What is a good base drink for a new 'bar'?

Hey guys and gals,

I'm starting my home Tiki bar hobby and I've been reading Beachbum Remixed, which recommends finding a single base drink that I want to make and then expanding my bar from there. My favourite drink is the Jet Pilot but it has a lot of ingredients, it's blended (I've not got a blender yet), and I'd rather get sick of making a cocktail I'm not in love with.

My mission is to find a drink that uses flexible ingredients, is shaken (I've got a Boston Shaker), and is generally delicious. I haven't got an ice crushing machine yet, so bonus points for avoiding crushed ice... however it's my next planned purchase. My plan is to make as many cocktails as I can with the ingredients from this base drink, then add bottles/tools here and there to expand my menu over time. This hobby is expensive!

What would you guys recommend?

This is your baseline!
You always start with a Trader Vic's Recipe "Mai Tai"

This is not a matter of opinion, taste or free choice
it is a moral imperative & existential bookmark in the dogeared, book of life.

On 2016-01-12 05:19, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
This is your baseline!
You always start with a Trader Vic's Recipe "Mai Tai"

This is not a matter of opinion, taste or free choice
it is a moral imperative & existential bookmark in the dogeared, book of life.

Couldn't have said it any better... because I'm not a native speaker of English.

Anyway, in case you deceide to start with a TV's Mai Tai, try to buy quality ingredients right away.
Don't you happen to be in Berlin, Warboys? Get this orgeat: http://rum-depot.de/shop/hausbar/440/mandel-sirup-orgeat-frankreich
It's the best you can get in Germany.

The Trader Vic's Mai Tai is also my suggestion. It acts as a gateway for those who have not yet had complex and multi-layered cocktails which we all have come to know and love. It also helps dispel the bad image which "tiki" or "tropical" drinks have in the minds of many. But wait, there's more -- it also allows you to educate your friends/family/etc. on the virtues of using good and fresh ingredients.

To follow up on the Mai-Tai, and to begin building a basic bar repertoire, you may consider adding the fairly easy yet also generally well-loved Pusser's Painkiller.

I fully endorse the importance of a Trader Vic's Mai Tai.

However, since you've specifically asked for drinks that don't require crushed ice, might I suggest a simple daiquiri. Rum, lime juice, and simple syrup, couldn't be easier. But do keep in mind that since you're not crushing your ice first, you will have to shake the bejeezus out of it to get sufficient dilution before straining it into a cocktail glass.

When you want to expand your repertoire, you can start experimenting with different rums, different citrus, and different sweeteners. My favorite version contains spiced rum, lemon juice, and falernum or ginger syrup. Once you have the basics down you can play with flavors and proportions as you expand the options in your bar.

On the subject of a Mai Tai, how do people feel about Rumdood's rum combo?

http://rumdood.com/2009/01/26/a-month-of-mai-tais/

His best combo calls for Appleton Estate 12 Year Old and Clement VSOP, which seem easily acquirable.

Mai Tai was definitely a consideration for my base drink since I read that blog about a month ago. Very scientific stuff :wink:

On 2016-01-12 05:52, Poltergeist wrote:
Anyway, in case you deceide to start with a TV's Mai Tai, try to buy quality ingredients right away.
Don't you happen to be in Berlin, Warboys? Get this orgeat: http://rum-depot.de/shop/hausbar/440/mandel-sirup-orgeat-frankreich
It's the best you can get in Germany.

I was actually in France for new year and picked this up. I didn't know if it was good or not, but I read that Monin was a bit crap and it was the only Orgeat I could find in a small suburb of Rouen.

Lucky, huh?

[ Edited by: Warboys 2016-01-12 07:37 ]

RE: Blending drinks. Because a recipe says to blend, do not feel you HAVE to do so. I rarely blend, I prefer them shaken and on the rocks.

On 2016-01-12 07:33, Warboys wrote:
On the subject of a Mai Tai, how do people feel about Rumdood's rum combo?

http://rumdood.com/2009/01/26/a-month-of-mai-tais/

His best combo calls for Appleton Estate 12 Year Old and Clement VSOP, which seem easily acquirable.

Mai Tai was definitely a consideration for my base drink since I read that blog about a month ago. Very scientific stuff :wink:

Rumdood definitely knows his stuff and that particular combo is pretty true to the original. But if you're going to invest in those products (neither is inexpensive) just for a mai tai then you should also use the proper ice. The small ice is necessary for proper dilution. Otherwise your drink will not have the proper balance. If you can't afford an electric crusher right now, there's nothing wrong with using a hand-crank one, that will cost you less than a bottle of either of those rums. As long as you get one that has an all-metal mechanism, it will work fine. I bought a vintage one from the '70s on eBay and it works great if I'm just making a few drinks. I'd buy bagged crushed ice if I were making more. Here's one almost exactly like mine that would work: http://www.amazon.com/Metrokane-7174-Retro-Ice-Crusher/dp/B00022KIXU/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1452619058&sr=8-9&keywords=manual+ice+crusher

Also, note that the names of the Appleton Rums have changed recently. The Appleton Estate 12 is now Appleton Estate Rare Blend.

