is this what tiki culture is becoming? if so are you ok with it?

Lucas, you are a nice person in your own sadistic & twisted way!

Ok fine, I'm obviously horrified by the video on a few levels. But I'm confused by what exactly is in question here...

Is someone setting up a panel of judges that decides on acceptable "Tiki Culture" participants and products? Are there repercussions for such criminals?

Whether you or I think a Tiki enthusiast's actions and works are appropriate to the original germ idea of Polynesian Pop is mostly pointless since we have little control over what people do, and considerably less control over what they like. Trying to bring back a magic moment from the past that some other people decided was the "right way to play Tiki" is not something that can be forced on the general public. Culture is fluid. Humans are allowed to interpret and create and change, and that's not meant to be an excuse! It's simply.. well, normal.

I find history important and fascinating, and I happen to love the original, vintage celebration of Tiki from the 1930's thru the 1970's. That's where I spend most of my concentration and energy, and I appreciate every source and relic that's available to me because they teach me and expose me to things that I love learning about. I'm not sure the 1960s tiki restaurant goers had the same interest level that we do now. It seems pretty obvious that their inspiration had little to do with learning anything. In fact maybe they'd think what WE do today is a colossal waste of time! haha

So who's to judge? And what good does it do?

I understand that Voodoo is not part of pure Tiki. But I use it as part of my name here for a few reasons that are meaningful to me... not the least of which is because I like it. :) Maybe that's an example of this "watering down of Tiki Culture" business. But I don't see the harm in it on that level. Tell me if you disagree.

So.. uncover new artifacts. Make more resources available to anyone interested. Develop social groups. Celebrate it the way YOU want to. And maybe you should just ignore those who you feel are doing it allll wrong? They tend to go away when they don't get the attention or affirmation they seek.

my Tiki is not watered down as a result.

On 2011-08-19 17:09, Voodoo Devil wrote:
Ok fine, I'm obviously horrified by the video on a few levels. But I'm confused by what exactly is in question here...

Is someone setting up a panel of judges that decides on acceptable "Tiki Culture" participants and products? Are there repercussions for such criminals?

Whether you or I think a Tiki enthusiast's actions and works are appropriate to the original germ idea of Polynesian Pop is mostly pointless since we have little control over what people do, and considerably less control over what they like. Trying to bring back a magic moment from the past that some other people decided was the "right way to play Tiki" is not something that can be forced on the general public. Culture is fluid. Humans are allowed to interpret and create and change, and that's not meant to be an excuse! It's simply.. well, normal.

I find history important and fascinating, and I happen to love the original, vintage celebration of Tiki from the 1930's thru the 1970's. That's where I spend most of my concentration and energy, and I appreciate every source and relic that's available to me because they teach me and expose me to things that I love learning about. I'm not sure the 1960s tiki restaurant goers had the same interest level that we do now. It seems pretty obvious that their inspiration had little to do with learning anything. In fact maybe they'd think what WE do today is a colossal waste of time! haha

So who's to judge? And what good does it do?

I understand that Voodoo is not part of pure Tiki. But I use it as part of my name here for a few reasons that are meaningful to me... not the least of which is because I like it. :) Maybe that's an example of this "watering down of Tiki Culture" business. But I don't see the harm in it on that level. Tell me if you disagree.

So.. uncover new artifacts. Make more resources available to anyone interested. Develop social groups. Celebrate it the way YOU want to. And maybe you should just ignore those who you feel are doing it allll wrong? They tend to go away when they don't get the attention or affirmation they seek.

Or, they make it BIG while truly talented artists fall by the wayside.

And to answer your question, yes...there is indeed a panel of tiki judges...their names are................................

Hey, we should be able to criticize, but I draw the line at censorship or banning of questionable content
if for nothing else as an example of what we agree or disagree on.

Many many years from now civilization will look back and realize this was the greatest song ever written. Of course when that happens all the naysayers here will say "that's really what I thought when I heard it the first time". My forte is recognizing genius when I first see it..

Just substitute party supply store or Target tikis, etc.

And I'm sure most folks can think of a few personally perturbing things on Tiki's periphery.

I can't count how many times I've heard the phrase "it's just a hobby" to excuse farbing out at events. Meanwhile, the inauthentic folks are relating nonfactual information to spectators. Hey, why let historical truth get in the way of a good time, right?

