Recipe: Crappy Mai Tai...

Hello fellow Mai-ticians...

I followed TV's recipe and my mai tai tasted like poop. I used Demarara (El Dorado) and Myers Dark, Blue Curacao, Orgeat and lime juice. Anyone know what i did wrong...?

BTW- it tastes NOTHING like the Mrs T's mix and Demarara...

[ Edited by: wjake 2006-05-30 16:31 ]

Welcome aboard. You want to use Orange Curacao, not Blue. Also, you forgot the "Simple Syrup".

The TV recipe that I use most often is:

1 oz. Demerara Rum ("Ron Matusalem Rum Gran Reserve" is my personal favorite)
1 oz. Myers Rum
1/2 oz Orange Curacao
1/2 oz. Lime Juice
1/4 oz. Orgeat Syrup
1/4 oz. Simple Syrup

Garnish with cherry, fresh mint, blah, blah, blah...

This is an age-old discussion, Click here for more recipes.

Yeah, I used simple syrup, but it made it real sweet (eewww). I like the taste of the mixers and figured that making the mix from scratch would taste even better. But, alas, poop. I think it's the dark rum...?

I recommend taking the recipe Mach posted but sub Cockspur or Mount Gay Sugar Cane for the gold rum and Coruba for the dark. Yum.

Honestly I don't care too much for demerera in the Mai Tai, but that's me. There are many good rum combos to try.

EDIT: some of the low end El Dorados (the ones that are like $12 a bottle or less - they have no age listed on the label) are extremely harsh and could make about any drink taste like poop.

[ Edited by: Kono 2006-05-30 17:15 ]

If you want a Mai Tai that tastes like the Mr and Mrs T mix then don't mix a Trader Vic's recipe Mai Tai! If you want a fruity-pineapply mai tai then just use the mix with whatever cheap rum you have and be happy with that, or find a mai tai recipe that uses fruit juices and maix that from scratch.

If you want to make a real TV Mai Tai then follow the actual recipe. If you used demerarra, El Dorado and Blue Curacao then you didn't follow the recipe.

First of all, no demerarra. Get a good aged gold/amber rum, preferably and Barbados or Martinique rum. Mount Gay, St. James, or even Appleton Estate or Pussers.

Use Orange Curacao, not Blue Curacao. Blue Curacao is too sweet, not to mention too blue.

Use a fresh lime. One whole lime. Juice it and use the juice. If you want the drink more tart, then use 1/4 oz EACH of rock candy and Orgeat. If you want the drink a little sweeter, then use 1/2 oz each of rock candy and orgeat. Use 1/2 oz of the curacao. Add 1-1/2 tp 2 oz of the aged rum and top with a decent dark rum. Coruba, Myers, Gosling Black Seal. The drak rum topper should only be about 1/2 oz to no more than an oz depending on how strong you want the drink.

Don't expect it to taste like the Mr and Mrs T or Tahiti Joe mix. It won't. It will taste like a Mai Tai.

On 2006-05-30 16:28, wjake wrote:
Hello fellow Mai-ticians...

I followed TV's recipe and my mai tai tasted like poop.

Welcome! What better way to start on TC than to ask about Mai-Tais......

First, put all of the recipes aside. Then, tell us when and where was the best Mai-Tai you have ever had that you didn't mix yourself?

It may sound like a odd question, but I ask for a reason. If you have had Mai-Tais at any of the Grand Tiki Bars, like the Tiki-Ti, The Mai Kai, Trader Vic's, etc... then we can suggest some specific rum combinations. If your only Mai-Tai experience includes large quantities of Grenadine or Hurricane Glasses full of Pineapple Juice, then we will all gather for an intervention and make you some real Mai-Tais.

Then, while you are sampling some of the lovely suggestions above, do a search on Mai-Tai. The variations discussed in here are vast and most of them are worth trying!

If you used demerarra, El Dorado and Blue Curacao then you didn't follow the recipe.

Actually, all the research i did said that the two were the same (blue and orange curacao)... also, to quote Beachbum Berry's Intoxica, "Demarara rum is the secret ingredient in most truly memorable tropical drinks..." I realize i didn't follow the recipe, but where does one get the "17-year-old" rum that was that age in the 50s?

Well, Gee, I don't know what to tell you.

I have had many a mai tai mixed the Trader Vic's way. I have had them mixed at Trader Vic's in Beverly Hills and Emeryville. I have had them mixed by other TC mixologists. I have mixed them myself. None of them were made with El Dorado demerarra and Blue Curacao, and none of them ever tasted like poop.

