Question for my Florida ohana

Once or twice in the last few weeks my wife has dropped hints that she would like us to relocate to Florida. This couldn't possibly happen unless I were to secure a job and a house first. I don't think this will happen, in fact, I'm not sure I want it to. But in the spirit of curiosity, how is the job market down there? I have extensive experience in screen printing (more than 18 years worth), a whole lot of bar tending experience, and I've worked in a kitchen or two in my time. Learning something new doesn't scare me at all. If anyone can point me in a good direction or even flip through a local paper for me I'd be grateful.

Mahalo!

Fink -- I think our 2 local papers, The St Petersburg Times & The Tampa Tribune both have classifieds available on their websites.

It seems to me that there is always someone looking for a bartender around here. The hospitality industry in general is huge around here. Tons of resorts, hotels, clubs etc...

Josh
http://www.whoillycatsband.com

[ Edited by: Chip and Andy 2009-06-05 17:04 ]

Florida has alot to offer. I am a long-time resident that moved here in 1976. I have lived in every region from the Panhandle to South FL (some towns - Pensacola, Panama City Beach, Tallahassee, Tampa/Clearwater, Jacksonville, Ormond Beach, Miami, and now Deerfield) and can tell you that if you truly want to move, opportunities will present themselves. Miami is perhaps the one city I would talk you out of - unless you speak fluent spanish. The silkscreen industry is alive and thriving all over the state. Check out the Sun-Sentinel website for jobs, they have listings for almost every major city. Wherever you choose, real estate is the biggest problem - prices are high all over the state. Good luck and keep us informed.

I love it here and can not see ever moving away.

I've lived in Florida since 1978. Started in the panhandle (Ft. Walton Beach), went to school at UF (Gainesville) and finally settled in Orlando in 1994. Although Orlando is loaded with service jobs to feed the tourism monster, there are a great number of high tech and professional jobs as well, as there are in most cities. Honestly, most who live in the real city of Orlando and surrounding cities and its 1,000,000+ residents have nothing to do with Disney, even though Disney is what most people think of when they think of Orlando. Disney itself employs something like 27,000 people and then of course there are the multitudes of hotels, restaurants, bars, etc that feed off the tourism generated by Disney, Universal and Sea World (among others).

The biggest problem facing people moving to Orlando (or the whole state for that matter) is the rising cost of housing. My house has nearly doubled in value since I purchased it 6 years ago. If I was just moving to Orlando, I doubt that I could afford to move into my own neighborhood! It's just crazy. But that's going on to some degree all across the country.

The comments about the panhandle being more southern-oriented are correct. However, there are loads of resorts in the panhandle (meaning lots of service jobs) and the beaches are the most beautiful in Florida.

If you move to Florida, just prepare to deal with the hurricanes! At least we have warning when they're coming! Btw, this is off-topic, but I'm sure hoping the MaiKai repairs are coming along okay. We're planning on driving down for my first time next month!

This is an article from Sunday's Ft. Lauderdale Sun-Sentinel:

Paradise lost? South Florida moves to tipping point
Published January 1, 2006

From her seat behind the rental counter at the U-Haul Center on State Road 84 near Interstate 95 in Fort Lauderdale, Belkis Lopez has noticed a shift in the past year.

More trucks are leaving town than arriving.

"A lot of people are getting out of here," Lopez said. "Working people who say they can't afford living here, people who've been here 50 years, retirees who say their money can go a lot further up north."

Some go as close as Fort Pierce and Port St. Lucie. Many have been going to Pensacola and Tallahassee. Some go to Georgia, North Carolina and beyond.

She rattled off the list of one-way rental destinations for the past week: Ohio, Las Vegas, two in North Florida.

"I hear the same complaints [about South Florida] all the time," said Lopez, 23, who has worked at the U-Haul Center for two years. "Too expensive, too crowded, too much traffic."

It's a new year in South Florida, and there seems to be a new vibe, too.

Not too long ago, this area seemed like paradise: great weather and a relatively affordable lifestyle, with housing that seemed a steal compared with other major metropolitan areas.

But now paradise has been lost, what with hurricanes every other week, a real estate market that only a Wall Street millionaire could afford, the cost of everything from health care to FPL bills soaring and salaries not keeping pace.

During the past few months, since Hurricane Wilma, almost every interview and casual conversation I've had with ordinary people inevitably drifts to thoughts of leaving.

"I'm seriously thinking about getting out of the area," Linda Mastriana, 57, said a few days after Wilma. She has lived and worked in Fort Lauderdale for 28 years, but she said the coming increase in windstorm insurance rates might be her breaking point.

"The cost of living is just getting out of hand, and the wages are simply not keeping up," Mastriana said. She said her native Ohio keeps looking better, winters and all.

South Florida has always been a transient area. But now it's also longtime residents, people who thought they were going to be lifers, who are pulling up stakes.

People like Martha Norona. Norona's family moved to South Florida from Massachusetts in 1957, when she was 4. In August, one week before Hurricane Katrina hit, Norona sold her house in Dania Beach and moved to Tallahassee.

Norona, 52, moved to be near her two grandchildren and daughter, who works at Florida State University, but also for a less hectic lifestyle.