Bear

I really didn't understand what people were arguing about with "authentic tiki style" until I ran across this thread a few nights ago: http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic=31087&forum=1&start=0&hilite=1920s%20hawaii
Talk about tiki world war! I understand a lot more now from both sides of the coin. Regarding the video... the lyrics are horrible, but to be fair there are lot of 1930's Polynesian themed novelty songs that also have lyrics that make me cringe, despite the fact I absolutely freaking love 30's poly pop even if it is sometimes misguided. I guess we have to look at it like this: you gotta have a bad example to show what you mean is a good example (no light without dark and all that). The video is kind of cute in a kitschy kind of way, and their hearts seem to be in the right place it's just misguided. But then again, I am sure not every example from the golden age of tiki style would hold up to scrutiny either; there had to be some less than stellar quality things produced then as they are now. The only thing that can be done is to lead by example and create what should be to contrast with what shouldn't.

I think the big misconception is there is a enormous difference between "tiki", and "tiki style" the latter (as I understand it) being a definitive fixed art style/movement with certain boundries that make it what it is. Whereas something "tiki" may have a tiki in it, but is not necessarily of "tiki style". All art movements have defining characteristics that make them what they are so they can be categorized, thus (again as I understand it) is the term "tiki style" (but correct me if I am wrong, the "world war tiki thread" above was quite the long read and got pretty technical, this is just what I took away from it).

Ok now I am running away before people start throwing the rotten tomatoes.

It's like a train wreck - horrible to watch but at the same time mesmerizing.

My seven-year-old son is running around the house singing "We Love Tikis!" now.

I have a sense of what Tiki is, but I don't think I can define it except to state what definitely is NOT tiki. Like Jimmy Buffet or surf music.

oh man...this is one of those things like when somebody says:

"oh my god smell this....its horrible ya just got to smell this"

you know you shouldnt but everybody always sticks there nose close and smells it.......AND I DID!!!!!!!!!

i had too and now i am ashamed of myself.....beacuse i sniffed it!

anybody know how to get this jingle out of your skull after listening to it? besides killing myself?

Could people please,stop being so precious? Get over it. If tiki to you also involves hotrods and burlesque, then so be it.
I'm actually getting a bit sick of this site, as the same questions are being asked, over and over again, they are just being worded differently.
Take from tiki what you want. Who cares what anyone else thinks?

P.S. I must say that, that was crap, but i certainly wont lose any sleep over it.

[ Edited by: swizzle 2011-08-20 09:26 ]

The dead last place for someone to be if they really really care about a certain subject is on a message board about that subject because eventually someone will ruin it (not necessarily deliberately - even having someone you can't stand liking the same thing you do takes its toll). Imagine how fast this place would have imploded with people at each others throats if politics and whatever else were allowed!!!

Thanks much TigerTail for the thread link. I have needed that for quite some time. Conversations here often confuse me. Maybe now I can start figuring this stuff out.

The most highly rated, oft sung, 1960's Tiki music straight out of post-war Southern California, home of the original Tiki Culture. Tapping into the exotic sounds of forbidden pleasure in a rum soaked fantasy, authentic is its mix of traditional Hawaiian music and the cool and sophisticated sounds of Lounge in a hybrid of . . . .

calypso?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfqGf9x7L9c

Sven, et al, I understand the frustration and scorn. I really do. I grew up in a household where jazz was king. I was quizzed, at age 7, whether a song was bebop or west coast, whether it was Miles or Chet Baker playing. I knew a world of Dizzy, Bird and The Duke.
Flash forward to adulthood, and America loves "jazz", because Kenny G is burning up the charts, and Yanni is some kind of musical guru.
WTF?
Yeah, jazz traditionalists would rather get "Thelonious Monk" branded on their ass than listen to 2 minutes of Kenny G, but the whole country knows him as "Jazz".
Just like any kind of movement, the smaller it is, the easier it is for it to be pure, and done at a high level. Once 'polluted' by popularity, the inevitability of the Lowest Common Denominator takes over. Tiki has become more and more popular, and you, dear Bigbrotiki, are a huge reason for it. People without the ability or inclination to do tiki the "right" way still want to be involved, in as lame of ways as they care to.
Sadly, there's not much to be done. If there was, there would be no Kenny G, and all the jazz cats would not have had to go to Europe to get respect.

