Tama - NZ Pounamu/greenstone - Last post for '08! - pg99

ohhh - drool drool slobber slobber - darn, and no towels handy!

Lovely Tama - supurb, sublime.

KS

Tama, Careful with these small guys, your Skills are Really starting to Show! This Long thin toki is Superb and to be topped with such a handsome fellow is Icing on the cake. I would Love to have this guy but unfortunately I think he would look best nestled within a nice cleavage not found on the likes of me. These small peeps leave Lots of room for full 3d effects, no Butts about it :lol:
My Respect for you grows again!

Tama, I can get me a great push up bra and make me some nice cleavage to display this find piece of art of yours. :) But I'm sure it's already been spoken for.. :(

Bez, :D Now you know there are many little trinkets in that little tin of yours that I'd love to get my hands on. Yup, yup, yup

Just beautiful!

Hi Tama,

Kahui Whetu is very good inspiration for me, especially the works that blend wood and pounamu/jade.

I was trying to do a simple toki (which is not easy) and wondered about what you put on your finished pieces (oil ?).

Oh ... and by the way... the "Hei Toki Tekoteko" is amazing !

Benjamin.

On 2008-09-01 00:48, Tamapoutini wrote:

Tipua: Talofa! Welcome back. *If you don find any Tikis on one Island, it must be time to visit Samoa.. (groan) Hey, joking about it is as close as Ive been; Im jealous, despite the lack of Tiki. Maybe you should post a notice in Tiki-Travel just to warn people?

Now that IS a dad's joke!

Actually there were some tiki at Siufaga Beach Resort (we splashed out a little) on Savai'i, but they were a mix of Marquesas and Hawai'ian tiki and were only there to fit into the theme I guess.
I didn't see any Samoan tiki at all, but then again I wouldn't know one even if I saw one. Certainly no hei-tiki. Probably all eradicated by the missionaries before tourism I'd assume.

There were some masks for sale, but not quite tiki. I did buy a heap of cool weapons though (good hard head-splitting wood too)! I had to part with them for gifts - but I did keep one.

So...
How about that wee marsden hei tiki fella? For sale or not for sale?
Nudge nudge. :wink: :wink:

On 2008-09-01 21:09, Tipua wrote:
Certainly no hei-tiki ( in Samoa). Probably all eradicated by the missionaries before tourism I'd assume.

Tipua ,
how could the missionaries eradicate something that did not exist ?

Hei-Tiki are a product of this Island , and it's satellite , Aotearoa .

On 2008-09-01 21:33, Toataiaha wrote:

On 2008-09-01 21:09, Tipua wrote:
Certainly no hei-tiki ( in Samoa). Probably all eradicated by the missionaries before tourism I'd assume.

Tipua ,
how could the missionaries eradicate something that did not exist ?

Hei-Tiki are a product of this Island , and it's satellite , Aotearoa .

Yeah you're right. I stand corrected.

I still found no indigenous Samoan tiki (the large wooden or stone types) though.

On 2008-09-01 21:48, Tipua wrote:

On 2008-09-01 21:33, Toataiaha wrote:

On 2008-09-01 21:09, Tipua wrote:
Certainly no hei-tiki ( in Samoa). Probably all eradicated by the missionaries before tourism I'd assume.

Tipua ,
how could the missionaries eradicate something that did not exist ?

Hei-Tiki are a product of this Island , and it's satellite , Aotearoa .

Yeah you're right. I stand corrected.

I still found no indigenous Samoan tiki (the large wooden or stone types) though.

That is because 'tiki' is not a part of Samoan culture , neither small ones suspended around the neck 'hei' , or large free standing ones .

Despite the fantasies of some , TIKI are not world wide , Pacific wide , or Polynesia wide .

"" From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
This article is about the large Polynesian carvings in humanoid form. For other uses, see Tiki (disambiguation).

In Central Eastern Polynesian cultures of the Pacific Ocean, tiki is a name given to large carvings of humanoid form. These carvings often serve to mark the boundaries of sacred or significant sites. The word appears as tiki in New Zealand Mâori, Cook Islands Mâori, Tuamotuan, and Marquesan; as ti'i in Tahitian, and as ki'i in Hawaiian. The word has not been recorded from the languages of Western Polynesia or of Rapanui (Easter Island). ""

na
Jock

i thought "tiki" could mean both "creator and creation".

