the great stockton islander mystery....... oooooh

okay gang, i have had this burning question on my mind for many sleepless nights in the hopes that someone may be able to offer me an answer to this great tiki mystery. as some of you know, i am a stockton islander collector-fiend, borderline obsessive compulsive but not quite at the whore-bag stage for islander items. i dont have MANY of the islander tikis, but enough to keep me satisfied (for now). during this past week, two stockton islander menus were auctioned off on ebay, which is quite unusual since they are very uncommon. in fact, the last islander menu i recall seeing on ebay was back in october of 2000 (damn you okbuyer1! i WILL hunt you down, you no good sniper!) but i digress. anyway, both menus this week went for catastrophically high prices that were not even worth bidding against. both went for over 400 bucks. however, an intriguing question was brought up in viewing both of these menus. i saved both images from the auctions.
:sheckymug:
first here is the stockton islander menu with the andreas bumatay tiki on front and a note from tommy lee (spelled tommie instead of tommy for some reason) but anyway, very nice menu, older, very cool.

:sheckymug:
now HERE is the weird part. the other menu, which appears to be a tad newer, has a note from HOP LOUIE on the back. NOT from tommy lee. im not sure if you can see it from the picture.

so some of you who are still reading this post are probably thinking, so what? it changed owners, big deal. well thats the thing. as far as i know, tommy lee had the islander until it went under, due to his gambling problems. within the stockton islander, the bar was referred to as latitude 20. as some of you know, there was another restaurant called the latitude 20 down in socal, which was owned by hop louie. latitude 20 took over the old polynesian restaurant. so was there some point when hop louie took over the stockton islander? was he responsible for naming the islander bar latitude 20? were hop louie and tommy lee the same person? oh the suspense! im really confused!

i need a drink. :drink:

Wish I could help you with that ownership question...quite possible that a fellow restauranteur stepped in to assume the debt though. Maybe Bob or Leroy at OA remember something...what about local newspaper archives, looking for old ads?

Some damn fine menus, especially the first one, never seen them... and some damn high prices, wonder who can lay down over 400.- bucks for such paper ephemera.

Do you have any Islander postcards? Sabu has a great exterior. And photos of the building (wasn't it moved to one spot from a nother?) after it closed?

I saw those menus-great ones,but the same person anteed up about $1000.00 clams for four menus just yesterday!!!Boy,to have that kind of cash for menus!!!

My understanding was that Tommy LOST the Islander in a card game- that he actually bet the restaurant on a hand. So it was under new management for a while.

The building is still there- it's called "Pollardville" I think, and is a chicken joint. It was moved to a new site on the 99 freeway just north of Stockton. Talked to a guy who watched it being moved- almost in one piece! Quite an operation.

I'm sorry Tikicleen,
All that I could come up with is a picture of Hip Hop Louie. :)

Thank you for posting those menu pics.
Did you ever have a chance to go there when you were little? I don't recall when they closed.

gee, thanks for the visual unga. i knew i could count on you! hop appears a little more younger and blue(er) than i expected. i didnt know he could turn tables too!

martiki & bigbro~ thanks for the insight. i didnt realize that he actually LOST the place in a bet. i always figured that he just lost all of his money and had to sell the place. that provokes an intersting picture though....can you see it? hop louie and tommy lee at a card table....maybe along with vic bergeron and stephen crane? gambling away their tiki treasures? makes me think of that gambling dog picture...just replace them with those tiki icons. fascinating story though.

do you really think hop and tommy were gambling buddies? to throw your restaurant on the line like that, craziness!

maybe naming the bar within the islander was a gamble too (having to name it latitude 20 after hop's establishment).

i wish i was a fly on the wall during that gambling game.

:)

Here's a picture I took in 2001 of Pollardville:

Unga Bunga, Mahalo for the welcome on the "collecting" page. I live less than one mile from the current site that holds the former Stockton, Ca Islander. It is with many mixed emotions that I have as I drive past several times a week. When I was a kid the Islander was located in Lincoln Center("the Upscale" shopping center in town)I used to often go to the Gigantic "Super Slide" which was next to the Islander. So this partially explains how TIKI was engrained in me. My step father was also one of the investors in the Islander after it was lost, due to gambling debts by Mr. Tommy Lee. The next owner lost the Islander to a wicked wife who had all the notes for loans on the place called during a bitter divorce settlement. The place literally was gone in one afternoon after the judge gave her the opportunity to have the notes called for her to get her half of the marital assets. My step father was one of a handfull of "friends" that had invested to keep this place going. He and all the others lost their loot, He also tells of stories of many many cases and shelfs full of bowls and mugs being hurled into dumpsters.My parents and their friends have said that the latitude 20 was just a asskickin' wild goodtime, great bands, cool drinks,and wild chicks. I just turned 40 and recall that this place closed around the time I was about 8 or 9 years old 1973 or 74. I'll ask the parents for sure. They think I have lost my mind for this love of TIKI, but I really dig it. It's Real..
Thanks-Hot Rod Tiki

On 2004-05-17 21:53, Hot Rod Tiki wrote:
He and all the others lost their loot, He also tells of stories of many many cases and shelfs full of bowls and mugs being hurled into dumpsters.

holly molly! ive been looking in the wrong place all this time! screw the stockton thrift stores....i need to go to the dumps!
thanks for posting hotrodtiki. its great to hear the stories, especially from someone who was there. yeah, pollardville is pretty scary. (and im not talking about its ghost town) the food is atrocious as well. i still vow to go back so i can take a picture to the last remaining carved tiki pole inside of there.

but let us admire the old building just one more time...

