How are you promoting Tiki?

I loaned my Tiki Magazines, and my "Tiki Style" book to a new club owner/manager, and I sent him here of course, to get ideas and to hopefully point him in the right direction.

This thread.. man, I need to just step away from the keyboard and leave.

But I just can't.

Just for clarification, this isn't meant to be read in a mean spirited way at all, it is just how I feel.

Tiki does not need to be promoted. Tiki isn't a band looking for a break, or a product for sale to the public. It isn't a social services agency, or an event, it isn't a religion, and it isn't a fad.

Tiki is a hobby. For many of us it is an obsession, but for most it is simply a pop culture phenomena similar quite frankly to Goth culture, Sci-Fi Con folk, Ren Faires, and similar such things. Sure, plenty of people will be insulted by the comparison, ("Hey man, we aren't like Trekies or those Ren fairies!") but the truth is we are. To the outside world we are.

If we are going to talk about "promoting tiki" as though it needs a boardroom marketing survey to justify itself, then we may as well talk about market perception and potential, and the market perception as I see it is that we are a bunch of loud shirt wearing, drunken nerds that collect junk store ceramics and pretend to be naive 50's tourists on holiday. And the market potential is obvious to any regular Target shopper: cheap, watered-down tiki in neon colors sells well enough to folks who want to host a "tropical party" at the office on Friday, or those who wish to spin some reggae and drink Corona out of a pink plastic tiki mug on Cinco De Mayo, to justify a product line.

This does not belittle the efforts of those of you who spend enormous amounts of energy (and money) creating websites, art, events, literature, etc. on the subject of tiki. I personally do most of those things myself as well. But I don't do it out of some desire to push tiki forward to the masses. I don't feel like I "owe it to tiki". It is my thing, so I do it. I also don't expect a living out of it, or even any kudos from the world at large.

The folks that play softball in the park near my house have never tried to recruit me in the greater interests of promoting softball or anything weird like that. It is their thing, so they do it. Why is tiki any different?

Here's what I personally would have liked to have seen as responses to this thread:

"I go to the Mai Kai as much as possible to eat/drink and I tip the staff well."

"I support my local tiki bar/restaurant with my business on a regular basis."

"I try to send business to local tiki joints by telling my friends and out of town guests how great these spots are."

"I try to preserve the stories of the generation of folks who built, own/owned, etc. these places that I love so much."

"I try to support the newly emerging tiki establishments with both my business, and my help if possible."

I dunno, maybe it's just me, and I'm just a flake (true), and I really shoulda just left this thing alone like I said. I knew it'd read all preachy, which generally isn't me at all, but..

Promote your tiki art, tiki products, tiki events, tiki websites, etc.
And by all means, introduce and cultivate new people that have sought out and are receptive to learning about tiki. Makes for more Mai Kai customers and keeps them in business.

But promote tiki itself? I'm scratching my head on this one. Maybe it's just semantics and I'm being picky.

Ahu

Some good points there.

The way I look at this thread is that classic Tiki joints are going away faster than they are being built. If the people who own these properties realize that Tiki is becoming popular again, they might think twice before they tear down or transform what could be a real cash cow. Try as you may, you can't materialize the patina that a classic establishment gains over time with so many activities and great memories.

I happen to live in a town where all of the Tiki places have been sacked, so when I "Promote Tiki" , pardon the ambiguity, I am doing it to establish a social circle of like minded folks to thereby get the ball rolling in earnest. Private gatherings, support of our local bar ( if, when, where )etc.

No need to over think this one.

T.F.

Build it. Carve it. Mix it. Live and enjoy it..

I'm with KuKuAhu, and couldn't have said it better. (Raises mug to KuKuAhu!)

No need to proselytize, there's more than enough of that going around.

Instead, I support what's left, research what was, and from time to time throw my own here at the Lounge of the Seven Pleasures. There's a small knot of us Md/DC/VA Tikiphiles and we have a website- people who are interested find us. Moral of the story- hang out a shingle, people will find you, after all isn't that what TC itself is?

My friends and relatives know this is my 'hobby', and get into the spirit of the thing perhaps a bit more than some of the other 'friends and family' stories I hear from time to time here on TC. My folks are respectful, they enjoy the Lounge, and they like the Volcano bowls at tribal gathering.

If friends want to meet up at a Tiki event, or a Tiki venue in some city that's neat. Friends who visit the Lounge almost immediately notice the book of Tiki I leave out on one of the tables, they thumb through it or the Grog Log as I mix them a Mai Tai and they get a hint of what the real is- but it's up to them whether it's just a nice place to sit, listen to some Arthur Lyman and have a drink and talk with a friend, or of they're really fascinated by what this place is and the history of places like it. Anyone wanting more is pointed towards TC, but I don't go around leaving TC cards as in airport bathrooms.