A Vic's Mai Tai is going to be very sensitive to the ingredients that you put in it. If you put bad stuff in it, you're going to get a bad result. Demerarra and Myers's are both dark rums. While 17 year old Wray and Nephew has not been available since the 40s, there are reasonable substitutes. If you want to use demerarra, then use it instead of the myers's and use a better aged rum. That at least should help. And in my experience, Blue Curacao and Orange Curacao are not exactly the same. If you can't find orange curacao you could try it with triple sec or cointreau. They're not the sam, either, but the result might be better. Throw in a dash of orange bitters to make it a little less sweet.

It's still not going to taste anything like the Mr and Mrs T mix, though. Never will no matter what you mix it with (except, of course, if you mix it with the Mr and Mrs T mix).

[ Edited by: PiPhiRho 2006-05-31 00:11 ]

Although many People think this may have been a tall story, we were given some (15ml)17 YO by Wray & Nephew last year for the London Luau. The small bottle was auctioned off for an extremely small amount of money to one lucky person.
As Appleton are once again Sponsoring the event, Joy Spence, Appletons, Master Blender (and the only female one in the world) has decided to present Trader Vics in London with a botttle to go in a display case. It is to be Authenticated by Joy and all of the Drinks Press have beeen invited to cover the occasion, so it should be a historic occasion once again and the start of a great event.
More on the 17 YO... there are only 4 bottles in private hands in the world at the moment ( All with UK bartenders of finest Ilk) and a barrel in Jamaica, It is 74% Alc, very dark red in colour and makes one hell of a Mai Tai.

On 2006-05-30 19:09, Chip and Andy wrote:

On 2006-05-30 16:28, wjake wrote:
Hello fellow Mai-ticians...

I followed TV's recipe and my mai tai tasted like poop.

Welcome! What better way to start on TC than to ask about Mai-Tais......

First, put all of the recipes aside. Then, tell us when and where was the best Mai-Tai you have ever had that you didn't mix yourself?

It may sound like a odd question, but I ask for a reason. If you have had Mai-Tais at any of the Grand Tiki Bars, like the Tiki-Ti, The Mai Kai, Trader Vic's, etc... then we can suggest some specific rum combinations. If your only Mai-Tai experience includes large quantities of Grenadine or Hurricane Glasses full of Pineapple Juice, then we will all gather for an intervention and make you some real Mai-Tais.

Then, while you are sampling some of the lovely suggestions above, do a search on Mai-Tai. The variations discussed in here are vast and most of them are worth trying!

Dear Chip & Andy,
As long as you're offering--can you please tell me the combination that will taste most like the Mai Kai Mai Tai? Mahalo!

The only thing I would add to the above suggestions is to make sure that you're not adding too much orgeat and syrup. You need 1/4 oz of each, no more, no less. Use the teaspoon measurements given in the Grog Log. Do not use bartender shot glasses marked off in 1/2-oz. increments that you bought at the supermarket (I speak from experience here...:))

If you use the right amounts of orgeat and syrup, along with the juice of a whole lime, it should be plenty tart enough for you.

[ Edited by: Chip and Andy 2009-06-05 18:02 ]

On 2006-05-31 04:57, Chip and Andy wrote:
Version 2, the one I mix for myself:
Orgeat, Syrup, Senior Curacao Orange Curacao, Saint James Extra Old, Apple Estate Extra Old, garnish

Ah, yes. I wholeheartedly concur. That's identical to what I fix for myself, but I've never tried Senior Curacao brand. Only gone with Bol's myself. But that's a whole other message thread.

And, per your request...... This one is the most like the Mai-Tai's you would get in the Molokai Bar inside the Mai-Kai (after extensive research and totally in my opinion ):
Orgeat, syrup, lime, triple sec, Flor-de-Cana (sp?) 5 year, "Old Gold" gold rum, garnish with pineapple spear and cherry and a sprig of fresh mint and a short straw

Don't forget the orchid and the sprinkling of powdered sugar!

On 2006-05-31 12:20, GatorRob wrote:
Don't forget the orchid and the sprinkling of powdered sugar!

Orchids are hard to get for some people. Most of us in Florida can grow a pretty Dendrobium with little or no effort. Most of the Southern States can with varying degrees of effort. However, for some parts of our 48 putting an orchid in a drink is outside the possibility for your average Wednesday evening.

And, speaking of Wednesday evenings...... To the Bar!

Ackshully, even in the cold north (Seattle, at least), those same purple/magenta dendrobiums can be had for dirt cheap from a florist supply. Restaurants up there use 'em all the time in drinks. Well, not all the time, but commonly enough that it's not a shock when it happens.

Back on topic: the crappy Mai Tai -- like most tropical drinks, some balance is required, and you're not likely to get it right straight out of the gate. Plan on making it a few times, tweaking it each time, until you get it where you want it.

Not all limes are created equal, the amount of juice they give can vary quite a bit, so I suggest measuring it (start with 3/4 of an ounce of lime juice).