The Angry Idol

P.S. it was great to finally meet you, a couple weeks back at the Tiki-Ti. In my first trip to LA I get to meet you, Mike Buhen AND Leroy and Bob. Not bad. Not bad at all.

Thank you. You are right, the larger a pop phenomenon gets, the more it becomes bastardized. The irony is that I always wanted it to become POP CULTURE again, that is why I waited so long for the right publisher to come along. And it worked, and I am happy it did. But right now, it has become a little too much POP, and not enough CULTURE. I am working on balancing that out in the future.

I think that this last Oasis was a good example of how BOTH can co-exist. The were many fresh converts on a less clued-in level, but just as many who knew the why and wherefores, and both got a lot out of the event. It was nice.

There's a lot more going on than just big vs. small, pure vs. bastardized.

Two big elements are "perception" and "availability".

Perception - What is considered exotic and desirable as such? This is something that's hard to force, hard to introduce to a generation that would often rather go shopping in Dubai than sipping a mai tai in a tiki-guarded lagoon.

Availability - Today's exotica, in terms of home decor, is what you'll find at places like Pier 1 and World Market (and Target's Global Bazaar), which mostly comes from Africa and Asia and has very little to do with the South Pacific in general.

So there's a big gap. Many of the people here may have grown up surrounded by, or at least teased with, tiki culture as pop culture. Many saw only glimpses of it (my own fascination started on a family trip to Oahu and Hawaii in 1980), but if families aren't taking those vacations, if they're not decorating and listening to the music, if they're drinking appletinis instead of zombies, then where is the exposure that will lead to people wanting to embrace or be a part of the culture now and / or when they get older?

Sven, I completely understand your comment about wanting it to be more pop culture, but think about the best parties you've ever had. They may get big and crazy and fun, and it may be great to share those good times with all of those people, but at the end of the night, the little group of close friends who stick around til the wee hours still remains the most important.

Oh god forbid I post the tiki song I wrote. ("Goin' to the Tiki Bar") I'm a weekend warrior on the guitar and wrote a song about my favorite place and drink (mai tai). I know I'm not the musician that Lucas or some of the other professionals here are, but I really do love tiki and I wrote a song about it. That being said, I don't care for "We Love Tikis", but to each his own. I grew up listening to country/rock, so my tiki song sounds a little country (ohh the blasphemy), but everyone gets a chuckle when I play it. Interestingly, Hawaiian music and C&W music share some of the same styles that go back before the mid-century. (Steel guitar, yodeling, fingerpicking, etc.) But don't worry, I'll never call myself a tiki musician, just a crazy fez wearing Trailerpark Boy.

On 2011-08-23 16:12, Trailerpark Tiki wrote:
Oh god forbid I post the tiki song I wrote. ("Goin' to the Tiki Bar") I'm a weekend warrior on the guitar and wrote a song about my favorite place and drink (mai tai). I know I'm not the musician that Lucas or some of the other professionals here are, but I really do love tiki and I wrote a song about it. That being said, I don't care for "We Love Tikis", but to each his own. I grew up listening to country/rock, so my tiki song sounds a little country (ohh the blasphemy), but everyone gets a chuckle when I play it. Interestingly, Hawaiian music and C&W music share some of the same styles that go back before the mid-century. (Steel guitar, yodeling, fingerpicking, etc.) But don't worry, I'll never call myself a tiki musician, just a crazy fez wearing Trailerpark Boy.

Well, I, for one, would love to hear/see it!!

[ Edited by: ThreeTikis 2011-08-23 19:38 ]

me too!

I will bring my guitar to 'goin primitive'. Hope to see ya there. OR I will be having a party at my tiki bar soon and I'll invite all the tc ohana. But don't be disappointed, John-O thought I really lived in a trailerpark, and he was disappointed.

A sample:

Well there is a place
That I like to run
Smoke some cigarettes...
and drink some rum

Orange Curacao and...
Triple sec
Shakin up tall Mai Tais
For the...Best Effect
(chorus)
Goin' to the tiki bar
Its not...Far Away
Goin' to the tiki bar
I'll be... there all day
Goin' to the tiki bar
Its a...Hoooooooliday!!!