Now, all that said, I did once receive a "tiki tract" as part of an e-bay for a Tiki item, and it had me laughing good and hard, BUT it was from from a Tiki person to a Tiki person, an internal joke, as Tiki sure as hell doesn't need evangelizing tracts! If anything, it more pokes fun at the act of proselytizing itself.

The very notion of something so relaxing and take life as it comes out proselytizing is laughable on the face of it.

And anyone caught doing so around my bar will be sent over the side of the island with the headhunters.

I've tried, and it doesnt really work too well. not many people really give a shit. I got in early, collected cool shit. took up carving, and sold plenty at every hukilau, thanks only to you tiki lovers (and I sell cheap or give it to deserving people). never been a "tiki snob". yeah I got alot of cooler stuff than you and I dont give a rats ass. mugs? got em stacked here and there, only from original restaurants, which is all that matters. if it didnt have a drink in it, it does'nt matter. why have it? only cause I like it. so I've pretty much inclosed myself in my own private island, and dont speak of it anymore to outsiders. seems like when you've got a secret that others discover, then they are more interested. so come over for a drink and be surprised or dont. it's all cool. oh yeah! theres others like me who dont try to spread the gospel to deaf ears, so we formed our little circle called the fraternal order of moai. come visit our little island, only if your serious. tiki is still spoken here. and everyone is equal.

On 2006-05-26 09:09, KuKuAhu wrote:
This thread.. man, I need to just step away from the keyboard and leave.

But I just can't.

Just for clarification, this isn't meant to be read in a mean spirited way at all, it is just how I feel.

Tiki does not need to be promoted. Tiki isn't a band looking for a break, or a product for sale to the public. It isn't a social services agency, or an event, it isn't a religion, and it isn't a fad.

Tiki is a hobby. For many of us it is an obsession, but for most it is simply a pop culture phenomena similar quite frankly to Goth culture, Sci-Fi Con folk, Ren Faires, and similar such things. Sure, plenty of people will be insulted by the comparison, ("Hey man, we aren't like Trekies or those Ren fairies!") but the truth is we are. To the outside world we are.

If we are going to talk about "promoting tiki" as though it needs a boardroom marketing survey to justify itself, then we may as well talk about market perception and potential, and the market perception as I see it is that we are a bunch of loud shirt wearing, drunken nerds that collect junk store ceramics and pretend to be naive 50's tourists on holiday. And the market potential is obvious to any regular Target shopper: cheap, watered-down tiki in neon colors sells well enough to folks who want to host a "tropical party" at the office on Friday, or those who wish to spin some reggae and drink Corona out of a pink plastic tiki mug on Cinco De Mayo, to justify a product line.

This does not belittle the efforts of those of you who spend enormous amounts of energy (and money) creating websites, art, events, literature, etc. on the subject of tiki. I personally do most of those things myself as well. But I don't do it out of some desire to push tiki forward to the masses. I don't feel like I "owe it to tiki". It is my thing, so I do it. I also don't expect a living out of it, or even any kudos from the world at large.

The folks that play softball in the park near my house have never tried to recruit me in the greater interests of promoting softball or anything weird like that. It is their thing, so they do it. Why is tiki any different?

Here's what I personally would have liked to have seen as responses to this thread:

"I go to the Mai Kai as much as possible to eat/drink and I tip the staff well."

"I support my local tiki bar/restaurant with my business on a regular basis."

"I try to send business to local tiki joints by telling my friends and out of town guests how great these spots are."

"I try to preserve the stories of the generation of folks who built, own/owned, etc. these places that I love so much."

"I try to support the newly emerging tiki establishments with both my business, and my help if possible."

I dunno, maybe it's just me, and I'm just a flake (true), and I really shoulda just left this thing alone like I said. I knew it'd read all preachy, which generally isn't me at all, but..

Promote your tiki art, tiki products, tiki events, tiki websites, etc.
And by all means, introduce and cultivate new people that have sought out and are receptive to learning about tiki. Makes for more Mai Kai customers and keeps them in business.

But promote tiki itself? I'm scratching my head on this one. Maybe it's just semantics and I'm being picky.

Ahu

I agree with this post.

With respect to those who've commented on this thread, it's a lot easier to say that Tiki doesn't need to be promoted when you have a great deal of Tiki locally available to you. There are still many parts of the country that don't have Tiki and it's in those places that people especially need to make the extra effort to make people aware that such a thing as Tiki exists. No conversions, shouting from the mount or sacred ceremonies. Just making people aware or (if there are people in the area searching for Tiki) that people of like mind are within the area.