On 2016-01-12 07:55, Loki-Tiki wrote:
RE: Blending drinks. Because a recipe says to blend, do not feel you HAVE to do so. I rarely blend, I prefer them shaken and on the rocks.

Ditto what Loki said. One of my favorite "lighter" cocktails is the Saturn. The Beachbum version is blended, but I prefer Martin Cate's shaken/strained version. In most cases, if the original is blended, you'll want to shake the non-blended one a bit longer than normal to get the proper dilution ratio.

On 2016-01-12 09:20, JenTiki wrote:
if you're going to invest in those products (neither is inexpensive) just for a mai tai then you should also use the proper ice.

Also, note that the names of the Appleton Rums have changed recently. The Appleton Estate 12 is now Appleton Estate Rare Blend.

Are Clement and Appleton 12 not usable in many other drinks? I'm hoping to get them not just for a Mai Tai, but for a variety of other drinks. I've got the impression that the Appleton is pretty flexible, but the Clement I picked was because of Rumdood.

I suppose a hand crank ice crusher would be an easy pickup, although I'll probably end up getting the machine before the rums arrive :wink: You can also buy crushed ice here in Germany but I'm not sure if it's crushed perfectly for tiki drinks. I'll have a closer look next time I'm at the supermarket.

RE: Appleton. This is the correct one, right? http://rum-depot.de/shop/rum/rum-gelagert/19/appleton-estate-extra-12yo-jamaica

[ Edited by: Warboys 2016-01-12 09:37 ]

Dam you got Havana Club!
These are good.
Same drink two ways, one omits the Apple liqueur.

Havana-Club COCKTAIL - Cuban-Ginger

20ml of Apple liqueur
120ml of Ginger Ale
60ml of Havana Club Añejo 7 Años

In a long drink glass
Add ice cubes
Add the apple liqueur and the Havana Club Añejo 7 Años
Complete with Ginger Ale
Stir

7 & Ginger
Ingredients
50ml Havana Club Añejo 7 años
60ml ginger ale
2 thin slices of ginger
1 thin slice of lime
Large ice cubes
Method
Build in the glass, Fill the glass with ice
Place the slices of ginger and lime on top of the ice
Pour Havana Club Añejo 7 años and ginger ale on the ginger and lime slices.

On 2016-01-12 09:37, Warboys wrote:

RE: Appleton. This is the correct one, right? http://rum-depot.de/shop/rum/rum-gelagert/19/appleton-estate-extra-12yo-jamaica

Yes but that price is insane.

Oh really? Crap. What's a good price? I feel so hopelessly lost with almost everything at the moment. The promise of delicious drinks is keeping me in though!

I'll echo the blending thing - blending is an option to mix your drink, but in reality shaking is just as good. In fact, speaking of RumDood, he used to not blend anything (if he does) and preferred shaking. He probably still shakes and gives it a hearty shake for maybe 30-40 seconds. It does the job well. As far as Mai Tai rums I tend to use Appleton VX and El Dorado 5 or 8 - same styles of rums just not aged as long as the 12 of course. I view my Clement as special as it is more expensive than my Demerara or Jamaican rums, but wouldn't hesitate to drink a Mai Tai with it.

I actually think starting from the Jet Pilot is a great idea! Grapefruit juice, lime, cinnamon syrup, pernod, bitters...these things are used in lots of other drinks. From here you can easily make a zombie by adding the grenadine to your bar ingredients too. Although some people have suggested starting from a Mai Tai, as it's a very popular drink, I might think differently. Fewer drinks use orgeat syrup than they use falernum. The Mai Tai would require you to keep some curacao however, which is also very essential.

Buy this, put in glass, add ice stir, drink.
http://rum-depot.de/shop/rum/rum-mixen/370/havana-club-seleccion-de-maestros

On 2016-01-12 09:37, Warboys wrote:

Are Clement and Appleton 12 not usable in many other drinks? I'm hoping to get them not just for a Mai Tai, but for a variety of other drinks. I've got the impression that the Appleton is pretty flexible, but the Clement I picked was because of Rumdood.

Appleton is usable in many other drinks. Clement is usable in a handful of other drinks, but not near as many as an El Dorado.

RE: Appleton. This is the correct one, right? http://rum-depot.de/shop/rum/rum-gelagert/19/appleton-estate-extra-12yo-jamaica

[ Edited by: Warboys 2016-01-12 09:37 ]

That is the old bottle/label of the Appleton, but yes, same thing.