About six years ago--before I ever checked out Ebay-I came across a military surplus store in the bay area that also sold Otagiri (or whoever made the Islander mugs) ceramics for sale. In addition to boring, non-tiki Otagiri stuff they had TONS of Islander mugs-Coconuts ($2), pineapples ($2), small bowls($4), big bowls ($6)-maybe a couple more styles all unused and in the original protective plain brown boxes. I only bought a few of each because I was being REALLY dumb and stupid and thought the prices were a little steep because I was used to paying 50 cents to a dollar for tiki mugs!!! DUMB ME!! Finally, a couple years later I checked out Ebay and saw some of the prices in the $20 range for those items and I went back and the store was GONE! DANG ME!!!!
How is that for a stupid "the tiki that got away" story?!?!

On 2004-05-17 06:23, docwoods wrote:
I saw those menus-great ones,but the same person anteed up about $1000.00 clams for four menus just yesterday!!!Boy,to have that kind of cash for menus!!!

His name is maxifac....aka....kohalacharms. Yes, he has switched ebay user names....but his bank account is still just as big!! :D

ah-HA! so kohala has different names. veeeery clever. but the true question is, who is duosonic? i suspect this person to be on tiki central.....someone who is into fender guitars....likes photography....HMMMmmmmmmmmmmmm........

they were the one who scored the first menu. and shelled out some major dough.

on a side note: had anyone ever gone to the islander way back when? i did not grow up in this area (im from mig's current hood) i only began to learn about the islander in '96.

on another side note: anyone wanna sell me a menu from there? pleeeeease??! :) :)

Duosonic is a great guy named Tim who lives here in the Bay Area. We've gotten together a few times to swap stories and do show-and-tell with our menus and mugs....a nicer guy you'll not meet!
Anyone want to join in next time...?

I have an islander menu you may not have seen- its not pictured here

fatuhiva! PLEASE post pictures of your islander menu. the anticipation is killing me here. what year is it from? what mugs are in it? how did you find one? you are in florida, right? man, how DID you find this?

:tiki:

mr. hula~ right on with having the connections. i remember seeing you at trader vics at the crawl, but didnt get a chance to meet you. thats cool that you have a pow-wow with duosonic to show off tiki items. i would imagine that it would be quite the drool fest to an outsider. :)
if you guys ever want additional company, i would love to join up sometime. i cant promise my actions around his newly acquired islander menu though.... teehee

:tiki:

Mr. Cleen- you're more than welcome to join us next time. I'll keep you posted...and you should have introduced yourself at Vic's- I enjoy meeting new TikiCentral folks! :)

fatuhiva- is that an Islander Stockton or Islander LA menu?

maxifac/kohalacharms continues his take no prisoners bidding....$231.00 for a dinner menu???

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=29460&item=2244464141&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

Yes TikiHula, I've been meaning to get back to duosonic someday and have a little powwow - I'd love to see some of his Lanai swag, as his interest in the place seems to meet or exceed my own. I think he has a few snapshots of the interior from when it actually still existed.

Sorry - end of my off-topic post!

Back to the topic though - I do have three glass float lights purportedly from the Stockton Islander. That's another place that I'd really love to see interior photos of someday!

-Randy

Tikicleen, sup sistah! I had this "Islander" sign at the crawl, and I can't believe you didn't even pick it up.? And what about the drawing??? no love. hope you like your lamp!

aquarj~ awesome find with the floats! how do you know they are from the islander though? either way, i bet they look really sweet at your place. did you know someone affiliated with the islander? (in other words...how did you get the hook up?) :)

tikihula~ thanks for the invite. sounds like a neat way to show off the goods. i bet a lot of people would be interested in coming together for a little tiki powwow to see everyone's rare tiki finds. seriously, if you guys plan on meeting up anytime soon, i would absolutely love to sit in and be mesmorized by your finds. (that sounded really voyeristic, didnt it?)

tikitony~ you called me on it! shoot, i dont remember seeing that sign. i blame the excellent mai tais....and being drawn to that lamp. i loooooove that lamp. and YES i still want that drawing. did you ever find it? email me if you have it :) :)

so does anyone have an interior shot of the islander?? sabu? anybody?

[ Edited by: tikicleen on 2004-05-23 15:58 ]

aquarj~ awesome find with the floats! how do you know they are from the islander though?

I don't, for sure. But I got them at X-21 in SF (Valencia and 19th or 20th), and the owner is very reliable fact-wise. I think he said he got them from someone who originally bought them at some kind of Islander auction/sale a while ago. He had probably eight or so, with some hanging in the display window in the front and more in the back. They're clearly old and used, but there's no direct evidence of the Islander on them. I know a few other local TCers were aware of them, but dunno if anyone else bought any. Hope I'm not revealing the location of someone's favorite resource, but X-21 is a great store and a fun place to visit.

Last time I was there maybe a month ago, they still had one - a light purple float with net in the downstairs area. The floats are a bit pricey, but they're huge (maybe 20-24" diameter). Also, when I got mine the owner was willing to deal a little bit (just a little) because he'd had them for a while. They also had a freestanding 3-4' Witco cat for about $75 I think, but I bet that's gone by now.

-Randy