Recent TC posts and conversation I had with a gentleman in CA. have cited the recent or impending closing of several classic Tiki establishments. I have to think that more promotion of Tiki would either have held off that figurative "wrecking ball" for a while longer or perhaps indefinitely if more people had been to these places. In my opinion, it's hard to keep a thing alive when knowledge of it's existence is limited.

Regarding KuKuAhu's post. Unless I'm mistaken, there have been more than a few comments of people supporting and promoting new and established tiki locales, arts, customs and traditions on this thread, so I'd respectfully ask Ahu to please re-read the posts on this thread and reconsider the "Here's what I personally would have liked to have seen as responses to this thread:" statement, in addition to comments that follow this sentence. I say this with respect and sincerity.

Finally, another suggestion for a bumper sticker: "Tiki-Indulge in the Exotic"

"It's kind of fun to do the impossible"
-Walt Disney

[ Edited by: caerthe 2006-05-26 23:09 ]

Oh, I have certainly read those posts, and I'd like to think I know who is carrying the torch among them.

What I take issue with (if you care to know the truth) is a Johnny Come Lately asking established caretakers of the flame what they have "done for the cause". This is not a promotional issue, and the question itself bears extreme scrutiny. This is not a cause at all. It merely is what it is. No one here needs to justify their contribution to anyone, and certainly not to a recent convert.

No personal offense intended, but really...

We have been here for a long time. Where were you?

Ahu

On 2006-05-27 00:16, KuKuAhu wrote:
Oh, I have certainly read those posts, and I'd like to think I know who is carrying the torch among them.

What I take issue with (if you care to know the truth) is a Johnny Come Lately asking established caretakers of the flame what they have "done for the cause". This is not a promotional issue, and the question itself bears extreme scrutiny. This is not a cause at all. It merely is what it is. No one here needs to justify their contribution to anyone, and certainly not to a recent convert.

No personal offense intended, but really...

We have been here for a long time. Where were you?

Ahu

No one should be above question. Regardless of when and where they joined the ranks....or how many posts they have on this list. I say ranks because you imply there is some form seniority. I have no issue with anyone keeping the flame alive and so when I inquire as to how they do so or how they shine that light to those in the darkness, you essentially declare the subject as taboo and lob in a few polite insults to boot? For someone who claims to be taking an "accept tiki for what it is" stand you seem to have some rather rigid concepts of what it is and what it isn't. And who should be allowed to play.

Funny, I didn't see a "For Existing Members Only" warning on the front cover of The Book of Tiki.

Maybe I am in the wrong and I just haven't read the Tiki Enthusiast Guidebook or some similar text as to how "Jonny Come Lately's" are supposed to act. Figured I was an adult, speaking with other adults. In any case, please enlighten me as to where I can find such an enlightening tome and I'll make sure to order a copy.

I warn you that if Tiki is to continue, then new faces and new attitudes will always be needed. If you attempt to stem that influx of new energy, then all your contributions will be for naught, as what you love will surely die.

Remember that old saying "If love something, set it free....."

Rank? Please. That and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee at the diner.

You ask the wrong questions. You don't listen to the answers or heed the advice. You pass along a million reasons why you cannot take said advice, and then you proceed to tell all of us the answers to your own questions.

Give me a break. Anyone here can go back and read through your posts and see this.

If you wanna preach to the preachers then you'd better know the word.

Ahu

Kuku's got an absinthe hangover.

The sardonic beauty and effortless sneering of his posts are enhanced and have a green tinge to them.
(O-H...)

I promote Tiki with Tiki Kneepads sold in convenience stores all over this great land of ours.

(with a nod to Sabu and Dr. Z... but no royalties from the sales)

On 2006-05-27 06:58, KuKuAhu wrote:
Rank? Please. That and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee at the diner.

You ask the wrong questions. You don't listen to the answers or heed the advice. You pass along a million reasons why you cannot take said advice, and then you proceed to tell all of us the answers to your own questions.

Give me a break. Anyone here can go back and read through your posts and see this.

If you wanna preach to the preachers then you'd better know the word.

Ahu

Damn... Ahu, you've really gone too far this time. A "million reasons"? Seriously now. Maybe just a couple hundred, but a million? Other than that you are spot on!

Maybe as happens so frequently online, tone of voice in some of the earlier posts got lost. KuKu made it pretty clear in his original post that he wasn't snarping at anyone, he just took a different point of view. Maybe this is a misunderstanding, is all I'm saying. It's worth going back and re-reading, if only to check and see if it sounds the same after some time has gone by.