"I knew things were expensive [in South Florida], but I didn't realize how expensive until I got here," she said. "I only need one insurance policy for my home now. It's wonderful."

In South Florida, she paid more than $2,000 a year for homeowner's, flood and windstorm insurance, another $2,000 in property taxes and $159 a month for auto insurance. In Tallahassee, she pays $800 a year for property insurance, $1,200 in property taxes and $88 a month for auto insurance.

She sold her South Florida house, a small two-bedroom, for $325,000. In Tallahassee, she bought a three-bedroom, two-bathroom home with a fireplace, wooden deck and two-car garage for $180,000. She had plenty left over to buy a winter wardrobe.

"I paid off everything I owed, put money in the bank, bought a beautiful house and can afford to work part-time," she said. "I don't regret it for a minute. I miss my friends and my family, but to me it's like heaven up here. … Everyone's in a good mood. Even the stock boys at Wal-Mart say hello to you. People don't cut you off in traffic. If you put your blinker on, they actually let you in."

Government planners and private builders still forecast unbridled growth for Broward, with no shortage of high-end developments and high-rise condominiums on the drawing boards. But you wonder, who'll be able to afford it?

The big question for the new year and beyond: Can South Florida's middle class hold? Or will more people cash out, pack up and escape from a lost paradise?

Thanks for posting the article, Joe. Its well written and reflecting the sentiment that has been goind around for quite some time.

I admit, I have that feeling too. Love and hate South Florida at the same time. Just don't know where I'll go when the time comes that the poor and lower middle class can't afford to be here anymore. :(

Well, I seriously doubt you could find a decent "three-bedroom, two-bathroom home with a fireplace, wooden deck and two-car garage" for $180,000 in Orlando anymore. Heck, the little plain looking townhouses going up across the street from my house have a sign up saying "starting at $225,000". I couldn't believe that. But that's life from now on I guess! I feel for you I-Dream-of-Tiki if you're a renter. Rental rates are going up, up, up.

Houses are WHACKED out right now.
Mine has doubled in value over the last 3 years.
And not just because of the Lagoon Lounge. :wink:

My favorite city in Florida is Sarasota.
There are some places you can get out of the city in Manatee and Sarasota County that would do you well to look at.
I'm thinking Parish and surrounding areas.

IMO, if you're coming down here without a giant chunk of cash, you'll have to commute.

Brooksville is another cool area - with some deals for those who will look.

I have a buddy, Dr. Peter Smith, who bought an acre in Williston and commutes to Ocala every day.

And of course, there are the trailer worlds where people just move into a shell and decorate it nicely and do fine.

You could buy a boat and live on that.

Jobs are plentiful but the pay scale is a bit out of line with the rest of the nation.
No income tax state also has no unions, etc. Well, weak ones anyway.

Must love heat. And humidity.

I like it here a lot.
Except for the stinkin' Haole Kats who never leave me alone.
Always with the music those guys.

I think you should take an exploratory trip right around the time of the Hawaiian Inn gathering and you can stay in my room.
I have a friend that owns a printing company in Tampa. I can put you in touch with him... no promises... he's a Missouran.
I have a buddy in St. Augustine that is the head chef of a rapidly growing chain of restaurants, as well.

Let me know - I'll try to hook you up.

NOW ,if only you were a roofer.........

Or a tree trimmer(not the Christmas kind). You could stockpile logs for all of us carvers! HMMMM

LOGS - YOU WANT LOGS!?!
I GOT YOUR STINKIN' LOG'S RIGHT HERE!!!

I've got so many palm logs thrown at me all the time.
It's sad that I tried to actually carve one and it was so hilarious I had to dig its face out and use it as a planter.

Artistic Talent - ZERO

But I got logs...

On 2006-01-06 12:17, pablus wrote:
LOGS - YOU WANT LOGS!?!
I GOT YOUR STINKIN' LOG'S RIGHT HERE!!!

I've got so many palm logs thrown at me all the time.
It's sad that I tried to actually carve one and it was so hilarious I had to dig its face out and use it as a planter.

Artistic Talent - ZERO

But I got logs...

We have so many palm tree logs down here in the Lauderdale area too. Many are still in front of people's houses waiting to be taken away. Every time I see one I say to my wife "that would make a great tiki." But, alas, I also have no artistic talent whatsoever!

Idreamoftiki - I feel for you and all my friends who are still renting. I bought my house 5 years ago for just over $100K and now houses in my neighborhood are going for nearly $300K. I could never afford my house if I were buying it today! I am going to have to move eventually because we are going to have a second child and need more room. Even though I'll have the equity out of my old house, when I buy another house, the higher real estate taxes will kill me! Right now I pay only $1500 a year. If I sold my house and bought a new one, my taxes would triple! I would be so out of S. Florida if my whole family didn't live down here.