On 2016-01-12 10:16, kkocka wrote:
As far as Mai Tai rums I tend to use Appleton VX and El Dorado 5 or 8 - same styles of rums just not aged as long as the 12 of course. I view my Clement as special as it is more expensive than my Demerara or Jamaican rums, but wouldn't hesitate to drink a Mai Tai with it.

Clement is an agricole rhum with a very distinct flavor profile with a lot of grassy funkiness. It is made from the pressed juice of the cane, whereas Appleton and El Dorado are made from molasses. Certainly it works in a mai tai if you're looking for the stronger, funkier flavor, but a very different animal than the other two. Even Appleton and El Dorado are different "styles" from each other. Demerara rums (all the El Dorados) tend to be sweeter and smoother than Jamaican rums (all the Appletons), whch have more heat and complexity of flavor.

If you're going to use a demerara rum and a Jamaican rum, one of them needs to be on the stronger end of the flavor and ABV spectrums (this is where the Clement comes into play in Rumdood's blend). If you want the strength and heat to come from the Jamaican, consider an overproof Jamaican rum, like Smith & Cross instead of Appleton. If you want to stick with the Appleton 12, then use a deeper Demerara like Lemon Hart or Hamilton 151 to get the richness and strength. You'll get plenty of use from the 151 Demerara in tiki drinks.

The easier thing to do is get Denizen's Merchant Reserve if it's available where you are. It was specifically blended to recreate the flavor of Trader Vic's original mai tai rum blend. So it's really a one-drink pony, but it's not expensive. I usually keep at least three bottles on hand. Saves time, money, and shelf space than buying two different rums.

Jen, would the Lemon Hart Original work in place of the Clement? I got that already :P

Clement is an agricole rhum with a very distinct flavor profile with a lot of grassy funkiness. It is made from the pressed juice of the cane, whereas Appleton and El Dorado are made from molasses. Certainly it works in a mai tai if you're looking for the stronger, funkier flavor, but a very different animal than the other two. Even Appleton and El Dorado are different "styles" from each other. Demerara rums (all the El Dorados) tend to be sweeter and smoother than Jamaican rums (all the Appletons), whch have more heat and complexity of flavor.

Sorry, I know this but perhaps didn't word my reply correctly. Basically what I meant is as such:

Instead of Appleton + Clement, I use Appleton + El Dorado. Instead of Appleton 12 I use Appleton V/X. The Appletons are the same style of (Jamaican) rum, but obviously cost and aging differ. Similar taste there. Then, instead of the Agricole I use a Demerara, in which case I use El Dorado 5 or 8 instead of a higher aged rum like the ED 12.

I had a lot of thoughts mixed into one reply.

On 2016-01-12 12:04, Warboys wrote:
Jen, would the Lemon Hart Original work in place of the Clement? I got that already :P

Do you mean the yellow label Lemon Hart 80 proof (or maybe it's 86)? If so, sure! It has great depth of flavor to hold up against the other ingredients in a mai tai.

Personally, I'm not a fan of Clement, but only because I can't stand that style of rum, except in a very few, well-aged expressions of it. You see, I buy rums I don't mind drinking neat, or on ice. Really the only rums I buy strictly for cocktails are the Denizen I mentioned in my previous post, a couple of white rums (Puerto Rican and Panamanian) and the overproof Demerara rums. Certainly I use a lot of my sipping rums (but not all of them) in simple cocktails that highlight the spirit, like a daiquiri or a rum old fashioned, or some variation of that. But if I can't sip it neat, it's unlikely I'll spend money on it.

Agricole rum (Clement, Saint James, Rhum JM) tends to be divisive amongst rum-lovers. Some of us love it, some of us can't stand it, very few of us fall in between. I'm on the "can't stand it" end of that range. The aroma reminds me of burning tires and the flavor to me is like grass that was cut a week ago and left to mildew on the moist lawn. Yes, it has its place in some cocktails, I just don't usually go those places.

All that being said ... Clement also makes Creole Shrubb which is a rum-based orange liqueur that works very well in place of orange curacao in a mai tai! It's even nice on the rocks for you or your guests that enjoy a sweet liqueur. It's like Grand Marnier or Cointreau, but better!

It's all rum. There's no 'rules' to what you should use in what drink. Every person has their own individual likes and dislikes when it comes to flavours, and yes, whilst certain rums do work better when mixed with certain ingredients in any particular drink, that's not to say one that no-one has mentioned before is not going to work. Heck, you might even like it better than the so called 'recommended' one/s. Experiment. It's as simple as that.

Agricole rum is my favorite type of rum. I can sip them straight no problem and I think most of them are quite smooth. If you are making a Trader Vic's Mai Tai, you have to use Martinique rum because that is what the recipe calles for. Otherwise it is not the original recipe Mai Tai, but a spin on the recipe.

Clement is not my favorite, St James is but it is no longer imported to the US. The ones I like to use are Rhum JM, St James and Depaz. I think these are all smooth and light rums that work perfectly in a Mai Tai. I think Clement is harsher, but still would work well. Neissen is a bit too funky for me and Duquesne and St George are total garbage that should be poured down the drain.