Now, that said-

Caerthe, pause for just a second here. KuKu is in Ohio (which within recent memory lost the Kahiki) Ohio ain't exactly teeming with Tiki- trust me (although the tropical bistro has taken up the great task of carrying what it can of Kahiki's torch), Ohio's relatively bare, I know, I'm from thereabouts. I'm sitting in Maryland- a state that seems to think brick is a far better building material than bamboo- more's the pity. I just found out last night that we've just seen the beginnings of the 'remodeling' of our legendary Vera's White Sands (the Solomon's Island Tiki Bar is Bosko-ed OUT! But that that's another spankin' new thing!) If anyone knows the anguish of being in a Tiki dry spell, it's folks like us- all three of us, that is. And trust me, I understand the anguish. It can be lonely, and unsatisfying.

I know that it can be incredibly upsetting to see temples closing going by in posts on TC. Sam's closing is breaking my heart, which I thought was already broken due to the Royal Hawaiian closing. But these are not the first to go, and I'm sad to say, won't be the last. In Chicago alone, places as memorable as the Trader Vics in the Palmer House and as only seen and appreciated by a few like Rock-A-Tiki have disappeared on my watch- gone on, past on beyond the horizon, we'll sail there no more. If I were to sit and try to list all the Temples that have fallen on my watch, I'd be cryin' in my Suffering Bastard.

BUT, many of the places on that sad list have not closed due to being unknown, or uncrowded. Our own beloved Honolulu in Virginia closed its doors as part of a highway project. Each place has it's own reasons, and perhaps it's own lifespan. So many Tiki Temples are tied to individuals, or families and as the families go through changes so do our Beloved Tiki places.

As for 'promotion' I've already said pretty clearly where I stand, but I will add one last little bit. I'm part of a number of different 'alternative' communities, and our distinctives- jewelry, symbols, clothing, etc. etc. are not about advertising our presence to people who aren't hip to whatever it is I'm showing some connection to, instead it's about recognizing one another. Being on the metro (around DC) and seeing someone wearing the 'tribal markings' of whatever tribe I happen to be a part of can be a means by which to recognize one another and stumble across someone I happen to have something in common with. Whether we talk or not, it can be good to know you're 'not the only one'. Odds are, if you're looking to connect with other PRE-EXISTING Tiki folks, something as simple as wearing a Tiki necklace will have friends and strangers alike showing up from time to time saying "HEY- that's a Tiki isn't it? Excellent!"

Finally, any notion of Tiki rank? (Sabina threatens to snort Mai Tai out her nose!) "Tiki Rank" is akin to a Mai Tai made with pineapple juice and grenadine- it ain't no Mai Tai!

[ Edited by: Sabina 2006-05-27 10:20 ]

I'm a little confused. Is someone really finding a problem with the intent of this thread? With so many longtime keepers of the flame responding to it honestly and without finding the question insulting, I just can't see why anyone would?

Am I just reading it wrong?

Is it the fact that the thread poster's number of posts is low that makes him a "johnny come lately" or something like that?

Am I just confused? (that would be preferable because I like this place for it's open mindedness and friendliness)

My friends probably think of me as a tiki missionary attempting to spread the word. Isn't it natural to want to turn people you like onto something they don't realize is out there and fun? have you ever suggested a band or a restaurant to a friend, or even a stranger? Is that a bad thing?
Is it wrong to then ask other people you know are into something, how they spread the word? Ya know, to give yourself ideas?

Also, is my post number too low to ask all these questions? :wink:

[ Edited by: the Granite Tiki 2006-05-27 11:03 ]

Before I discovered TC I have been heavily into Tiki all my life and my parents were Tikiphiles in it's original heyday. I showed the argument segment of this thread to my mom who has been to most of the West Coast and Hawiian hotspots duriing the mid 50's and 60's and she laughed her head off in disbelief.

What's is the point of baiting an argument over Tiki? Really? Think about it. What came first the Tiki or the Tikiphile? What does it all mean? One thing I am sure of is that there is no valid reason to put someone down over Tiki.

This would have been a great skit for Mr. Show.

T.F.

Recent TC posts and conversation I had with a gentleman in CA. have cited the recent or impending closing of several classic Tiki establishments. I have to think that more promotion of Tiki would either have held off that figurative "wrecking ball" for a while longer or perhaps indefinitely if more people had been to these places. In my opinion, it's hard to keep a thing alive when knowledge of it's existence is limited. Unless I'm mistaken, there have been more than a few comments of people supporting and promoting new and established tiki locales, arts, customs and traditions on this thread....please re-read the posts on this thread and reconsider the "Here's what I personally would have liked to have seen as responses to this thread:" statement, in addition to comments that follow this sentence.

wow.
this is well past the point of being over anal-ized.
such dogma and verbosity attached to something that originated in the casual laid back tropical isles.
stop while yer ahead. don't give islanders more reason to continue saying 'mainlanders are weird...'