As others have touched on here, there's a lot of variety in rums out there, so substitutions can't be made willy-nilly. It's kinda like sausage -- you can make a lasagne using breakfast sausage or keilbasa instead of italian sausage, but it'll turn out different. You may like it better, so it's fun to experiment, but just know that it's a big change to make.

Others have said it, but it bears repeating in case there's any chance this point got missed: Blue curacao ain't orange curacao.

And, as PiPhiRho said, if you like the flavor of those mixes, you're not going to be happy with a real, original Mai Tai, because those mixes have drifted so far away from reality over the years that they no longer bear much resemblance to any recognizeable tropical drink. If you look at the mix ingredient list, you'll probably see a bunch of stuff like corn syrup and vague chemicals and flavorings -- what you're trying to do is akin to trying to re-create Banana Laffy Taffy using real bananas.

On 2006-05-31 15:20, Humuhumu wrote:
... Plan on making it a few times...

Excellent Idea! I think I'll I have another!

You know, quality control and scientific stuff......

Who wants to join me in studying the melting time of crushed ice in your average Mai-Tai? Then, who wants to do the same study on an above average Mai-Tai?

..here's what i was told, by the bartender of 15 years at trader vics before they closed at the palmer house..he said, that the recipe on the mai tai mix of trader vics is bogus (as if we didn't know) because they would never give away the real recipe to make the original ones found at traders vics ..it was written like that on purpose because hey!!, if folks could make it themselves, they wouldn't need to spend $8 or $9 for one at the trader vics location..that said, he said the secret was in the lime..true traders mai tais are a mix of the trader vics mai tai mix, rum and fresh limes .....forget the other ingredients he said.....it's just a smoke screen......now, if i wasn't so drunk at the time, i would have remembered the brand of rum...there are two ways to make this mai tai...when they were out of that particular rum, he told me the name of a substitue that was used where you could barely tell the difference between the two...luckily i still have his business card....i may have to drop a dime to find out the exact proportions.......

As it turns out -- blue curacao & orange curacao may be the same after all! We did a blind taste test between the two tonight at Forbidden Island. The general consensus was that both of the liqueurs were pretty nasty. We weren't clearing our palettes between the two, so if there were any subtle differences, they were lost on us, but basically it's the same stuff, and we couldn't tell them apart.

So, this leads me to the question -- why is it then that I have found blue curacao drinks to be so nearly universally gross? I love the color, and I've always been so disappointed that the drinks are never any good. Plus, some there tonight reported having attempted unsuccessfully to use blue curacao instead of orange in a pinch. The general consensus was that it was a two-pronged thing: 1) in order to get a drink to have a nice blue color, a lot of the blue curacao has to be used, and as was just mentioned, the stuff is vile on its own. Plus, the other ingredients chosen to go with it are selected with consideration for how they might skew the color, not just for taste consideration. 2) when used for substitution, it just looks ugly, just not right at all, and so the taste difference might be psychological.

Because the taste was so very strong, it might be that they are actually different, but we couldn't tell because it left such a vile taste in our mouths. A better test would be to make two actual drinks side-by-side using blue curacao & orange curacao, as that would let the stuff mellow out a bit. But generally speaking, it looks as if the two might be interchangeable, after all.

But boy howdy, would that make a visually unappealling Mai Tai.

Blue Curacao gives me a headache.
For real and for true.

It must be the dye, or maybe I was beaten up by smurfs when I was a youngin' but one Blue Hawaiian and I'm heading for the aspirin bottle.

Come to think of it, I wretch whenever I see Blue Man Group.

Anyway, I've made Mai Tais using Cointreau in a smaller amount than the curacao and it lifted the drink quite a bit. Triple Sec works in a pinch. Not so great though.

I just got a bottle of Conche Licor from the Kon Hemsbys and I'm going to try a Mai Tai made with that on Saturday. It's orange and vanilla in perfect balance with something else I haven't IDed yet.

Gonna try to create a drink with it too but that's another thread.

(PS - I want to punch you, poki'i, for getting to hang out at Forbidden Island all the time. You should create a drink there called "Jealousy" with midori, falernum and pernod)

[ Edited by: pablus 2006-06-03 13:04 ]

*On 2006-06-01 01:38, Humuhumu wrote:*The general consensus was that both of the liqueurs were pretty nasty.

Because the taste was so very strong, it might be that they are actually different, but we couldn't tell because it left such a vile taste in our mouths. A better test would be to make two actual drinks side-by-side using blue curacao & orange curacao, as that would let the stuff mellow out a bit. But generally speaking, it looks as if the two might be interchangeable, after all.