Wow, I can't believe all the responses to my inquiry! First of all, thank you all so much for helping me out. You make a tiki-brother feel welcome. :D Here's just a few of the reasons we are even thinking of moving:

1. I hate winter. Actually, I like the snow, but anything below 30 degrees sucks.
2. My neighbor hood is slowly going downhill. It's always been sort of lower-middle working-class sort of place, but in the last year or so crime has gone way up right along with our taxes. Which brings me to my next point...
3. Taxes. This year we had to pay over $3200 in property tax alone on a house not worth much more than $100,000. Next year it should be closer to 4 grand.
4. My job is completely unfulfilling and nearly bores me to tears. I'm severely underpaid and my boss frequently lies to my face to help his bottom line.

These are just a few of the things. Don't get me wrong, I grew up here and there are tons of cool things going on. But if I'm going to have to look into selling the house and renting or buying somewhere else, it might as well be somewhere warm.

We are taking a week-long trip to Florida in April, so we're going to do a lot of exploring to have a hands-on look at what's happening there. There are a few places that look tempting for a lot of reasons that we researched online like Sarasota and Port Saint Lucie, so we may check those out. Do you think it's possible to get a cheaper apartment if we're in a smaller city? Anyway, I will PM a few of you with some specific questions.

I should probably state that this is really something that will probably never happen, but I wanted to throw out a line or two and see what's biting.

Thank you all, my southern ohana. I will keep everyone informed on what happens.

I've been following the progress on your Leeward Lounge and I can't believe you're considering moving after just completing it! I can't remember... is it in the basement? You do know we don't have basements in Florida right? If we did, they'd soon be underground pools!

Pablus, that sounds great. I'll talk to you about it before we come down. Mahalo nui.

On 2006-01-06 19:15, GatorRob wrote:
I've been following the progress on your Leeward Lounge and I can't believe you're considering moving after just completing it!

If it weren't for the Leeward Lounge I would pick up and move tonight. It's the only thing that is keeping me here right now. It would break my heart to lock the door and walk away for ever. It makes me queasy even thinking about it. Also I'm pretty sure we wont be able to buy a house if we move, so I don't think I would be able to rebuild it.

I sympathize. That is a tough spot to be in. Obviously a lot of sweat and love went into your lounge. I wouldn't want to leave it either. But then again, I wouldn't live anywhere it snows.

Fink...you dont want to live your life with regrets...if you want to move, make it happen...my in laws are stuck in Cleveland...he want to move to S. FL, she doesnt...i know he will never get to come down and he knows it and it saddens him to no end...make it work...

HEY i live in CLEVELAND and i don't consider myself "STUCK" here. and i drive down to SOFLA anytime i want. in fact i'll be spending last week of FEB and 1st week of MARCH there. TD

[ Edited by: TIKI DAVID 2006-01-12 17:10 ]

TD, no offense to Cleveland...i happend to like visiting, i just couldnt live there myself...i am warm blooded and the cold would kill me. :lol:

Does anybody know how long it would take to commute from Palm Bay to ,say, Merritt Island during rush hour?

I lived in Melbourne, in the Palm Bay area. I didn't commute, but I don't recall the traffic ever being really bad, not like you'd see in Miami, DC, New York City, or Los Angeles, at least, where you will need 15 minutes to move about 1-2 miles.

Now the bad news, and there's a lot of it, and it involves the most important things. Florida is one of the most dishonest and backwards states in which I've ever lived. I had more far trouble with dishonest schools and employers there than anywhere else in my life. There are no unions, for one thing, so employers can and do fire people at will. Why aren't there unions? Because the people who have tried to start unions were found dead in swamps, murdered. And I'm talking about modern times. That shows you the kind of place you'd be moving to. It's controlled by the Good Old Boys, whether you can see it or not. To give you an idea of the pervasiveness of that type of power structure, there was a book for sale all over called "Good Old Boys," talking about the politics of central Florida. That book was so ubiquitous that I first saw it for sale in a copy service center while making photocopies! That's the kind of place you're moving to.

Now some natural history. Most waterways larger than a creek are not safe to be near because of alligators. There was a classy seafood restaurant on one point near where I lived, and there were large alligators strolling by the windows where the diners ate. That might sound like fun until you realize that there were no fences there, and the alligators could just as easily have strolled up to the front door of the restaurant. There were constantly newspaper reports of dogs and kids near the water being grabbed and carried off and eaten by alligators. Alligators were in public parks, golf courses, nature trails, drainage ponds, the Indian River in people's backyards, and of course lakes. One newspaper report told of a homeless guy living alone near a lake near where I lived (there are a lot of homeless down there, due to relatively warm weather) who was grabbed by an alligator and mauled for a period of about 2-3 hours until somebody happened by to help out. In California I constantly explored fields and creeks and shores all alone as a kid, but if I had done that in Florida, I'd probably be dead by now. You don't want to get mauled by an alligator. Even though that homeless man escaped, the dirt and bacteria in a gator's mouth are so dangerous that they thought the man's leg would have to be amputated just from the infection alone.

Hurricanes are a real worry, too. It's incredible, but most homes and buildings are not hurricane proof. After the '92 hurricane went through, insurance companies went broke all over the state, and you literally couldn't even get simple theft insurance for several months, until they eventually approved of you paying them for insurance! Even if the hurricane misses you, there are plenty of tornadoes, with and without hurricanes. Tornadoes can do more damage than hurricanes. I was walking over to a Seven/11 one day and saw this white funnel coming out of the sky only about a mile away, and it wasn't even a particularly bad day. Nobody seemed to care. Storms are very frequent, and carry a lot of lightning. Newspapers are full of stories of people being electrocuted by lightning, and people you talk to will tell you about their mailboxes being blown up and forest fires starting from lightning.