That being said, I think El Dorado or Lemonhart would both make a good Mai Tai, it just would not be the Trader Vic's recipe.

I also find that my Agricole Rhum supply is the rum that I have to replenish the most out of any other rums. Many recipes call for it, you will not have any trouble using it up at a home tiki bar.

I can't fault the suggestion of the TV Mai-Tai as your baseline drink, it's a delicious (hell, one might go so far as to call it 'perfect') drink even if you're not using the ultimate rum combo. I get good results using Appleton V/X and Barbancourt. If you really want to save some scratch however, you could try the demerara cocktail, seeing as you've already got LH80 on hand. The Atomic Grog has two recipes, both great, and all you'd need is either a bottle of gold puerto rican or gold jamaican, both of which have good offerings that won't break the bank.

On 2016-01-12 04:49, Warboys wrote:
Hey guys and gals,

I'm starting my home Tiki bar hobby and I've been reading Beachbum Remixed, which recommends finding a single base drink that I want to make and then expanding my bar from there. My favourite drink is the Jet Pilot but it has a lot of ingredients, it's blended (I've not got a blender yet), and I'd rather get sick of making a cocktail I'm not in love with.

My mission is to find a drink that uses flexible ingredients, is shaken (I've got a Boston Shaker), and is generally delicious. I haven't got an ice crushing machine yet, so bonus points for avoiding crushed ice... however it's my next planned purchase. My plan is to make as many cocktails as I can with the ingredients from this base drink, then add bottles/tools here and there to expand my menu over time. This hobby is expensive!

What would you guys recommend?

Warboys, I’m with the group, Mai-Tai’s ! I started with em and my personal drink file has over 200 tiki and vintage drinks in it. Plus I have over 20 cocktail books and I was making some headway in trying most of them. Then Arriano went and posted his Christmas gift and I feel like I’m starting all over again.
Regarding crushed ice ; I own many ice crushers-, hand cranked and electric. Many times when I’m fixin just a couple of drinks I just bust it up in a plastic bag with a mallet, large rock or even a brick. Just be sure it’s good hard ice- home reefers just can’t do it
Have fun.

If you ladies & germs are done bloviating
can we just go back to my original post, because I have already had my local statuary store (Mike Stone's Statuary & Propane Mart)
carve it into stone, done & done!

Time to BBQ!

Yes i did have to Google that (thanks ATP) but it's quite ironic that that word came from you, the person who defines the meaning.

[ Edited by: swizzle 2016-01-13 07:13 ]

Don't get me started, now.....at least I can hold my liqueur :D

I have no interest in holding my liqueur. I'm just sick of looking at this site and reading comments from a person who is just not funny.

Hey if you want the good stuff, you have to buy a ticket
but why so serious, swizzle, having a bad day?

Things gotta be better in your part of the world, right?
because it's no party here at the moment.

In opposition to the other posters in this thread, I wouldn't go with the Mai Tai as my first drink!

It's a sublime drink no doubt but getting it 'right' isn't a formulaic 'grab get you can find on your area' - all the pieces matter (especially the Curaçao & the orgeat). When you have sought out good orgeat & Curaçao (to go with the expensive rums) you can still 'only' pretty much make Mai Tais.

The thing about drinking tiki drinks is you'll need a 'little of this' & 'a little of that'...

I would suggest adding a bottle at a time to your collection as you find a drink that calls for them.

Easy choices include different styles of rum:

Dark Jamaican rum
Spanish white rum
Spanish gold rum

Tiki ingredient staples Warboy hasn't mentioned having include:

Cinnamon syrup
Passionfruit
Orgeat
Pimento Dram (aka All Spice)
Falernum
Pernod
Angostura Bitters
Coco Lopez

Monin syrups are is easiest to find in Europe & although some are a bit too sweet (ie the orgeat & Passionfruit), the cinnamon (aka canelle) is great. It should cost about €7/8. The falernum & pimento dram are probably best accessible by an online order.

Assuming you (Warboy) still have some Clement & would like a suggestion for a 'next bottle' id suggest picking up some cinnamon syrup.

Although you'll probably not find another drink that uses it without needing something else you'll definitely find the cinnamon syrup useful to have in your cupboard & be able make a Donga Punch - a great drink for showcasing the agricole rum.

Using the best booze in your mixed drinks is kinda weird to me.
It may make them a bit better but drink the good stuff on the rocks
so you can taste the good booze you paid top dollar for.

Do a blind taste test of Mai Tais made with your best rum then one with a cheaper rum.
Bet many people can't tell the difference.
And you will be amazed at how many "mixologists" pick the low dollar booze.