On 2008-09-01 22:43, pdrake wrote:
i thought "tiki" could mean both "creator and creation".

In what culture , what iwi , what language ?

PS . Is this the best place for this discussion ?
Tama may feel hijacked

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In the heart of my soul . I would that I had been born in Celtic lands
But I was born here . a Celt in Maori lands . And my heart is content

[ Edited by: Toataiaha 2008-09-01 22:57 ]

On 2008-09-01 21:33, Toataiaha wrote:

Despite the fantasies of some , TIKI are not world wide , Pacific wide , or Polynesia wide .

"" From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
This article is about the large Polynesian carvings in humanoid form. For other uses, see Tiki (disambiguation).

In Central Eastern Polynesian cultures of the Pacific Ocean, tiki is a name given to large carvings of humanoid form. These carvings often serve to mark the boundaries of sacred or significant sites. The word appears as tiki in New Zealand Mâori, Cook Islands Mâori, Tuamotuan, and Marquesan; as ti'i in Tahitian, and as ki'i in Hawaiian. The word has not been recorded from the languages of Western Polynesia or of Rapanui (Easter Island). ""

Hmmm... That's interesting.

But Samoans would've had an equilavent to tiki surely?
Humans everywhere (especially in the Pacific) carved images in wood and stone. Is Samoa an exception? I'd be suprised if Samoa didn't create similar objects, if not under the name tiki then something else (like Rapanui moai for instance). No carved objects in humanoid form similar to tiki were apparent to me in Samoa. I still blame the missionaries! :)

On 2008-09-01 23:16, Tipua wrote:
On 2008-09-01 21:33, Toataiaha wrote:

Despite the fantasies of some , TIKI are not world wide , Pacific wide , or Polynesia wide .

"" From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
This article is about the large Polynesian carvings in humanoid form. For other uses, see Tiki (disambiguation).

In Central Eastern Polynesian cultures of the Pacific Ocean, tiki is a name given to large carvings of humanoid form. These carvings often serve to mark the boundaries of sacred or significant sites. The word appears as tiki in New Zealand Mâori, Cook Islands Mâori, Tuamotuan, and Marquesan; as ti'i in Tahitian, and as ki'i in Hawaiian. The word has not been recorded from the languages of Western Polynesia or of Rapanui (Easter Island). ""

Hmmm... That's interesting.

But Samoans would've had an equilavent to tiki surely?
Humans everywhere (especially in the Pacific) carved images in wood and stone. Is Samoa an exception? I'd be suprised if Samoa didn't create similar objects, if not under the name tiki then something else (like Rapanui moai for instance). No carved objects in humanoid form similar to tiki were apparent to me in Samoa. I still blame the missionaries! :)

Be surprised then.
Do the research .
Find examples or records of pre-missionary examples , of that , that you are adamant existed .

Conversely , consult Samoan carvers , who have training in both the craft and its history , and accept their expertise .

I have , and I do .

Missionaries are responsible for massive cultural destruction ,
but in blaming then for a crime that they did not commit , you exceed them in evil .

There is not , and never was a Pan Polynesian culture.

---

In the heart of my soul . I would that I had been born in Celtic lands
But I was born here . a Celt in Maori lands . And my heart is content

[ Edited by: Toataiaha 2008-09-01 23:30 ]

On 2008-09-01 22:52, Toataiaha wrote:

PS . Is this the best place for this discussion ?
Tama may feel hijacked

*A little. If you wish to discuss this 'Samoa' (daddy of two), please take it to general. This thread is for TTTaonga! Cheers

On 2008-09-02 03:46, Tamapoutini wrote:

On 2008-09-01 22:52, Toataiaha wrote:

PS . Is this the best place for this discussion ?
Tama may feel hijacked

*A little. If you wish to discuss this 'Samoa' (daddy of two), please take it to general. This thread is for TTTaonga! Cheers

Yes. Sorry Tama.

