Trader Sam's - Orlando

On 2015-05-09 01:12, Hurricane Hayward wrote:
Not to get too far off topic, but a quick list of my favorite spots to relax with a cocktail when I'm not at the Poly would include Mizner's at the Grand Floridan, the Wave and California Grill at the Contemporary, Territory Lounge at the Wilderness Lodge, Crew's Cup at the Yacht Club, Belle Vue Lounge at the Boardwalk, Victoria Falls and Sanaa at Animal Kingdom Lodge, and Raglan Road at Downtown Disney. In the parks, options are more limited, but I enjoy the Tune-In Lounge and Brown Derby Lounge in Hollywood Studios, Yak and Yeti and Dawa Bar in Animal Kingdom, and three of the four full-service bars in Epcot's World Showcase (La Cava del Tequila in Mexico, the Rose and Crown in the UK, and Tutto Gusto in Italy).

Your list is very similar to my own. I would add Rix Lounge at the Coronado Springs resort. http://rix-lounge.com/ I give you extra points for Sanaa. Both Rix and Sanaa are my little secrets, so don't tell anyone else. Going a bit off the beaten bath does offer rewards at WDW.

May 4th

Food was good
drinks were decent..
Service was lacking.

Still loved it and had a blast

Wife and I

Traveling companions

Darren - and a good time was had by all! How did you rate/enjoy the drinks and the food?

On 2015-05-15 09:52, AceExplorer wrote:
Darren - and a good time was had by all! How did you rate/enjoy the drinks and the food?

Id give the food 7/10
drinks 7.5/10
decor 9/10

I was a little (just a little) disappointed in the special effects, they were cool but this is Disney! That tentacle could have had better movement.

cheers
Darren

Thanks for the ratings.

Many have commented on the animations/effects being a bit thin. It's as if Disney is licking their wounds from maintenance activities (and costs) for effects in other venues, and so they built stuff into Sam's which is fairly easy to operate and maintain over the long-haul. Although the volcano eruptions (and related projections in the windows) are superb - they have few or no moving parts other than a digital projector and mirrors.

It is a fun place.

On 2015-05-15 10:29, AceExplorer wrote:
Although the volcano eruptions (and related projections in the windows) are superb - they have few or no moving parts other than a digital projector and mirrors.

It is a fun place.

Totally agree, the volcano eruptions are FANTASTIC! Better (different?) than Anaheim.

I had/have zero problems with the windows at Grog Grotto - the effects are indeed an improvement over Enchanted Tiki Bar. I don't expect nor really desire anything animatronic, moving etc (they have a swinging squid tentacle). Your ratings I think are fair (enjoyed the pics on instagram), and of course you add another point to the service improvement plan. I've heard that cast members there have been receiving feedback from various online sources (maybe here too?) regarding the need to tone back a bit.

You went home with a Nautilus, right? I can't remember.

I did indeed buy the nautilus mug! :)

Two Trader Sam's Nautilus mugs are currently for sale on eBay. Prices are $112 and $125. If people are actually paying that much, then it might be easy to finance a fun night of eating and drinking at Sam's on other eBayer's dimes.

I looked but did not find any of the old Trader Vic's Nautilus shell mugs currently listed.

That is pretty common with the merch events too, they re-sell the items (prior to even going) to pay for the trip.

According to a friend of mine who is down there right now, they were out of the Nautilus mugs earlier in the week. Poo! I hope they get some more in before she leaves, since she's my only hope for getting one at less than triple or quadruple the price (once shipping is added).

On 2015-05-05 19:03, mmaurice wrote:
The only way to get the glasses is with the drink.

You can get the drink without the glasses at the reduced rate but not the other way around.

While sitting in the bar, they do serve all the drinks in the appropriate glass. If you are buying the drink with the glass, you get a separate receipt and pick up a brand new one as you leave.

If you sit on the Terrace, can you still take home a mug?

As long as you let your server know you wish to purchase, yes.

Thanks. Good to know they will serve you in the mugs outside. Going in November and I am hoping the wait will be less if I say we'll sit on the Terrace.

Get your pager, then go wait on the terrace, enjoy the music, and look over the menu and begin ordering. The time passes quickly, and sometimes the wait is much less than what they tell you at the door.

Or in less time, you could be at The Storm Shelter where there is no waiting!

(Sorry, couldn't resist!)

On 2015-05-20 09:39, kkocka wrote:
As long as you let your server know you wish to purchase, yes.