During Prohibition in the United States (1919–1933), when alcoholic beverages were illegal, cocktails were still consumed illegally in establishments known as speakeasies. The quality of liquor available during Prohibition was much worse than previously.[17] There was a shift from whiskey to gin, which does not require aging and is therefore easier to produce illicitly.[18] Honey, fruit juices, and other flavorings served to mask the foul taste of the inferior liquors. Sweet cocktails were easier to drink quickly, an important consideration when the establishment might be raided at any moment.

"Bartender trumps mixologist"
In Asia, experienced bartenders tend to consider "mixologist" a gimmicky title employed by green bartenders.

Mixologists: Drink masters or just pretentious bartenders?
Maggie Hiufu Wong, CNN
Updated 1:38 PM ET, Fri May 1, 2015
http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/04/travel/mixologists-or-bartenders/

But when you have your own bar, eventually you will be able to discern the difference. So yeah, don't start out with the million-dollar top-shelf stuff. Upgrade as your tastes upgrade as well. But on the other hand, using "sipping rums' in cocktails is kind of a waste. So like everything, you should use your judgement as appropriate.

And don't get me started on the whole mixologist thing. Like St. DeGroff says in the article, it was just a term he found that he used to denote that his bar was dong something different than everyone else. And like like most marketing, people have misappropriated for all kinds of sometimes ridiculous ways.

As for the Mai Tai, there are times when I think that I could be perfectly happy with just Mai Tais and Manhattans for the rest of my life! The secret is good ingredients, especially good orgeat. Learning to make your own orgeat is a great skill to learn.

The only term I hate more than mixologist is "handcrafted" Like really.
Hated it back in the day when drinks were made my machines.

These words are used by restaurant owners and bar owners to get more money out of you.
That and the food network needs to get you all excited about whatever show they are pushing.

The really good cook or bartender makes great food, drinks out of crap.
Anybody can take the best of high dollar ingredients and make a good drink.

THB is right on with what I was sayin don't mask "sipping rums' with other stuff
unless you don't like the taste of rum.

Drink recipes that have hard to find ingredients suck, or a flavored rum that won't
even be around years from now.

I concur, mixologist is just a hipster term, used by wankers who think "Bartender"
is not a cool enough job title.

A few decades ago (or more), calling a person that mixes drinks a "bartender" was considered a term used by wankers who thought "Barkeep" was not a cool enough job title.

First known use of the word "Barkeep" 1671 A.D.
and a Hipster was called a Dandy or a Fop.

[ Edited by: Atomic Tiki Punk 2016-01-17 03:12 ]

The best bartender I knew of was Skip Davis at the Kahiki now his drinks
were not good as in way too boozie.
Now Jim who worked with Skip made great drinks, BUT everybody LOVED Skip!
He was fun, he was fast to get you a drink even if it was not the best one you ever had.
The thing that made Skip the best was he was a RIOT!
He made it fun to be in the Kahiki!

Now the "mixologists" at the bars here in Columbus are so far ahead of us paying
customers, ever so much smarter than us that they don't have time for all the people in
their bar, no they only have time for the people they know or the other "mixologist gods" that may come in.

I have booze that bar will never see, I can make a drink far better than them.
You go out or go to a party or someone's home for fun to enjoy yourself.
These new bar workers have lost that concept the enjoyment is part of that 10 dollars you over pay for a drink.

So whatever drink you choose the one thing you need to add is Fun and hospitality.

This!

I can understand rejecting both "mixologist" and "handcrafted" because of how the pop-culture press (and "wankers") have misappropriated them. What would you put on your business card as a home cocktail aficionado? Just plain "bartender," or "barkeep?" What are your thoughts on which is appropriate and not pretentious?

My pet peeve -- all the over-the-top bartenders who craft really unique and often (but not always) tasty drinks using exotic ingredients or crazy tinctures and syrups which only their bar uses. So they publish recipes, but nobody wants to invest in single-purpose spirits, liqueurs, and bitters, or take two weeks to make specialty syrups and tinctures for just one cocktail. I'm surprised how much of that I see at cocktail competitions and exhibitions.

Coming soon - Ace Explorer's Buffalo Butt Bitters. It'll put tongue on your hair!

“What would you put on your business card as a home cocktail aficionado?”
Proprietor May work, or just prop.
Or say established 2015 Proprietor.

There are people who are really good and are better than most bartenders, Beach Bum, Tiki Ti
and many others.
The problem is every yahoo mostly the young goofs call themselves a Mixologist, some have NEVER worked in a bar or could for a busy weekend shift.
I think Mixologist will become one of those duchy words soon.
We try to avoid places that use Handcrafted or Mixology, crafted in their adverts as most times those places are not the sit down and get to know the people type bars.
Handcrafted or Mixology, crafted = young, overpriced bars.

Making syrups is a good way to at least know what is in your mixers and it’s fun.
I find it odd that you don’t hear much about pomegranate juice, I know not tiki.
But dam that is a great flavor and you can freeze it for later use.
Fresh pomegranate is in season from about November to around end of January.