Hey! I finally figured out how to do multiple quotes - and you can quote me on that! Havent quite got the hang of it - still a bit messy..?

Toataiaha:

'do you know much about this 'bearded' style of hei-tiki?'

TTT: only that it has a beard. :lol:
..And that the design has been attributed to the deep South where my bones lie. The piece you posted could very well have been made/worn by one of my maternal ancestors!

KShaman: I am humbled by your copious drooling, thanks!

BenZ:

'This Long thin toki is Superb and to be topped with such a handsome fellow is Icing on the cake. I would Love to have this guy but unfortunately I think he would look best nestled within a nice cleavage not found on the likes of me'

TTT: If not you, then who?. Im on a quest borrowed from Prince Charming now; seek the lands for the perfect fitting cleavage - this's going to be tough! :o :D

Tikipaka: see above. Starting in Kumara NZ, Ive got a long way to travel - can you meet me half way? :wink: *If you look in TC Marketplace you will find an eBay link to this piece & others. Cheers

B'nella:

Kahui Whetu is very good inspiration for me, especially the works that blend wood and pounamu/jade.

I was trying to do a simple toki (which is not easy) and wondered about what you put on your finished pieces (oil ?)

TTT: Are you working with jade?? Yes, any light/thin mineral oil (wipe on, wipe off) will work. In the past I have used 'Neopol' furniture polish, baby-oil, massage oil, cooking oil, motor oil(!), 'Snowpake' leather protector, 'Dubbin' similar Australian product for leather (made predominantly from kangaroo fat Ive heard - I stopped using it because it has a weird smell, haha), Emu oil, etc.. Common custom is also to wipe on the side of your nose! nose oil, mmmmmmmmmm :lol:

Tipua/Toatiaha: Thank you both for your apologies. Lets move on in peace shall we?

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So here's an example of how a piece can evolve if not resolved (on paper) in advance:

Tiki-ish/toki?:

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ok, no toki..

'Tiki-Arero'/tongue:

:o pukana! :o

Another Nice one Tama, and of Course I Love seeing you go to it "Blind" without knowing what the finished piece will look like. This is usually (OK, Always how I start since I don't draw),how I start out, with the basic shape roughed out and the future being a surprise till the end. Yours here turned out really Great, I love the different stages he went through to reach is final look. The jade is beautiful too, so Pardon me while I drool a long while.
:lol: :D :P :o

Great work Tama!!!

On 2008-09-03 00:27, Tamapoutini wrote:

TTT: Are you working with jade?? Yes, any light/thin mineral oil (wipe on, wipe off) will work. In the past I have used 'Neopol' furniture polish, baby-oil, massage oil, cooking oil, motor oil(!), 'Snowpake' leather protector, 'Dubbin' similar Australian product for leather (made predominantly from kangaroo fat Ive heard - I stopped using it because it has a weird smell, haha), Emu oil, etc.. Common custom is also to wipe on the side of your nose! nose oil, mmmmmmmmmm :lol:

I'm working with a stone I would call "peeble river" that I found in the south of France near a river ! Here it is:

Mahalo,

Benjamin.

EDITED to remove a picture :)

[ Edited by: benella 2008-09-03 06:59 ]

My tounge is hanging out as much as that last carving's is.

Nice.

(It is probably a good thing you didn't carve a little butt on the backside of that one)

On 2008-09-03 14:15, JohnnyP wrote:
(It is probably a good thing you didn't carve a little butt on the backside of that one)

Don't listen to him, Tama! It is always a good thing to carve a little butt on the tiki! :wink:

On 2008-09-03 14:51, JenTiki wrote:

On 2008-09-03 14:15, JohnnyP wrote:
(It is probably a good thing you didn't carve a little butt on the backside of that one)

Don't listen to him, Tama! It is always a good thing to carve a little butt on the tiki! :wink:

Well, with the tounge and all.....

:)

i think it's a beauty. i love how it's finished and it's a great piece of stone.

MAN that jade jade is so sweet and green, like a lollipop...just wanna lick it! Oh yeah, the carving is good too! :lol:

On 2008-09-03 00:27, Tamapoutini wrote:

Tipua/Toatiaha: Thank you both for your apologies. Lets move on in peace shall we?