Speaking of housing, Florida was the only place where I had my entire apartment deposit illegally stolen when I moved, and I never got any of it back. Not only did I not get it back, but they tried to charge me even more, and had the gall to take me to a collection agency for damage to their rug because their roof leaked!

Mosquitoes are dangerous certain times of the year because they carry encephalitis, which is fatal. People who contract that develop headaches of such severity that they go into a coma from the pain.

The Indian River is so polluted that fisherman are warned not to use their mouths to hold fishing line. One fisherman who did so was poisoned so badly that he developed ulcers of the face, and began to lose his memory as his brain functions were impacted, too. Many of the fish in that river have visible ulcers. Speaking of fisherman, Florida fisherman have been known to sadistically mutilate pelicans who grab their fish. The report I read didn't provide the details, but I think the fisherman cut the legs of the birds, then let them go. That's the kind of place you're moving to.

The only time I was ever held up at gunpoint was in Florida. I was lucky. The thief who held me up beat up another guy the night before, even after the victim gave him his wallet. One of the school security guards was even shot at. Of course the school newspaper suppressed most of these details. Good Old Boy system again: you can't be scaring off the families up north who send their kids down to Florida to go to school. Money is at stake! And speaking of shootings, need I remind you of the series of murders of German tourists in Miami in the early '90s? It was so common that one rock band named themselves The Dead German Tourists. I have one of their CDs.

People let their dogs--big dogs--run free at night. There were many times walking around at night that I was confronted by large dogs holding me at bay, often for several minutes until they got bored. If you call the dog pound, they never show up on time or find the address, and don't care.

Florida laws are incredibly backwards. Oral sex is illegal, for example. One free newspaper I picked up in a music store there gave advice of what to do if stopped by police, and advised, "Don't ever get arrested in the South." Gays who attended my school were often harassed and their teachers often made sure they failed their classes. The cops are dishonest. I knew one guy who got out of jail, and because he was in jail, he couldn't get a document he needed, then because he didn't have that document, they threw him back in jail. The reason he was even in jail in the first place was a policeman recognized him from a session in which the victim had been lied to, and so the officer lied and said he was breaking the law again. The police then lied to witnesses to get testimony that fit their needs. Laws against double jeopardy don't mean anything down there. And speaking of the hurricane of '92, one store owner in the Keys told me how the police were looting people's homes, but of course that tidbit was somehow omitted from the news. I heard firsthand of police also looting a person's home after he had gone to jail--yet another person I knew from jail there. At the time I left, my ex-girlfriend told me her boyfriend had just been sent to prison for rape, and she knew firsthand for a fact that he never raped anybody, but somehow that evidence was ignored. You probably heard about the huge scandal over black motorists being stopped and cash seizures under the pretext of drug law violations. That was in the Daytona area, and had nationwide attention. And speaking of nationwide attention, I'll remind you of one other piece of notorious Florida news, with a single word: ballots! Only in Florida could things get that bad!

The school I attended (Florida Tech) cheated me out of years of my time/life so they could make tuition money off of me, and put me so far in debt that I may never be able to pay back my school loans. My advisor had no idea what I was working on or if I was even still attending school, because one semester he gave me a grade when I wasn't even attending that semester. The school was unbelievably crooked and backwards in every aspect, and any complaints about the administration were completely ignored. The Good Old Boy system again. One student I knew from France, after running up years of debt, was unable to continue, and had to move back to France without a degree and out about $100,000. That school was also engaged in illegal activities that I won't go into. The nearby school BCC was even worse: they were constantly in the headlines for illegal activities.

When I finally graduated, I worked as a teacher for another school. That school, centered in Merritt Island, advised me so wrongly about my class and teacher requirements that I ended up losing about half my students, which allowed the school to cheat me out of about $700 of my salary that semester, due to the fine print and the wrong information they fed me. I was fired from a dumb summer job because the boss got an e-mail complaint from somebody and didn't even check if their information was correct (it wasn't). The next employer cheated me out of about $20,000/year for about three years. I couldn't change jobs largely because the managers and job agents were so incompetent that they kept getting their information wrong or making wrong assumptions. I tried to take my last employer to court, and I had proof that they had violated my written employment agreement, but both lawyers I contacted were so incompetent that they didn't even get the basic facts right about the case, so they didn't want to handle it based on wrong assumptions. With the exception of a short-term tutoring job, every employer I ever had in Florida was dishonest and either cheated me out of money or was engaged in illegal activity, often both.

Would I move back to Florida? Probably, but only if I could be near Orlando in a decently sized city near Disney World, and if I could live in a very solid concrete dwelling and had a very good job, both in money and security. Otherwise I would never go back, and I still hate that f**king state and I still have nightmares (literally) about being grabbed by alligators and being held up by drug addicts. Basically I'd advise everyone to stay the hell away from Florida.