On 2006-05-27 07:30, pablus wrote:

Kuku's got an absinthe hangover.

The sardonic beauty and effortless sneering of his posts are enhanced and have a green tinge to them.
(O-H...)

Absinthe hangover for sure. Add some rum and some Carling Black Label on there too. And about a million cheap cigarettes.

That last one.. yes, sneering. The first two.. those were just in the spirit of what I felt when I read the initial post of this thread.

(I-O!)

I promote Tiki with Tiki Kneepads sold in convenience stores all over this great land of ours.

Laff! I need a Demerara dry float. Pab, you busy? Can I stop by?

Ahu

Did you know that the Dry Float is one of my top three favorites or was it just buckeye synchronicity?

I'll mix us a Dry Float... and then we'll do a couple of Test Pilots with my homemade falernum and we'll talk about ways to promote tiki. Better yet, we'll write a song about it on ukes and try to get it firmly placed within the mainstream pop music genre.

Maybe we'll get to meet Madonna.

And kill her.

Get that Britney Spears, too. And her white trash husband, yo...There's a bottle of Rhum JM 1975 in it for you...

Memorable Quotes?

Mars Attacks (1996)
President Dale(Jack Nicholson): "Why can't we work out our differences? Why can't we work things out? TIKI people, why can't we all just get along?" *

*The word 'Tiki' was added in place of the word 'Little', a creative edit on my part...

Aloha y'all! :D :drink: :D --TravelingJones saiz: "Line'em up Barkeep, Pusser's and Pyrat's on me!!!"

Some great posts here. I tend to side with those who feel that "promotion" is kind of the wrong concept with regard to tiki in the first place. But I also think that jumping up there even as a relative newcomer and starting a thread that brings out all these thoughtful posts is an accomplishment in itself, and I salute caerthe for having done it.

When I was as new to TC as caerthe is now, I was quite insecure, and my posts always seemed to be thread-killers. Come to think of it, this is still the case even now...

Sartre was wrong about Stalin and a great many other things, but he did say, "Hell is other people." And "promotion" would involve all those other people who I wouldn't even want handling my record albums without latex gloves. Oh, none of you folks of course, but you know what I mean...

(Yes, of course I'm kidding. Sort of.)

Oh yeah, and to answer the question, I interweave tiki into my conversations with a friend or two whom I think might be interested, as well as sending links to interesting and/or amusing TC threads in Emails once in a while. Like the recent one about the old topless tiki joint Albuquerque. I'll include an exotica piece in a mix of music I share with a friend too, now and then.

It all sounds pretty snoozeworthy, but there is a fancy phrase for this sort of thing, as you know: "viral marketing," though I just call it "sharing with a friend."

Remember my favorite Psychology quote: "All people really want is games worth playing". Tiki is just a game. Some of us are looking for playmates to play it with, which is natural, and others rightly are worried that the fun is spoiled if the rules of the game are bent to the degree that it is not the original anymore.

I think it was an honest and interesting question, not implying anybody HAD to promote it. I try do put out what I think is quality imagery and info, and just hope people get it, and many do, but many don't. Only here on TC do I get Big Brother-like, because I figure that if people have come this far, they are asking for definite guidance.

I feel that for TC, this was a very good argument session, a real inspired example of Tiki fervor we have not seen for a while...while for the outside world, it went a little too far out on a bender.

Seriously, if you ask me ( my advice: don't:) ) just enjoying it old school is the best way. People will find it through osmosis if they are really interested in the nitty gritty. Either they dig it or they don't. The whole business with "Promoting Tiki" does have slight hint of a Jehova's Witness ring to me. In the old days of the Tiki revival (yes, I said it, but I saw it) there definitely was more of a solid undercurrent of urban archeology, preservation, and genuine interest in where all this came from and how to keep it pure and real as a genre. Everybody into it at least had the Book Of Tiki. Then Party City and Big Lots started selling Tikis. Then Old Navy started faking vintage Aloha shirts. Enter the "Wow...fck yeah! I don't really know fer Tiki but I know's a party...whoooow!!" crowd. Then a lot of people started to interpret Tiki culture by the "party hearty and who cares about the rest" standard instead of the "party and celebrate and learn about and preserve a true thing of beauty" standard. Lots more good talk story in the latter than in the former. There's a big mana difference when looking at a drunken dolt at a frat party with a crap drink in some big, goofy mask with a Fez and a cigar dancing around in flip flops (That sort of parrothead witch doctor conventioneer meets Jeff Spicoli thing that the chain stores have going on) versus staring in awe at the sheer majesty and class of the Mai Kai or a well preserved Trader Vic's for the first time, or gasping for breath as you lay eyes on an Imperial Luau tiki or Mr. Bali Hai or an Ed Crissman work of art. It's like visiting a Pac Sun store versus visiting the Sistine Chapel. No comparison. But at the root that's why it clicks out so much right now. There's nothing like the real thing. Old Coke versus new Coke. I thing as long as you keep it core and keep enjoying it as we all know it can be, eventually the shtty formula will get phased out and the classic will stand. Vic and Don and Steve and the Thornton Brothers had it right the first time. 72 years proves it. They wrote the Tiki Constitution in my book. It brought the people and gave them joy then, and it still does. (All opinions here, folks, and only opinions, and everybody knows I'm opinionated).