Same process as outside as inside. When you are done, they give you a receipt to take to the hostess stand inside. There they give you brand new mugs, in a box, in a bag to go.

On 2015-05-20 14:44, TikiHardBop wrote:
Or in less time, you could be at The Storm Shelter where there is no waiting!

And where a good time is ALWAYS had by all! :)

was there this past sunday at 7PM.
surprisingly only a 45 minute wait and fairly
quick drink and food service.
couldn't believe it being a major holiday weekend.
guess we lucked out.

A short USA Today video:

http://usat.ly/1IcWV80

On 2015-06-04 10:14, kenbo-jitsu wrote:
A short USA Today video: http://usat.ly/1IcWV80

Such a bummer that Uh-Oa doesn't move... I hope this figure will eventually be enhanced.

On 2015-06-04 10:46, AceExplorer wrote:
Such a bummer that Uh-Oa doesn't move... I hope this figure will eventually be enhanced.

Well, it's not like we didn't warn ya. Also, probably to repeat for the umpteenth time, the maintenence would probably be ridiculous. There's problems enough with the window projections going off-air or projecting a BSOD :lol:

On 2015-06-04 14:07, kkocka wrote:
Well, it's not like we didn't warn ya. Also, probably to repeat for the umpteenth time, the maintenence would probably be ridiculous. There's problems enough with the window projections going off-air or projecting a BSOD :lol:

I don't remember reading any warnings that parts of Sam's East were going to be built on-the-cheap, but I trust you that this thread contains a few warnings. The reality, from my view, is that this place was built by a company which is known around the world for animating figures and for putting their guests into highly innovative experiences, all of which require maintenance. The overall experience could have been much more, and the high-profile Uh-Oa figure sadly falls short of many guest expectations. Some 1960's era technology could enhance that figure and the effect. My hope is that there will be a Sam's 2.0 rehab in the future with some enhancements.

The BSOD is hilarious, I have not heard that before. Have you seen any photos of this hilarity? That's classic, and I'd love to see a photo.

This was in Orlando, of all places. I say that because I expected more than a month before there was some kinda malfunction. Recently California's windows have had issues (cursors showing up or "no signal" boxes) so I expected this to be from there but it ain't.

As far as animatronics, they break down fairly regularly in the parks and yet aren't fixed right away. An example I think I gave earlier was Brer Bear in Disneyland's Splash Mountain sitting broken, not bobbing, for a good six months - and that's a prime attraction in the parks! This is in a less-trafficked resort bar.

On 2015-06-05 10:41, kkocka wrote:

This was in Orlando, of all places. I say that because I expected more than a month before there was some kinda malfunction. Recently California's windows have had issues (cursors showing up or "no signal" boxes) so I expected this to be from there but it ain't.

As far as animatronics, they break down fairly regularly in the parks and yet aren't fixed right away. An example I think I gave earlier was Brer Bear in Disneyland's Splash Mountain sitting broken, not bobbing, for a good six months - and that's a prime attraction in the parks! This is in a less-trafficked resort bar.

Thanks for the photo, that is hilarious! (I hear that Apple products never break down, and they never get viruses, heh...) With regard to animated figures breaking down, I know it hasn't always been that way, and it's very sad to hear that its that way now. My guess is that budgets have been cut to such a degree by execs and managers so that they can achieve budget goals and earn their bonuses. This comes at the expense of the guest experience. So maybe it's best that Uh-Oa was not given any animation. This also makes me think that the very simple tentacle animation was made that way because it is very simple and requires less maintenance. That's smart in one way, but bad in another.

Still, I have to shake my head that a company known for pioneering mechanical animation decided to be so conservative in Sam's. Let's see what they do in the upcoming themed Hangar Bar in late 2015.

Thanks for the info exchange, Keith.

On 2015-06-05 11:37, AceExplorer wrote:
With regard to animated figures breaking down, I know it hasn't always been that way, and it's very sad to hear that its that way now. My guess is that budgets have been cut to such a degree by execs and managers so that they can achieve budget goals and earn their bonuses. This comes at the expense of the guest experience.

This is exactly what happened at the Disneyland Resort under Paul Pressler. Resulting in not only the complete rundown of the place, but unfortunately the death on BTM (among other incidents). The cheer of excitement when he left was surpassed only by the cheers of Michael Eisner's departure.

On 2015-06-05 11:37, AceExplorer wrote:
My guess is that budgets have been cut to such a degree by execs and managers so that they can achieve budget goals and earn their bonuses.