I hope so too. TCers should be like siblings - we may have our disagreements from time to time, but it's all just drool off a tiki's tongue. Speaking of which...

Your hei tiki/toki tongue guy is cool. He kinda reminds me of the business end of a taiaha.
Brilliant original work as usual, Tama!

definatly drool material - too cool Tama.

KS

Tama, What an Incredable piece of Art!Always a pleasure to see your amazing Talent , Aloha your friend, Mooney

Mumm that's a sweet green tong fella !

I love when you let go and let the stone take you away! Crazy stuff happens! Great work Tama, it has been a while since you let us see a little carving using the "Force." Thanks for the continuous stream of beautiful pics of your work.

-g

So I see that I am not the only one do does not draw their designs out on paper first. If I do, it doesn't come out the same in 3D. Same for you?

Nice Gene Simmons tongue portrait! :) Great workl as usual., TTT!

Bowana

BUMPLERIAN

Kia ora All!

Cher:

BenZ: The Gemini in me is torn between the two approaches (pre-designing & free-carving), each has its pros and cons..

TFreak: :)

B'Nella: Im looking forward to seeing what you do with that stone..

JP: (I got the butt/tongue joke)

JenZ: besides being rude, it would have been on the back of his head! And I dont want to have to carve the matching Beavis-Tiki! :lol:

pdrake: you have to say you like it! :wink: :lol:

Surfin: youre welcome to come by and lick them anytime. Just remember most have been rubbed on my nose several times to deliberately impart body oil..

Tipua: cheers, no prog as yet but Ill be talking to you..

Kshaman: your drool is always welcome too, cheers!

Mooney: :)

Seeks: :)

G$: again, I fight with the dark and light sides of the force. Pre-designing leads to much tighter work, but free-carving is so much quicker and more satisfying to the carver in me. Keep mixing it up..

BenZ: 'BUMPLARIAN'?? Thanks! :lol:

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Its been all go this end. Not a huge amount of carving but I seem to have been very busy & dog-tired at the end of each day. Some of this could be attributed to spending many hours falling off my new skateboard which I received for Fathers Day! (I never learned the first time round but seem to have improved with the intervening years off) Now my son and I are working on matching bruises to go with the matching boards..

One new piece has come off the bench recently - a little brother to a piece I wear. Just a quick 1,2,3 progression Im afraid:

'Toaiti II':

And on the bench for the past couple of days, a new Tang! Micron by micron, still slowly getting thicker with these guys:

Virtually a full day in the workshop promised tommorrow. Fingers crossed..

HHHappy carving All!

Greetings Tama the Tor-Mentor!

"BenZ: 'BUMPLARIAN'?? Thanks! "
Of course, Nothing but the Best to coax the Jade Master out from hiding in the dark corners of TC, Glad it worked. :P :D :roll:
.....

"JenZ: besides being rude, it would have been on the back of his head! And I dont want to have to carve the matching Beavis-Tiki!"

What, No "Butt-Heads"? It woulda been neat to have carved the first one? :lol:
....

"BenZ: The Gemini in me is torn between the two approaches (pre-designing & free-carving), each has its pros and cons.."

I understand, and what a Tear, it has to be Very difficult not to plan it all out and follow the plan but also very scary Not to have that plan. IF I could draw even a tiny bit I'm sure I would be drawing everything out to the T but my chicken scratching would only confuse the piece. I Do run into trouble many times where I Know it could have been eliminated had I drawn it out first.
How ever you are doing what you do, don't stop because it is working well for you. A bit of experimenting is great though.
Your 2 new guys definitely started the drool spigot going full blast again and all I can do is sit here drooling and shaking my head in bewilderment.
More Nice work

*** "Its been all go this end. Not a huge amount of carving but I seem to have been very busy & dog-tired at the end of each day. Some of this could be attributed to spending many hours falling off my new skateboard which I received for Fathers Day! (I never learned the first time round but seem to have improved with the intervening years off) Now my son and I are working on matching bruises to go with the matching boards.." ***
What, Are you NUTZ?? I Hope you have your hands insured? And I hope you are wearing wrist braces and stuff like that. I can just see sprained wrists and No Carvings from Tama for a Long time. PLEASE Be Careful and Take care of OUR hands there, I don't wanna come down there and give you a Whoopin' ! :P

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myspace

[ Edited by: Benzart 2008-09-09 04:50 ]

A Tang!! Damn, now I'll have to go erase the one I drew up!!!!