Just got a Sous Vide Water Immersion Cooker for Christmas and want to make some infused
booze and syrups, should be fun.

Getting ready to juice a pomegranate.

On 2016-01-18 11:40, tikiskip wrote:
“What would you put on your business card as a home cocktail aficionado?”
Proprietor May work, or just prop.
Or say established 2015 Proprietor.

Skip, those are good thoughts, that's definitely more low-key. (If you're really good, you don't need to brag, right?)

Pomegranate? Grrrrr... Have been looking for POM Mango Pomegranate for a few weeks in my area so that I can make some of Kahuna Kevin's drinks. Sadly the last place that I know carried it stopped. You're right, it's a great flavor, and only seems to appear in tiki drinks in the form of grenadine.

Have fun juicing your pomegranates. I gave up juicing mine a long time ago -- crap, doing one seed at a time, I think it took me a whole day to squeeze the juice from two pomegranates! (just kidding...)

"Kahuna Kevin's drinks"
Got one of those drink books, now I have LOTS of booze and mixers, don't
think I could make ONE of those drinks without a long search and spending tons o cash.
Kevin come out with book that has easy to find ingredients next time.
Dam even the Cola is hard to find.
Found it here for only $45.00 dollars per 6 pack, Really?

AND what do you do when they stop making POM Mango Pomegranate?
Did all that run all over town and order from the internet to find odd stuff thing and
guess I'm over that.

Ya got the Mai Tai, it's great drink everybody tries to reinvent the wheel, put perfume
on a rose.

Juice your own Pomegranates and reduce to a rich syrup, Great in strawberry rhubarb pie!
Kahiki had a pinya passion with pineapple, maybe you could make a Poma Passion.

https://jet.com/product/detail/c679eacadb1f441eab7e64335037fff0?jcmp=pla:ggl:food_beverages_tobacco_a2:beverages_soda_a2_other:na:na:na:na:na:2&code=PLA15&k_clickid=850ec621-87e3-47ad-b9d6-c8f95f9c009a&abkId=403-173363&gclid=CIb3ifGctMoCFQ2HaQodnCUNOw

Proper grenadine is just pomegranate juice and sugar combined in equal parts.

Used in 1934 Zombies for one, so i would say it was Tiki.

On 2016-01-18 12:58, tikiskip wrote:
"Kahuna Kevin's drinks"
Got one of those drink books, now I have LOTS of booze and mixers, don't
think I could make ONE of those drinks without a long search and spending tons o cash.

Skip, I know what you mean about Kevin's recipes, and I was trying not to go there, haha... He does have a passion and a talent for blending a multitude of flavors. There are a few recipes in his books which can be made with using less than 12 ingredients, and I do try those, and he is good at what he does and I like his books. I have adopted a policy of NOT going out and buying ingredients which can only make ONE cocktail. There are some very good exceptions to my adherence to that policy - I call those my "one hit wonder" ingredients. They must be recipes with rock-star reviews for the finished cocktails.

Dang, $45 for a 4-pack of a cola? I'm sure it's good cola. It better be.

On 2016-01-18 07:52, AceExplorer wrote:

My pet peeve -- all the over-the-top bartenders who craft really unique and often (but not always) tasty drinks using exotic ingredients or crazy tinctures and syrups which only their bar uses. So they publish recipes, but nobody wants to invest in single-purpose spirits, liqueurs, and bitters, or take two weeks to make specialty syrups and tinctures for just one cocktail. I'm surprised how much of that I see at cocktail competitions and exhibitions.

---

Coming soon - Ace Explorer's Buffalo Butt Bitters. It'll put tongue on your hair!

There used to be a local cocktail book that i bought several issues of that was like this. The book was put out by a distributor and was effectively a way for them to promote the product lines they carried. The book would have an advertisment for a particular brand, i.e. Cointreau, and then have three cocktails using that ingredient, with the drinks made by various bartenders from different bars here in Australia.

The first issue, and maybe even the second, were fine, they had drinks in them you could make at home. Sure, you might have had to go out and buy a bottle of something you didn't have, like some Brandy or Midori for example, but then each book after that started doing exactly what you have mentioned Ace. There would be ONE drink that sounded great until you read the ingredients and it said you needed some bizarre syrup they had obviously made for the bar that there was no way you would spend your time making at home just to make one drink. Something like a fig and rhubarb syrup. Naturally i stopped buying it after about the fourth edition.

And RE: Kahuna Kevin's books, i have a drink dedicated for/to me in volumes 2 & 3 and you have no idea how many arguments we had when he was coming up with the recipes about him using products that are readily available. Especially to me here in Australia. One of the biggest problems i had was that he kept wanting to substitute an ingredient with one, that either i just couldn't buy here, or, was so expensive there was no way i would go out and buy a bottle just to make one drink.
The drink in the third book, The Third Dilemma, was my recipe which i sent him to tinker with/adjust the ratios (even though i liked the drink as it was) and he still subbed some ingredients. I had to go out and buy the $50 bottle of Grand Marnier, which i never would buy normally, instead of the $42 Cointreau which i generally alwys have a bottle of on hand.