I don't know why Disney would be cutting budgets. The theme parks are supposedly doing very well.

See this article.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/02/03/us-disney-results-idUSKBN0L72HG20150203

In particular this:

Operating income at Disney's parks and resorts rose 20 percent to $805 million in the company's fiscal first quarter, ended Dec. 27 [2014], when more people visited its parks in the United States. They also spent more on tickets, merchandise, food and drinks.

Income rose TWENTY percent. That is huge.

I don't know why Disney would be cutting budgets. The theme parks are supposedly doing very well.

See this article.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/02/03/us-disney-results-idUSKBN0L72HG20150203

In particular this:

Operating income at Disney's parks and resorts rose 20 percent to $805 million in the company's fiscal first quarter, ended Dec. 27 [2014], when more people visited its parks in the United States. They also spent more on tickets, merchandise, food and drinks.

Income rose TWENTY percent. That is huge.

That is exactly why. The thinking goes, if income rose twenty percent while investing nothing, imagine how much we'll make investing even less. The thing is, they know people will come, no matter what. So the mindset becomes "well no need to do anything, just sit back and let the profit roll in." The problem is it just comes back later, and it's much more expensive then just maintaining your infrastructure in the first place. But that's the next administrations problem (reminds me of the Bush Administration, but that's a different conversation).

As with the Pressler era, he ran DLR into the ground until his departure. When the next person came in, Matt Ouimet who was VERY good, an extraordinary amount had to be spent to repair the place and get it ready for the 50th Anniversary.

Though, that would only count if operating costs were the same year to year. Throw in ever increasing costs for food, energy, etc. as well as costs skyrocketing in CA (mandatory sick leave for all workers, regardless of part or full time as well as a the ever needed raises in min wage) that increase starts to look smaller and smaller...

There is also the difference in business models for DLR vs WDW. At WDW it is often a once in a lifetime trip for their average guest, they may never be back regardless of the quality of experience. So they keep things running longer and let them go until they do a full overhaul.

[ Edited by: wizzard419 2015-06-07 16:34 ]

I urge caution, we may be over-analyzing this. For at least 20 years now I have repeatedly seen and heard one of the chief promises Disney execs make --- they seek to pay close attention to shareholder value.

Yes, they do make bad and bone-headed decisions. But despite all the recent successes, they are still a profit-making organization focused on their shareholders. And they're doing a very good job.

Given the 3-year trend of their stock, and their recent track record in the face of new developments and franchises and attractions, I wouldn't be surprised if they announce another share split in the near future.

Except that the theme parks have not really been a leader in the boost for share prices (acquisitions did that, such as a teaser for star wars giving the total value of the stock a temporary $2Bn boost for a short while) nor the most important revenue stream for the company (ESPN has that).

That's all true, by overall size/volume. But weren't we talking about just the theme parks and resorts segment here in this thread?

I'm thinking (and I could be wrong) of the attendance figures, which I think have shown that the parks are slammin' busy pretty much year-round now due to the intentional scheduling of special events. And resort occupancy has also been very high even with Disney's premium pricing. Again, I think we're over-analyzing and custom picking and choosing details.

So the present attendance I think should support adequate expansion, maintenance, and repairs.

All I want is for Uh-Oa to move, heh...

Figures for theme parks on their own have no context, compared to the rest of the company it shows a different picture, additionally the figures are not factoring in ever rising costs. One of the things that is probably true, even though I would hate for it to happen, is that the era of the theme park in the US has gone into sunset mode. In Florida, for example, they have the right amount of parks for a week's vacation, while you could argue that adding another park would mean longer stays, but domestic consumers are not so willing to take as long of a vacation (even if they need it).

Look at the 60th anniversary celebration for Disneyland, their flagship presentations involve a new parade and fireworks. Usually in a 5/10 year the promotions are much larger. Local competition has better offerings and they are not celebrating anything.

Good thoughts, Wizzard. But if I'm not mistaken, it seems you are supporting my point that the company is being very conservative in some of what they do. I never thought that DL's 60th celebration is very thin and only involves a new parade and fireworks, that is unfortunate. That's similar to why I wish the Uh-Oa figure in Sam's had been more built out, along with the very simple mechanical tentacle. At least we got Sam's here - it's a fun place.

Now the other side of the coin is that the company is not being very conservative in other areas --- by building a new park in China, building the Avatar land in Orlando, re-vamping Downtown Disney in Orlando, expanding DVC offerings in Orlando and re-vamping the Polynesian. These are large capital projects, and given that the Polynesian had so much added and changed, it still strikes me as odd that Sam's was built with a few things so understated and simple.

