again just for a great drink and sit all by yourself and drink it?

My point was it’s the excitement and fun that makes a place, sure you must try to always have great food, service, and drinks.

I would bet the WORST time to get a drink at the Mai Kai or any of the places that serve drinks at any Tiki Oasis bar would be when the event is going on as they are swamped.
The drink is going to be hard to get and the pour will be rushed, but that is the time everybody wants to be there.
Not for the drink, but for the excitement and fun, damn it’s hard to get ANY drink good or bad at that time.

Tiki Ti has it all great drinks, excitement and fun, awesome atmosphere the people at Tiki Ti get it.

For great drinks I stay home, no self-proclaimed “mixologist” making “handcrafted” drinks can beat that.
Well Tiki Ti can, but they are one of the few.

Just my opinion, everybody has different ideas on what they want in a night out.
I want the kind of fun we used to have at the Kahiki.

"my contact at the SBA went on vacation which kind of slowed me down a bit"

Well wait till you start to build it out, the builders will show you being slowed down a bit.

Good Luck!!

One more quick thought, how many tiki bars or events have you been to where the people that come drink or eat NOTHING.

I have seen that a lot!

Maybe that is a cheap Ohio thing.
Just to let you know the people at the bar who work there most times don't like that.

Just kidding, they hate it.

So those folks come only for the excitement and fun,atmosphere.