I didn't think it was awful tasting, just very sweet and a bit of a chemical aftertaste. But it wasn't something I wanted to spit out. I do agree that it would be more meaningful to compare 2 Mai Tais made with orange and blue versions.

pablus: I've tasted Curacao by Senor Curacao (see http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=18559&forum=10) side by side with Hiram Walker Curacao and Cointreau and Grand Mariner and Triple Sec, and based on this I would not use Cointreau in a Mai Tai. It is not even close in taste to curacao. In Cointreau the orange flavor is much more subtle, and other flavors come through when tasted straight. I would definitely use Cointreau in a margarita though because Triple Sec tastes nasty!

On 2006-06-01 10:39, thejab wrote:
I would definitely use Cointreau in a margarita though because Triple Sec tastes nasty!

Ditto.

On 2006-06-01 12:06, Unga Bunga wrote:

On 2006-06-01 10:39, thejab wrote:
I would definitely use Cointreau in a margarita though because Triple Sec tastes nasty!

Ditto.

Agreed! But don't forget that Cointreau IS triple sec. It is the first triple sec. The original label used to say Cointreau Triple Sec. All of the others are just pale imitations.

Orange and blue are the same except color. You can even get other colors on occasion. I have made many Mai Tais with the blue when the orange was not available. No worries.

As for the beginning of this thread...

If you are trying to recreate the taste of Mrs. T's Mai Tai mix, you are going the wrong way. That is not a Mai Tai. You can't then mix a proper Mai Tai and call it poop and gain any ground around here.

Try this other example. Mix a Margarita from the mix and then make one from scratch according to the real recipe and see what's "better." You'll likely gag on the real thing if all you ever drank was Margaritas served at Mexican restaurants from a mix.

If you want to make a Mai Tai from a mix, use Trader Vic's mix. I'll send you a bottle for shipping costs if you want. I have too many here and I have not cracked them in years. Maybe they are bad by now.

Use the juice of half a lime to balance the sweet of the syrup. ANd if you need fresh mint, I'll mail you a plant...

I've tasted them all side by side, too - along with that new Patron Cointreau knock-off (not bad) and I guess it depends on what you like.

I don't like the syrupy glaze-over of Curacao so much.
That's why I use a little extra lime when mixing with it, to cut it.

I think the Cointreau has a more realistic orange flavor. Delicate, but certainly not a shrinking flavor.

I agree that Cointreau is most definitely NOT the way to do a proper Mai Tai, but I've used it with good results when the curacao wasn't around.

(which means I ran out)

Swankys right, orange and blue curacao are the same.If you must use a curacao,I would recommend Marie Brizard if you can find it but, if you don't mind spending a few extra $$ buy a bottle of Cointreau.You can get it in a 375 ml bottle if you don't want to spring for a fifth.I'm not saying that It's the correct way to make mai tais but,I like it.

Over and out,
Donny

Opportunity knocks,trouble kicks the door down.

You guys are all AWESOME--so glad I found this site. Admittedly I'm a Mai Tai virgin, so I went for the syrup first. The taste wasn't that unappealing. And, being younger-ish (35) I missed all those great tiki bars and drinks, so I have nothing to base a Mai Tai on except the syrup crap. I think I'll order some from TV if you all think it's a little closer to what one should taste like.

I was curious about the blue curacao because, being from central IL, I was going to create an I Lai Nai Mai Tai (Illini) and sub blue for orange curacao and float an orange wedge...

Mahalo all.

On 2006-06-02 07:35, wjake wrote:
You guys are all AWESOME--so glad I found this site. Admittedly I'm a Mai Tai virgin, so I went for the syrup first. The taste wasn't that unappealing. And, being younger-ish (35) I missed all those great tiki bars and drinks, so I have nothing to base a Mai Tai on except the syrup crap. I think I'll order some from TV if you all think it's a little closer to what one should taste like.

I was curious about the blue curacao because, being from central IL, I was going to create an I Lai Nai Mai Tai (Illini) and sub blue for orange curacao and float an orange wedge...

Mahalo all.

Trader Vic's actually uses their Mai Tai mix at the restaurant. They do not mix them from scratch, so, you will be right on with their mix, but still not as good as the recipe. The mix tends to the sour side. You add lime and you are adding more sour to the concoction. But, that's the Mai Tai you get at TV. Pretty sour. They also do not use the good rums. If you use good rum, you should use the scratch recipe, which is lower in sour, and allows the rum tastes to come through. If you use the mix, just use any cheap dark rum.

If you make a Mai Tai with blue curacao instead of orange, you won't get a blue drink exactly. Brown is the traditional color. It'll be blue-ish-brown.

It'll be blue-ish-brown.

You're absolutely right. So I guess it also LOOKS like poop... oy. I think I'll try the TV mix first.