I hope we're not too off-topic here. I'm in Fort Lauderdale right now, had some nice drinks at the Mai-Kai last night. Life is pretty good, Hukin' and hollerin' through Sunday at the Hukilau.

That is also what I was stating, they are not spending on parks for a variety of reasons, they don't need to for WDW as repeat customers are likely rare, they don't want to in general due to ever-increasing operating costs, and there is the issue of the entertainment format being out of date with the possibility that there is no real way to adapt.

Building the licensed land is more conservative than building another gate, additionally it hopefully will have better odds of not failing like some of their previous attempts at generating new IPs for attractions. One of the biggest issues for the parks is that new content is expensive and slow to create/build and you could end up with a ride that is terrible or based on a franchise that is terrible and no amount of retooling can fix it (look at the little mermaid attraction).

Good news - I was able to speak to a Disney cast member who is intimately involved with the animation. I asked a lot of questions, and this is what I learned:

• Uh-Oa was built for the "Under New Management" version of the Tiki Room show at a cost of over two million dollars. "Animation is very expensive" were his words.
• Uh-Oa has been moved and decommissioned intentionally as a purely static figure.
• Uh-Oa's animation components have been re-purposed in other figures and also as spare parts due to the cost of these.
• Uh-Oa is very unlikely to become animated in the future due to the cost AND the fact that the resorts do not maintain onsite animation technical folks. As a result, any problems which arise cannot be responded to in a quick and timely fashion, therefore animated figures are not used in the resorts. (I wonder - are there any exceptions?)
• Due to cost, there is a trend towards less costly air-based actuators instead of fluid-based actuators. Air allows for "on-off" actions while fluid-based figures can perform a wide range of speeds and motions, therefore the higher complexity and cost.

So I hope that is helpful information. I will now quit my whining, heh...

I hope everyone enjoys Trader Sams as it was built. It really is a fun place.

Cheers!

TS Grotto 1st Visit:

1. Drinks: GOOD
2. Décor: NICE!
3. People: Sat at surf board table & location promoted a LOT more people contact to the visit.
4. Mugs: ALL were in stock for purchase.
5. Poly Gift Shop: Real improvement in the type of mugs & merchandise available for purchase.
6. Poly Lobby: Like the changes.
7. Parking: WDW Transportation Center Lot, EASY walk.

Thortiki - your observations are very close to my own. I'm really jazzed that you also pointed out the benefit of sitting at the surfboard - you interact and laugh and party with other guests. That can really enhance a visit!!!

On 2015-06-11 12:47, wizzard419 wrote:
That is also what I was stating, they are not spending on parks for a variety of reasons, they don't need to for WDW as repeat customers are likely rare, they don't want to in general due to ever-increasing operating costs, and there is the issue of the entertainment format being out of date with the possibility that there is no real way to adapt.

Building the licensed land is more conservative than building another gate, additionally it hopefully will have better odds of not failing like some of their previous attempts at generating new IPs for attractions. One of the biggest issues for the parks is that new content is expensive and slow to create/build and you could end up with a ride that is terrible or based on a franchise that is terrible and no amount of retooling can fix it (look at the little mermaid attraction).

I don't exactly know people who know people who are tapped into the operations of WDW, but looking at what they're doing, attendance figures and so on, it seems to me that Disney really has a different problem than new IP. WDW has 4 of the top 5 theme parks in North America (the outlier being Disneyland) and the competition isn't even close. Personally I think the acquisition of the Avatar licence was a knee-jerk reaction to Harry Potter that Disney ultimately didn't need once the actual numbers were in.

Now granted, Hollywood Studios and Epcot's Future World are awful and need reworking, but WDW's real problem is how to deal with that kind of capacity. They need to build up amenities and guest management infrastructure. Hense the MagicBands and Fastpass+. That's also what stuff like Disney Springs and the Polynesian Village renos are about... Places for people to stay (especially those DVC folks) and things for them to do outside of the theme parks once they're there. Trader Sam's isn't designed to compete with anyone or anything, which would motivate things like adding complex animatronics, having expanded seating, etc. It's just there to give some guests a thing to do outside the parks but still on Disney property.

[ Edited by: EnchantedTikiGoth 2015-06-13 07:55 ]

Figures for WDW are heavily skewed though, as it is a destination resort where the average guest is buying the park-hopping pass. At DLR, with more frequent single day visitors, you likely are not seeing as many multi-park purchases. Though you are seeing more APs.