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 04:40 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 04:41 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 04:42 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 04:46 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 05:00 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 06:17 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 10:18 ]

Wow. I'm sorry you've had such a horrible experience living in Florida. I've never heard anyone have so many bad things to say about it. I've lived in Florida since 1978. I have never been held at gunpoint, attacked by an alligator, seen a tornado, contracted any disease from a mosquito, been confronted by a large dog (nor have I ever seen packs of large dogs roaming free) or been jailed for oral sex! :)

While I don't question your personal experiences here, I think you have over-generalized to the extreme. Every state has its shares of problems. No state is a garden of eden. Florida, like most states, excels in some areas and falls far short in others. I'm really sorry your experience was so bad. Others reading this should know that your experience is not shared by all who live here.

Now, that said, if you ever do move to Orlando, please let me know. The first Mai Tai is on me. :)

On 2006-02-27 05:40, GatorRob wrote:
I've lived in Florida since 1978.

You live in Orlando, Florida, where there are enough normal people coming in on vacation that the city has to keep things satisfactory or else lose millions of dollars per year. As I said, I might still consider moving to Orlando, Florida, but to nowhere else in that state.

Let's see, did I mention the time I almost had a huge shipment of boxes that I shipped from California returned, because the storage facility manager in Florida forgot that I told him to expect my shipment? And that the only reason it didn't get returned, which might have forced me to fly back out to California to reclaim it at the shipping center, is because he made a second mistake about the name? Did I mention the movers whom I caught red-handed at the weighing scales falsifying documents to cheat me out of 1000 pounds of freight costs? Or the U-Haul ripoff? Or the huge prostitution scandal in Daytona Beach? Or all the broken glass on the sidewalks that was constantly popping my bicycle tires? Or my first advisor who led me on for a full semester and cost me all that tuition, without any help, because she knew she was leaving but didn't want anybody to know? Or the ongoing destruction and pollution of the Florida Keys? Or the Fort Lauderdale crackdown that was so severe that the national spring break institution in that city nearly disappeared? Or that the reason I'm even inhabiting these wonderful frozen shores is that my last employer in Florida fired me because they claimed I couldn't do a job that was two levels below my educational and expertise level, after they made sure I was unable to get needed file accesses that everybody else could get? But I'll stop there...

If you can find me a good secure job in the Orlando area, I'll take you up on your Mai Tai offer, and maybe there's a chance I could even change my mind about that state. :)

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 07:14 ]

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-02-27 10:25 ]

On 2006-02-27 04:39, mbonga wrote:
I lived in Melbourne, in the Palm Bay area. I didn't commute, but I don't recall the traffic ever being really bad, not like you'd see in Miami, DC, New York City, or Los Angeles, at least, where you will need 15 minutes to move about 1-2 miles.

Now the bad news, and there's a lot of it, and it involves the most important things. Florida is one of the most dishonest and backwards states in which I've ever lived. I had more far trouble with dishonest schools and employers there than anywhere else in my life. There are no unions, for one thing, so employers can and do fire people at will. Why aren't there unions? Because the people who have tried to start unions were found dead in swamps, murdered. And I'm talking about modern times. That shows you the kind of place you'd be moving to. It's controlled by the Good Old Boys, whether you can see it or not. To give you an idea of the pervasiveness of that type of power structure, there was a book for sale all over called "Good Old Boys," talking about the politics of central Florida. That book was so ubiquitous that I first saw it for sale in a copy service center while making photocopies! That's the kind of place you're moving to.

Now some natural history. Most waterways larger than a creek are not safe to be near because of alligators. There was a classy seafood restaurant on one point near where I lived, and there were large alligators strolling by the windows where the diners ate. That might sound like fun until you realize that there were no fences there, and the alligators could just as easily have strolled up to the front door of the restaurant. There were constantly newspaper reports of dogs and kids near the water being grabbed and carried off and eaten by alligators. Alligators were in public parks, golf courses, nature trails, drainage ponds, the Indian River in people's backyards, and of course lakes. One newspaper report told of a homeless guy living alone near a lake near where I lived (there are a lot of homeless down there, due to relatively warm weather) who was grabbed by an alligator and mauled for a period of about 2-3 hours until somebody happened by to help out. In California I constantly explored fields and creeks and shores all alone as a kid, but if I had done that in Florida, I'd probably be dead by now. You don't want to get mauled by an alligator. Even though that homeless man escaped, the dirt and bacteria in a gator's mouth are so dangerous that they thought the man's leg would have to be amputated just from the infection alone.

Hurricanes are a real worry, too. It's incredible, but most homes and buildings are not hurricane proof. After the '92 hurricane went through, insurance companies went broke all over the state, and you literally couldn't even get simple theft insurance for several months, until they eventually approved of you paying them for insurance! Even if the hurricane misses you, there are plenty of tornadoes, with and without hurricanes. Tornadoes can do more damage than hurricanes. I was walking over to a Seven/11 one day and saw this white funnel coming out of the sky only about a mile away, and it wasn't even a particularly bad day. Nobody seemed to care. Storms are very frequent, and carry a lot of lightning. Newspapers are full of stories of people being electrocuted by lightning, and people you talk to will tell you about their mailboxes being blown up and forest fires starting from lightning.