In the old days of the Tiki revival (yes, I said it, but I saw it) there definitely was more of a solid undercurrent of urban archeology, preservation, and genuine interest in where all this came from and how to keep it pure and real as a genre.

uh, which tiki revival? really bk, there were more, before.

There's a big mana difference when looking at a drunken dolt at a frat party with a crap drink in some big, goofy mask with a Fez and a cigar dancing around in flip flops

(what is 'flip flops'?)

why you using the word "mana" as if it applies here?
be careful. show respect; that is an ancient Hawaiian word that should never be employed in modern drunken frat boy fad culture conversation.
nor does it apply. nor is it appropriate.

talk about 'old days'...
does anyone know what
'old days tiki' is?

I thing as long as you keep it core ...
eventually the sh*tty formula will get phased out and the classic will...

my point; someone's 'core' is someone else's 'sh#itty formula".
'the real thing' is fully, completely unknown nowadays.

as the old bard reminds us in Hamlet: "There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy"

[ Edited by: lanikai 2006-05-28 03:33 ]

We're speaking of the only tiki revival any of us are around to see, Lani. Should I have said Polynesian Pop revival? Do you want a count on how many times the word "mana" gets used around here, whether you dream it's right or wrong "in your philosophy, Horatio?" :) "What is flip flops?" c'mon, man..context. And I would take a good look around here or my house before you start accusing me of not respecting Polynesian culture. That's intrensic to respecting tiki. Which is a large part of my point.

why you using the word "mana" as if it applies here?
be careful. show respect; that is an ancient Hawaiian word that should never be employed in modern drunken frat boy fad culture conversation.

Hey lanikai, for someone who intentionally misuses the english language at will, you sure are selective (and bossy) about your language sensitivity. I know several Hawaiians who use the word 'mana' and other traditional words much more casually than you would prescribe with your newly minted rule ("no use when discussing fad culture"). Your kind of rules for using Hawaiian words are actually kind of colloquially interesting, but you seem to take more pleasure out of correcting people than out of discussing the actual topic. You're welcome to your opinions, but I don't get what's so attractive about combating the casual friendly atmosphere both here and in Hawaii, especially for someone who often seems to want to act as a Hawaiian spokesman. To paraphrase...

Such dogma attached to something that originated in the casual laid back tropical isles.

Thank goodness no one has taken up correcting you on your selective misuse of english when you switch to pidgin; that would be even duller than when you correct them. But the upshot is that you're being more dogmatic than they are.

-Randy

Do you want a count on how many times the word "mana" gets used around here,

true. many times, here. didn't mean to single ya out... it's the timing i guess. after many maitais and I post at three ayem. I read it now, yea. looks dogmatic awritee.

On 2006-05-27 18:59, pablus wrote:
Did you know that the Dry Float is one of my top three favorites or was it just buckeye synchronicity?

Well, we seem to share similar taste in cocktails (sour, bitter, boozy, dry), but I did happen to know that you fancy the DDF. It is a fine drink.

I'll mix us a Dry Float... and then we'll do a couple of Test Pilots with my homemade falernum and we'll talk about ways to promote tiki.

I'll run off some brochures we can hand out. Oh, and I'll bring ya a fifth of my latest batch of ninnie or maybe even the tropical honey liqueur.

Better yet, we'll write a song about it on ukes and try to get it firmly placed within the mainstream pop music genre.

Maybe we'll get to meet Madonna.

And kill her.

Can I get a bl*w job from her first? I like the gap in her teeth.

Ahu

[ Edited by: KuKuAhu 2006-05-28 19:01 ]

Caerthe writes:
"Maybe I am in the wrong and I just haven't read the Tiki Enthusiast Guidebook or some similar text as to how "Jonny Come Lately's" are supposed to act."