From what I recall, the main reason they did the overhaul for DTD/DV was the same reason they updated the poly, it was old and stale looking, which makes it harder to command the prices (rent and room rates) for what they are offering. Magicbands do not offer any improved infrastructure over the previous system. They were already tracking ride occupancy and general real-time heat maps for the parks and resorts to keep track of demand. The dining reservations still work the same way, paying for items with an incidental account is still the same, etc. So they are not getting new data nor are they getting better data. The one thing that may have changed is that it is now easier to get people to use the bands for purchases, saving on swipe fees (which do add up) as well as reducing the overall cash in the registers.

ETG & Wizzard, you both make very good points. We know there will be big changes coming to the Studios park, and market forces are driving many others in other parks. We have a lot to look forward to.

For purposes of this thread, I don't anticipate Trader Sams changing much, if at all. There were several here at the Hukilau this week who expressed frustration with the small size of Sam's East, but I shared my view that it is well within the intended "intimacy envelope" envisioned by the imagineers. I found it interesting that some were wishing for the expansion of the indoor venue to encompass all of the current outdoor patio area. Other comments suggested that Disney will "build a bigger and better one in Shanghai" based on the success of the ones in Anaheim and Orlando. Only time will tell.

Reminder that Jock Lindsay's Hangar Bar will be in the same vein as Trader Sam's, but I think much larger. This type of highly-themed drinking establishment like Sam's and The Hangar may be more prevalent in the future. Sam's demonstrates that this sort of concept is both enjoyable and financially successful.

Shanghai and Castaway Cay are both potential location rumors I've heard - at this point it's way too early to tell but I feel Sam's brand as a whole will jump the shark if that's the case.

Does anyone who's been there recently know if this shirt is available? It was sold out when I was there a couple months ago before the grand opening. I figured they would restock for grand opening but when I called to check they still didn't have it. Or maybe they restocked and ran out again.

Mike since we were there yesterday afternoon, saw a lot of those specific shirts in the Poly gift shop

On 2015-06-13 10:40, wizzard419 wrote:
From what I recall, the main reason they did the overhaul for DTD/DV was the same reason they updated the poly, it was old and stale looking, which makes it harder to command the prices (rent and room rates) for what they are offering. Magicbands do not offer any improved infrastructure over the previous system. They were already tracking ride occupancy and general real-time heat maps for the parks and resorts to keep track of demand. The dining reservations still work the same way, paying for items with an incidental account is still the same, etc. So they are not getting new data nor are they getting better data. The one thing that may have changed is that it is now easier to get people to use the bands for purchases, saving on swipe fees (which do add up) as well as reducing the overall cash in the registers.

Two things that MagicBands have done are increase sales (because it's psychologically easier to buy with them than hauling out your credit card every time) and spread out the crowds. The three Fastpass+ per day spread across different tiers is, I have to imagine, a deliberate effort to get people out of the lines for some of those big attractions and disperse them into the lines for the smaller ones and into the shops. The third effect is all the datamining that they can do with every guest carrying an RFID chip on their person. I'm not about to look them up right now, but I kinda' wouldn't mind seeing the figures on things like how many photos they used to sell vs. how many Memory Maker packages they're selling now, and so on.

But they aren't... the bands are likely not making people spend more just making them use a different payment option. The FP+ program gives them more granular data, but the reality is that operating the rides/the whole park is more or less a sunk cost. Predicting crowds is pretty simple when you just look at reservation data. You might get a slight edge over it with specific ride reservations, but you won't see them saying "We need extra staff for 2PM on July 22nd, 2015" because the resources don't work that way. Everything else they already had prior to the changeover.

The one difference, aside from swipe fees, is that these have merch directly tied to them in the form of band decorations. At the same time the media has a shorter shelf-life where if they do not move them in a timely manner, they end up having dead bands due to the batteries running out.

This is a pretty good article about what MagicBands do: http://www.wired.com/2015/03/disney-magicband/

As for increased spending, well, they actually did that. During the trial phase they did not increased spending from participants, and there was increased spending overall the quarter they were introduced. http://skift.com/2015/02/04/disneys-mymagic-wristbands-are-magic-money-makers/

[ Edited by: EnchantedTikiGoth 2015-06-14 06:32 ]

On 2015-06-13 14:25, Thortiki wrote:
Mike since we were there yesterday afternoon, saw a lot of those specific shirts in the Poly gift shop

Awesome thanks! I will give a call tomorrow to order one.