Speaking of housing, Florida was the only place where I had my entire apartment deposit illegally stolen when I moved, and I never got any of it back. Not only did I not get it back, but they tried to charge me even more, and had the gall to take me to a collection agency for damage to their rug because their roof leaked!

Mosquitoes are dangerous certain times of the year because they carry encephalitis, which is fatal. People who contract that develop headaches of such severity that they go into a coma from the pain.

The Indian River is so polluted that fisherman are warned not to use their mouths to hold fishing line. One fisherman who did so was poisoned so badly that he developed ulcers of the face, and began to lose his memory as his brain functions were impacted, too. Many of the fish in that river have visible ulcers. Speaking of fisherman, Florida fisherman have been known to sadistically mutilate pelicans who grab their fish. The report I read didn't provide the details, but I think the fisherman cut the legs of the birds, then let them go. That's the kind of place you're moving to.

The only time I was ever held up at gunpoint was in Florida. I was lucky. The thief who held me up beat up another guy the night before, even after the victim gave him his wallet. One of the school security guards was even shot at. Of course the school newspaper suppressed most of these details. Good Old Boy system again: you can't be scaring off the families up north who send their kids down to Florida to go to school. Money is at stake! And speaking of shootings, need I remind you of the series of murders of German tourists in Miami in the early '90s? It was so common that one rock band named themselves The Dead German Tourists. I have one of their CDs.

People let their dogs--big dogs--run free at night. There were many times walking around at night that I was confronted by large dogs holding me at bay, often for several minutes until they got bored. If you call the dog pound, they never show up on time or find the address, and don't care.

Florida laws are incredibly backwards. Oral sex is illegal, for example. One free newspaper I picked up in a music store there gave advice of what to do if stopped by police, and advised, "Don't ever get arrested in the South." Gays who attended my school were often harassed and their teachers often made sure they failed their classes. The cops are dishonest. I knew one guy who got out of jail, and because he was in jail, he couldn't get a document he needed, then because he didn't have that document, they threw him back in jail. The reason he was even in jail in the first place was a policeman recognized him from a session in which the victim had been lied to, and so the officer lied and said he was breaking the law again. The police then lied to witnesses to get testimony that fit their needs. Laws against double jeopardy don't mean anything down there. And speaking of the hurricane of '92, one store owner in the Keys told me how the police were looting people's homes, but of course that tidbit was somehow omitted from the news. I heard firsthand of police also looting a person's home after he had gone to jail--yet another person I knew from jail there. At the time I left, my ex-girlfriend told me her boyfriend had just been sent to prison for rape, and she knew firsthand for a fact that he never raped anybody, but somehow that evidence was ignored. You probably heard about the huge scandal over black motorists being stopped and cash seizures under the pretext of drug law violations. That was in the Daytona area, and had nationwide attention. And speaking of nationwide attention, I'll remind you of one other piece of notorious Florida news, with a single word: ballots! Only in Florida could things get that bad!

The school I attended (Florida Tech) cheated me out of years of my time/life so they could make tuition money off of me, and put me so far in debt that I may never be able to pay back my school loans. My advisor had no idea what I was working on or if I was even still attending school, because one semester he gave me a grade when I wasn't even attending that semester. The school was unbelievably crooked and backwards in every aspect, and any complaints about the administration were completely ignored. The Good Old Boy system again. One student I knew from France, after running up years of debt, was unable to continue, and had to move back to France without a degree and out about $100,000. That school was also engaged in illegal activities that I won't go into. The nearby school BCC was even worse: they were constantly in the headlines for illegal activities.

When I finally graduated, I worked as a teacher for another school. That school, centered in Merritt Island, advised me so wrongly about my class and teacher requirements that I ended up losing about half my students, which allowed the school to cheat me out of about $700 of my salary that semester, due to the fine print and the wrong information they fed me. I was fired from a dumb summer job because the boss got an e-mail complaint from somebody and didn't even check if their information was correct (it wasn't). The next employer cheated me out of about $20,000/year for about three years. I couldn't change jobs largely because the managers and job agents were so incompetent that they kept getting their information wrong or making wrong assumptions. I tried to take my last employer to court, and I had proof that they had violated my written employment agreement, but both lawyers I contacted were so incompetent that they didn't even get the basic facts right about the case, so they didn't want to handle it based on wrong assumptions. With the exception of a short-term tutoring job, every employer I ever had in Florida was dishonest and either cheated me out of money or was engaged in illegal activity, often both.

Would I move back to Florida? Probably, but only if I could be near Orlando in a decently sized city near Disney World, and if I could live in a very solid concrete dwelling and had a very good job, both in money and security. Otherwise I would never go back, and I still hate that f**king state and I still have nightmares (literally) about being grabbed by alligators and being held up by drug addicts. Basically I'd advise everyone to stay the hell away from Florida.

I want all of you to read mbonga's words very carefully and heed his advice. You DO NOT want to move to Florida! It is Hell on Earth here! In fact, if you already live here I advise you to put your house on the market TODAY! And don't worry about making a profit on your home, this is your life we're talking about! What kind of price can you put on your life and the lives of your loved ones? By God get out while you still can!!