Having said all that, i was fortunate enough to spend some time at his house when i was there in 2012 and must say that of the several drinks that he made me, although there was one i wasn't too keen on, all the others were really, really good, and on par with, if not better, than some of the drinks i had at Smugglers Cove and Forbidden Island.

On 2016-01-18 07:52, AceExplorer wrote:
What would you put on your business card as a home cocktail aficionado? Just plain "bartender," or "barkeep?" What are your thoughts on which is appropriate and not pretentious?

I have a card I use for rum and cocktail festivals and networking. It says "Rum and Cocktail Enthusiast." I've found that folks in the industry appreciate that I'm not pretending to be something I'm not. It says I'm passionate about rum and cocktails, but also that I know I still have a lot to learn.

Although I've made lots of drinks for several friends at parties, and have created original cocktails that have been finalists in competitions, I've never worked professionally in a bar/restaurant/hotel (except for a 6-month stint tapping wine in a restaurant kitchen when I was 19). So I would not assume a title I don't think I've earned (e.g. bartender, mixologist).

All that being said ... it's your bar. You tend it. I think that makes you a bartender. As long as your card is clear about it being a home bar, and not a professional establishment, you should be okay calling yourself the bartender. I once worked the bar at a friend's home tiki bar and was referred to as the "guest-tender" which I think was fine since I was filling in for the usual bartender, the owner of the bar.

Just don't say mixologist. Ever. Nobody should. It's almost as bad as the latest self-important title to come out of the woodwork: Bar Chef. [shiver/]

An article on "fake" and "douchey" beer bars came up today on Thrillist. It reminded me of what we've been posting here recently about "mixologist" and all the other terms. It seems that beer drinkers have to put up with their own form of wankers too, not to mention the infamous "cheater pint" glasses they use to either rip off their customers, or to cling to staying in business. Just watch your local bars carefully - lets hope some of these shenanigans don't show up in our favorite tiki places.

From watching our "what are you drinking now" thread here, we clearly have a number of devoted beer aficionados on Tiki Central. I don't think this is too big of a derail of this thread, and hope you find it both amusing and informative like I did.

Here are the paragraph titles:
The beer list is separated into "foreign" and "domestic"
It refers to all the taps as "microbrews"
It only carries "nano" beers
It insists on serving all foreign beers in small glasses
It calls Belgian beer "Belgium beer"
It serves all wheat beers with a lemon slice
Dark beers are only served on nitro
It advertises "ice-cold beers"
All the pint glasses are chilled
All the glasses are cheater pints
The bartender aims to minimize head
All the pint glasses have logos on them
All beer is served in plastic cups

I also went ahead and posted the full article text - minus the filler stock photos - because we all know how things last forever on the internet...

https://www.thrillist.com/drink/nation/signs-of-a-fake-craft-beer-bar

How to Spot a Fake Beer Bar
By Ezra Johnson-Greenough (Published on 1/19/2016)

Most bars serve beer. But that doesn’t make them “beer bars,” those oases for discerning beer-lovers looking to really nerd out on the best brews in the world. But the term “beer bar,” like so many others, has become bastardized to the point that it’s hard to tell whether you’re in for a world-class experience or a glorified frat party. These are the signs that a “beer bar” is using the moniker a little too liberally... and likely pouring conservatively.

The beer list is separated into "foreign" and "domestic"
Misleading and out of touch, the domestics, premium, and/or imports section on a beer menu should be limited to Applebee’s and airport bars from the ‘90s, but occasionally they’re unwelcome holdovers from another era, like Christina Aguilera or Regis Philbin. Not all "domestic" beers are even brewed in the US. There’s a good chance your Guinness was brewed in Canada. "Premium" is just a word. It’s about time we just start calling beer "beer."

It refers to all the taps as "microbrews"
It’s hard to call Sam Adams a "microbrew" anymore. By 1984, the term "craft beer" was born as the once-tiny microbreweries were increasingly industrialized, yet breweries shelling out 6 million barrels a year are still called "microbrews" in some places. Even "craft beer" has become irrelevant these days, with constant redefining and multiple interpretations to the point that no one can be expected to clearly understand it. The only place that should be selling "microbrews" is a retro ‘70s throwback pub with shaggy carpet walls that smell of smoke and stale "microbrew."