No, I don't believe you are wrong.
As I have seen here, a reasonable question can turn into an all out "who's who." Who cares. (?) I believe, as with most threads here, you are dealing with ONE person who actually lives in Hawaii. I have never understood the rants from Ohio, Oakland, Florida or where ever these cats live who want to come out and proclaim their all holy devotion to tiki....it's a passionate pass-time, I have no doubt, but I do not understand the slamming of someone simply asking a question.
Maybe the people who are 2000 and 3000 miles away from the islands should pack up and dive into their passion....could be, will be, quite an eye-opener.
XXXOOO Ivy

"Tiki" in the context we're talking about here, is more polynesian pop than Polynesian Islands.
So Ohio, and particulary Columbus, is definitely in the know and has a decent history regarding that aspect of "the culture".

As for me, I'd love to move to Kauai or the Big Island and may someday, but socio-economic factors preclude me from doing so at this time. So Tampa it is.

Further, I personally wouldn't be surprised by anything on the islands except how crappy and lame my Hawai'ian is. And maybe just how long of a longboard it would take to get me wave-borne.

Last, nobody is ranting here. I haven't seen any caps or exclamation points. This is a polite board but people are allowed to have discourse and disagreement as long as they remain civil. Which this thread certainly is.

There doesn't have to be sides taken and lines drawn.
But there does have to be Mai Tais poured. And Test Pilots.

Wow.

A lot happens when you're gone for the holiday. Some very good discussion.

Now back to promot.....er seems a few of you don't like that word. Ok "Tiki Awareness".

(ahem)

Now back to encouraging tiki awareness. There's a certain festival occurring in our fair city (The Dragon Boat Festival) in which it seems doing something to encourage tiki awareness, might be a good idea. The festival often features Polynesian dancers and some forms of perceived island entertainment, so I'm wondering if anyone out there has done something to increase tiki awareness in such a venue?

The following is just brainstorming. Respectfully, I mentioned that some of my ideas were just "brainstorms" earlier and I think that was forgotten.

Now back to our regularly scheduled post...

-Another organization I'm associated with often conducts "demos" in which we attempt to offer a small sample of what the organization is about. Generally, there's an art, entertainment and sport element to these and I'm thinking that something similar might work. Possibly some music (either recorded or live) and examples or demonstrations of art (tiki carving, general tiki art, presentation of a tiki mug collection, etc) might be something. I really don't know if there's anything that could be considered a sport for tiki.

-Sponsor or build a Dragon Boat. This might be something better suited for our local kinetics race.

Thoughts?

On 2006-05-29 20:57, caerthe wrote:
Wow. A lot happens when you're gone for the holiday. Some very good discussion.

Now back to promot.....er seems a few of you don't like that word. Ok "Tiki Awareness".

(ahem)Now back to encouraging tiki awareness. entioned that some of my ideas were just "brainstorms" earlier and I think that was forgotten.

Now back to our regularly scheduled post...Thoughts?

Actually, When I read this post, I thought it was more sharing or awareness, I didn't take it as "promotion or marketing, hence why I shared the party story. Good thread, just goes to show how the written word is interpeted amoung a group.

Amy

The quest to learn never ends.

Bump

Great thread Caerthe!

Although I do understand what the detractors are saying on this thread, I don't find the word "promote" to be derogatory.

Somewhere out there, is a baseball cap'd, Abercrombie and Fitch tee-shirt wearing guy, who, when with his friends from college would see a flowered shirted guy,
drinking a "girlie" drink, would shout out something nasty, but maybe a few months later, or even a few years later, he might stumble into some almost tiki event, or "on the fringe of" tiki experience, (maybe even one brought about by this thread, or a thread like it) and realize, " hey, I like this feeling" or "hey, that tastes f*cking great!" and who knows, maybe that formerly baseball cap'd, abercrombie and fitch tee-shirt wearing guy will then become a fez wearing, Hawaiian shirt clad, tiki worshiping guy who just might by me a Mai-Tai at some future Hukilau!!!

Okay, if you haven't figured it out yet, I'm drunk.

Great thread, go forth and multiply!

[ Edited by: The Granite Tiki 2006-05-30 23:38 ]

Abercrombie and fitch makes fake "vintage" Hawaiian shirts, too. Proof the clowns have taken over the circus...

On 2006-05-31 07:52, Basement Kahuna wrote:
Abercrombie and fitch makes fake "vintage" Hawaiian shirts, too. Proof the clowns have taken over the circus...

In the spirit of BK's post, I'll give you eleven reasons why "promoting tiki" is a foolish idea:

..and no, the image is not retouched in any way save for the text I added across the bottom. The rest is as I found it on a Google image search of "tiki".

Support tiki, don't promote it.

Ahu

If you think this forum is about Hawaii and South Sea islands, you have not "gotten it" yet.

"Tiki" as we pursue it here is more about Cleveland, Columbus, Chicago, New York and DC than about Tahiti.

It's the pop culture re-creation of Polynesia that's our oasis. Borrowing and bastardizing. Akin to the relationship of Hapa Haole music to Hawaiian chant.