Thanks for your assistance in hastening the development of the "bubble burst," mbonga.

-Kono (waiting patiently like a turkey buzzard for the market to turn...)

I don't know why mbonga would recommend living in Orlando. I have lived in Tampa my whole life, 29 years, and Orlando would not be in my top ten places to go if I had to relocate in Florida. I just personally don't like it...too much traffic, too touristy, and too far from the beach.

My wife and I are looking at a possible move to Ft. Lauderdale in a couple years to finish bachelors and masters programs, so I guess I can recommend it, lol.

Personally, I just like the beach communities, they just have a more old-school Florida feel to them. I do not frequent the panhandle, so I can not recommend anything there. Miami is very busy and you should know spanish if you want to live there, it will make things easier...lol. The Bay Area is busy, but not terrible. Plenty of stuff to do, lots o' jobs, not too tiki unfortunately, but you can't have everything...

We Fl natives are few. You transplants are many. We natives are immune to malaria from mosquito's. We run faster than alligator so they not bother us. We didnt move in on their land. Outsiders move here and take land for Condo. Where gator gonna go? We natives have dog poop radar so not step in. We Fl natives don't care bout hurricanes, they knock down invasive trees. We Fl natives live in lawless land so carry own guns...no one messes with us. ballots messed up...its all the retired outsiders from north east that move here and cant punch chad right...we fl native dont vote cause we are Good ole Boys...

keep preaching how bad state is. This good for Fl native. Keep outsider out. Way more outsider than homegrown. Take all out of state people away...population be 80% lighter. 80% less bad people. You get picture...keep telling how bad FL is...It is horrible place. Horrible. Stay away outsiders.

Man, I really should have read mbonga's long post before I posted... there is so much craziness listed there...wow.

Fink, I have never experienced anything that mbonga listed in that diatribe, except for crooked private schools, so lookout for that. My little experience was just with MCSE and MCDBA training, they were not technically crooked, just too much for what I got...live and learn. Oh, and during last year's hurricane season, the wind picked up an alligator, threw it at some german tourists while they were getting robbed, slammed it in a house which knocked it down...then while the owners crawled out, the alligator mauled them while at the same time a swarm of malaria carrying mosquitos (backed up by a pack of ravenous giant poodles that were released by their owners) attacked the city...which was of course already plagued by horrific traffic of biblical proportions.

Sorry to make fun mbonga, but I gotta rep the hometown/state :wink:
Seriously, after traveling around a lot, there are not many other places in the US I would rather live.

MBonga, you have my deepest sympathies that you had such a rotten experience here in the Upper east coast of Florida. However, and please take this with a grain of salt and humor, you description is sounding like a WSVN-Channel 7 news report regarding the stories that did not happen directly to you. For those of you not in the area, WSVN Channel 7, the FOX affiliate, is known for over dramatizing news, with introductory words like "SHOCKING NEWS.." for every story.

And not every area of Florida is exactly like you described. I'm sure there is that crony-ism everywhere. Each metropolitan area is different from each other, just like different parts of the state are different.

Yes, crap can happen here. Just like it is a possibility everywhere. But it doesn't happen everyday and to everyone. For example.. Yes, I've known 3 people to be held up by gun point, but they are alive and well. But that's 3 people during my time here in 30 years. Yes, industry and other factors are being REALLY stupid with our natural resources. I hate it too. But I'll be an active voter & go appreciate these natural wonders while I have them.

Those of us who live here accept its by no means perfect. The traffic. The stupid, selfish people. The corruption. The inflated rent, house prices, insurance and stagnant wages. The list is a bit much to list. We accept the inevitable risks, including hurricanes and other crap, and go on. Can't live scared of what might happen. That's no life at all. Instead, we prepare, remove opportunities for being shafted, and deal.

Be like the reed that blows in the wind...

On 2006-02-28 16:26, I dream of tiki wrote:
Instead, we prepare, remove opportunities for being shafted, and deal.

And we eat the alligators back.

Taste like chicken? To me it tastes like a pastiche of chicken and pork. The light meat tastes a bit porkish and the dark parts a bit chickenish.

Were sharks mentioned? We have loads of sharks.

http://capmel.com/hitler.htm

On 2006-02-28 16:26, I dream of tiki wrote:
MBonga, you have my deepest sympathies that you had such a rotten experience here in the Upper east coast of Florida. However, and please take this with a grain of salt and humor, you description is sounding like a WSVN-Channel 7 news report regarding the stories that did not happen directly to you. For those of you not in the area, WSVN Channel 7, the FOX affiliate, is known for over dramatizing news, with introductory words like "SHOCKING NEWS.." for every story.

And not every area of Florida is exactly like you described. I'm sure there is that crony-ism everywhere. Each metropolitan area is different from each other, just like different parts of the state are different.

Yes, crap can happen here. Just like it is a possibility everywhere. But it doesn't happen everyday and to everyone. For example.. Yes, I've known 3 people to be held up by gun point, but they are alive and well. But that's 3 people during my time here in 30 years. Yes, industry and other factors are being REALLY stupid with our natural resources. I hate it too. But I'll be an active voter & go appreciate these natural wonders while I have them.