It only carries "nano" beers
The only thing worse than a beer bar that only stocks "microbrews" is one where the manager believes the size of a brewery’s output directly correlates to quality. Trust us: some pot-bellied beardo stirring cans of malt extract into a dirty pot on a turkey fryer does not make better beer than Sierra Nevada. I’m all for supporting the little guy, but just because your buddy told you that your homebrew is great does not mean you should start brewing professionally. That’s not to say that there aren’t great nanobrewers, but they are likely to start producing a lot better beers after they move out of the garage and into a practical facility with professional equipment. In the meantime, can I get some beers on tap by someone with a brewing degree, please?

It insists on serving all foreign beers in small glasses
Just because a beer is from another country does not mean it should be served in a snifter, tulip, chalice, or other glassware of the week. A hefeweizen is of German origin, but I can’t imagine anyone serving it in anything smaller than a pint glass. All Belgian beer is not high alcohol and does not demand a smaller pour. Feel free to pour a 4% Berliner Weisse or a Radeberger pilsner in a pint glass, or even a mug.

It calls Belgian beer "Belgium beer"
We don’t call PBR "Amerikuh beer" or refer to kung pao chicken as "China food," so you should probably not call Belgian beer “Belgium beer.” I’ll continue to call bars that do this "stupid" rather than "educationally challenged."

It serves all wheat beers with a lemon slice
We really don’t mind fruit in our beers if that’s what the brewer intended, but I need a wedge of fruit on my glass like I need a bed of lettuce for my fish & chips or a sprig of parsley on my salmon. Nothing will kill a beer’s head and aroma quicker than a wedge of citrus on its rim. In the name of good marketing, Widmer Brothers invented the lemon wedge garnish for its hefeweizen. It was so successful that every amateur thinks garnishing any wheat beer with a citrus fruit is just proper serving etiquette. It’s not. At all.

Dark beers are only served on nitro
I don’t care what anyone says: nitro is not the wave of the future, and it doesn’t make anything taste better. Nitrogen is a gas better used in making fertilizer and Kevlar, not making your beer creamier. The so-called "perfect pour" does absolutely nothing for your beer except cause delays. It’s becoming cliche now for dark beers to be served on nitro as if they were all meant to be, but you’re actually shaving off the subtle hop spiciness, toasted coffee and caramel of the malts, and the effervescent carbonation that effortlessly releases a bouquet that is stymied by nitrogen.

This wouldn’t be that big of a deal if I could just order a non-nitro stout, but it's come to a place where bars often don’t even mention their stout is on nitro. If it’s not Guinness, then it should not be a given that it’s served nitrogenated.

It advertises "ice-cold beers"
Look, you cannot properly taste and appreciate a beer colder than 38 degrees, leaving the optimal temperature somewhere between there and 55 degrees (depending on the style). And before you start getting your panties in a bunch about how ice-cold beer is refreshing, do us all a favor and switch to drinking wine coolers.

All the pint glasses are chilled
There may be no faster way to tell the ownership either knows nothing about or cares nothing about good beer than a frosted pint glass. Nothing unfurls our man buns faster than a miniature iceberg melting into a beer like the polar icecaps. Beer is not meant to be served ice cold, and I am not necessarily prescribing warm beer either, but can we settle on a temperature that’s not going to leave my tongue stuck to the glass like the kid from A Christmas Story?

All the glasses are cheater pints
A pint is not only a vessel for alcohol, but also a unit of measurement that equals 16 perfect ounces. So when blowhardy douchebag bar consultants invented the 14oz cheater pint, we should have all poured our beers into the river (or over their heads). Hell, even a non-cheater 16oz pint is not large enough to get a proper head on your beer, let alone 14 measly ounces.

Cheers to Portlander Jeff Alworth’s Honest Pint Project, which aimed to rid the Earth of the scourge of the cheater pint and fell just short of becoming a law of the land. Still, the Honest Pint movement inspired many real bars to upgrade to a true imperial pint, ideally with a 16oz marker line on the glass.

The bartender aims to minimize head
Let me get this through your hop-addled heads: all beer should be served with a delightful, creamy head on top. This isn’t wine, it’s a malt-based carbonated beverage, and aromatics achieved as active compounds in the beer float to the surface and are unlocked as they reach the bubbles. A good head is as critical to beer as it is to your imaginary sex life.

All the pint glasses have logos on them
The first thing this tells you is that the bar is too cheap to purchase its own glassware, and if it weren’t for the distributor or beer reps hocking free schwag, you might just be drinking out of a plastic cup. The second thing it tells you is that the owner is probably in the pocket of a distributor trading money or favors for tap handles.

All beer is served in plastic cups
This is the sort of bottom-of-the-barrel situation normally only found in dimly lit strip clubs and dance clubs full of douchebags, but I have in fact found myself being served a "craft" beer out of a plastic cup from a so-called taphouse before. If you are served in a plastic cup, return it and ask for a glass. If they don’t give you a glass, leave.

Ezra Johnson-Greenough founded the New School Beer blog, and is the man behind Portland Beer Week, the Portland Fruit Beer Festival, and the Portland Farmhouse & Wild Ale Fest.