Credentials of an island nature are only marginally meaningful here. Columbus was closer to our heart than Waikiki. I'd rather go to the Munich Trader Vic's than Oahu for tiki. I'd rather see the Mai Kai dancers than the ones on the Big Island. Rather go back and visit Kon Tiki's various incarnations around the US than Diamond Head.

I'm glad Gecko is working to make Hawaii more like it was 40 years ago if I do travel there, but I am much more interested in helping Martiki and others make the mainland US more like it was 40 years ago.

On 2006-05-31 08:13, KuKuAhu wrote:

Support tiki, don't promote it.

Ahu

c'mon ahu, take a look at the market shares projected here. i am still working on our critcal-path gantt chart, but our numbers show solid growth throughout the third and fourth quarter.

You know Ahu, I guess you're completely right.

Only those, currently aware of tiki and Polynesian pop, should be the ones in the know. So, from now on, go to your local tiki establishment (if you have one) and support your local tiki event (if you have one) and make every effort to avoid a photo of some drunken kids from becoming a reality.

Sheesh. It took you this long to find something so rare as this picture? I could've dismissed at least zillion suggestions and ideas, or (taking your lead) thought of more pop stars with supposedly loose morals and spaces between their teeth in the time it took you to find this gem.

I wonder what the original creators of this lifestyle would've thought if they'd been told that one day a bunch of drunken kids, between 18-22, were seen in a photo wearing a shoddy attempt at native/island costume? Probably would've invited them over to their place for a taste of the real experience.

But don't get me wrong Ahu, I'm coming around to your philosophy of keeping the knowledge restricted or suppressed in order to avoid any contamination. After all, why should anyone else be allowed to mess with our glass menagerie?

Oh, just a suggestion to those viewing these posts, I propose the creation of a new TC thread. This thread would serve no other purpose than for those new to TC to repeatedly post empty replies in order to get their post count up into the 300-500+ range so they aren't accused of being the uninitiated by those afraid to loose their place or become supplanted in the great tome of tiki history.

Thanks for the photo Ahu. A true classic.

On 2006-05-31 08:48, caerthe wrote:
You know Ahu, I guess you're completely right.

Glad you see it my way. Now let's get back to discussing mai tais and Bill Sapp.

Thanks for the photo... A true classic.

No problem. It is a classic. I call it "Griki".

Ahu

i am still working on our critcal-path gantt chart, but our numbers show solid growth throughout the third and fourth quarter.

Johnny, the memo I got said the board needs those charts for the afternoon meeting. You'd better call marketing asap and see if graphics is finished with them yet. I'd like to have our sales staff out there with a solid direction starting next week if we are gonna be ready for the International Tiki Day promotional drive. The public needs to know, damnit.

Ahu

That's a wonderful idea Ahu!

I'm willing to bet that businesses like Tiki Farm, Muntiki and Tiki Magazine do have some demographic info they could share. They are all businesses that I have great respect for, but they are businesses after all (like just about anyone who makes $ from tiki) and it would make sense that they have a larger perspective on the tiki resurgence, than most.

I'm sure myself and many of those who aspire to encourage tiki awareness in their area would greatly appreciate this info. Also, anyone willing to share some of their business plan (I'm thinking Forbidden Island) to help folks start their own tiki establishments, preferably in tiki desolate areas, would also be much appreciated.

Anyway, if there were to be a National Tiki Day, we'd certainly need to know whom we send our message. Great idea!

"It's kind of fun to do the impossible"
-Walt Disney

[ Edited by: caerthe 2006-05-31 09:17 ]

On 2006-05-31 09:16, caerthe wrote:

Anyway, if there were to be a National Tiki Day, we'd certainly need to know whom we send our message. Great idea!

Caerthe, International Tiki Day is the second Saturday of August. Do a search on it.

On 2006-05-31 09:26, Hakalugi wrote:

On 2006-05-31 09:16, caerthe wrote:

Anyway, if there were to be a National Tiki Day, we'd certainly need to know whom we send our message. Great idea!

Caerthe, International Tiki Day is the second Saturday of August. Do a search on it.

Caerthe didn't get the memo? Somebody is so fired.

Okay, we get it. You're not interested in promoting Tiki.

Keep it pure. Don't let the frat boys in. Accept no new members to the fold unless they come in on their own with no recruting attempts. We get it.

The Book of Tiki is not to be loaned out without a historical fact check:

"are you, or have you ever been a member of a frat...?"

We must keep it pure and prevent popularization at all costs.

So let it be written, so let it be done... etc. etc. etc.

Which is odd, because I never said any of that. If that is what you are "getting" from my posts, then.. well, you aren't "getting it" after all.

Ahu