Those of us who live here accept its by no means perfect. The traffic. The stupid, selfish people. The corruption. The inflated rent, house prices, insurance and stagnant wages. The list is a bit much to list. We accept the inevitable risks, including hurricanes and other crap, and go on. Can't live scared of what might happen. That's no life at all. Instead, we prepare, remove opportunities for being shafted, and deal.

Be like the reed that blows in the wind...

You tell em Liz... Good and bad down here, but mostly way better than lots of other places. I need an affordable, warm place to live with palm tress and an ocean nearby. This the only place that qualified within the USA. We also have plenty of TCers nowadays.

Florida it's not the humidity it's the stupidity !!!! How can you not love this overpriced waiting area on the way to heaven !!!! I live on the West Coast of FL. in a place called Seminole. The beach is a stop light and a short bridge to the beach. Will I ever leave Floriduh... never...
Dude, if you decide to move to Fla. sticker shock starts at 250k for a half decent place 3/2/1 .....
Good Luck !!!

Hey TikiLale,
I'm in the Seminole area as well ((by the Tom Stuart Causeway)Please feel free to give me a shout sometime !!!!
Aloha
Joe/Haole Kats

On 2006-02-28 13:59, Jawa wrote:
Sorry to make fun mbonga, but I gotta rep the hometown/state :wink:

I'm thinking of a song...

"Well I heard Mbonga sing about her,
Well I heard Mbonga put her down,
Well I hope Mbonga will remember,
Florida state don't need him around anyhow.
Sweet home sunny Florida,
Where the skies are so blue,
Sweet home sunny florida,
Lord, I’m coming home to you..."

Or something like that.
I shoulda known better than to insult somebody's home state. :)

http://www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/florida/

[ Edited by: mbonga 2006-03-01 07:41 ]

FL unions

"He who does anything because it is the custom makes no choice."
Tiki Jam 2

[ Edited by: Loki 2006-03-01 08:04 ]

On 2006-02-27 04:39, mbonga wrote:
Now some natural history. Most waterways larger than a creek are not safe to be near because of alligators. There was a classy seafood restaurant on one point near where I lived, and there were large alligators strolling by the windows where the diners ate. That might sound like fun until you realize that there were no fences there, and the alligators could just as easily have strolled up to the front door of the restaurant. There were constantly newspaper reports of dogs and kids near the water being grabbed and carried off and eaten by alligators. Alligators were in public parks, golf courses, nature trails, drainage ponds, the Indian River in people's backyards, and of course lakes. One newspaper report told of a homeless guy living alone near a lake near where I lived (there are a lot of homeless down there, due to relatively warm weather) who was grabbed by an alligator and mauled for a period of about 2-3 hours until somebody happened by to help out. In California I constantly explored fields and creeks and shores all alone as a kid, but if I had done that in Florida, I'd probably be dead by now. You don't want to get mauled by an alligator. Even though that homeless man escaped, the dirt and bacteria in a gator's mouth are so dangerous that they thought the man's leg would have to be amputated just from the infection alone.

Don't forget the alligator gars...

And the alligator snapping turtles...

C'mon in...the water's fine. :D

Or the Gatorbass...

the crockashark...

the gatortrout...

or the fearsome bubbagator...

[ Edited by: Kailuageoff 2006-03-08 18:43 ]

Well, that explains it. With rare, exotic creatures like that, no wonder everyone and their mother is moving here.

You know, as Fox-news-like as mbonga's post was, Florida isn't the prettiest state out there. Beaches and swamps. That's it. I'm not much of a beach going guy and you can get your fill of swamps pretty quick, so what does that leave me? Disney World. Actually, California is a much more beautiful state, but we all know it's going to slide off into the Pacific Ocean any day now. And don't get me started on the smog, the mudslides, the wildfires and the roaming packs of wolves...

Hey Finkdaddy and Pablus and anyone else headed to the Sarasota area this April,

I live here in Sarasota part of the year and it's great. (the other part of the year I live in Paris, France) I'm considering moving back here full time. I'm pretty picky about where I live so that should tell you something....
I'm new to the forum, but have been into Tiki since I was a kid in the late 70's...

I'm actually considering organizing a Tiki Crawl for the Sarasota area, starting at Bahi Hut and ending at the beach tiki bar in Venice, with Tiki bars in Nokomis, Bradenton and elsewhere in Venice ( 5 tiki bars, but there are more..all in these adjacent small towns) included.

SO, if you're in the area and feel like taking the Tiki tour with me, sometime in the first half of April, drop me a line.
Cheers,
Punahou

Well, if you'd like to meet the Fabulous Finkdaddy, then just PM me and I'll tell you how to get to The Lagoon Lounge for the April 6th Luau.

Since I'll be leaving for Paris on April 15th I could use some language practice.

You don't have to bring anything except the proper luau wear.
Crazed Mugs and Haole Kats! will be providing the evening's entertainment.
There will be delicious tropical fare and frosty cocktails, including non-alcoholic ones.

and

wait for it

FRESH MINT!!!!

It would be my honor to meet you, I hope you can make it over!