Wow, I really like Toaiti II, you make it look so easy to make those and I know it isn't!!! I come to this thread every day hoping to see something new!

Tama, Your just plain rockin' the roof off of this house...It sucks that the best stone guys live so far away in NZ...wished you were closer.

It's been fun looking at your posts on the photo association thread too :)

9 days??? Gotta be at least half a dozen tikis you've been holding out on....

Hey Tama....boy have I missed looking at your work. Always inspiring. I love the combination of strength and whimsy you capture in your images....I don't know if that's the right word....but your renderings always makes me smile.

Must be about time for your "Dozen" day roundup? :lol: :P :D

Yeah, stop holding out on us you selfish bastard!

[ Edited by: GROG 2008-09-22 08:54 ]

On 2008-09-22 08:54, GROG wrote:
Yeah, stop holding out on us you selfish bastard!

*C'mon guys - you know that if I have anything to show, its posted before the grinding wheel even stops spinning..

Sadly, Im in a bit of a creative funk at present and havent really produced anything for a couple of weeks. Several days were spent finishing off a group of work (mostly Tikis seen here already) that went out as shop/gallery stock, and several more days staring at the walls wishing for inspiration. Built a guinea-pig cage last Friday which was the most creatively satisfying day for a while. Tore the workshop to pieces over the weekend in an attempt to reduce clutter (mental and actual) but kind of lost interest halfway through putting it all back together. All functional again but no 'tidier'..

Fear not, Tama will be back..

Grog called me a bastard.. snif :cry:

On 2008-09-22 15:06, Tamapoutini wrote:

Tore the workshop to pieces over the weekend in an attempt to reduce clutter (mental and actual) but kind of lost interest halfway through putting it all back together. All functional again but no 'tidier'..

Fear not, Tama will be back..

This is on the cards for me too - in fact the process has already begun with the recent great stone sell-off. A "wall of tiki" will remain, but sometimes all that stuff threatens to overwhelm the creative vibe of a workshop, and you need some clear space to grow within.
I'm not sure why you're worried about creative block with that box o' goodness you've got sitting there though...the thinking (and most of the carving) is already done. Dust off a few of those highly ambitious pieces and get them into the waiting hands of the collectors. I did the same when I was stuck recently (finished a few of the ones I'd drawn or partially completed but put into the too-hard basket).
I will be out soon to check up and provide some inspiration in liquid form :drink:

Time to get the hammers and chisels out guys .
Get a big chunk of wood , and reduce it to chips .
Blow out all that pent up energy

OK Guyz, Whats goin on down there? you having a bit of a doldrum going on? can't work? Forgot how to carve? Mind's not innit? Well Wake up and forget all that crap, we need a fix here! You need to be posting some more Beautiful stuff, Both you guys, do have to bump up that "Wheres all the Tiki" thread, I Will! Cheerio!

Come back Tama!!! This place is not the same without your greenstone!!!

When I saw that thing for the first I literally said out loud, "Wow, that is f-ing killer." Nice work, Man.

Alohizzle my Tikiphizzles! Long time no post – apologizzles all round..

BenZ, Surfin’, Blowfish, Babalu, P’po, Rockin’Robin, that bastard Grog, Toka, Kahaka + others:

Well, its week 4 with virtually no carving from me. I would apologise but its me who’s probably suffering the most. :lol: I guess this is what comes from trying to bash the little buggers out one after another year in, year out.. Fear not, Tama is well but taking an overdue break from TIKI for the time being, which has meant TC has had to take a backseat also. Im sure the regulars among you will understand.

A timely offer in the form of some tutoring work at the local ‘jade skool’ has kept me busy, and for those interested Ill be posting some piccies in ‘Stone Q&A’ of the workshop shortly.

Thanks for your comps All - Keep a Tiki-torch burning for Tama..

Quote:
Well, its week 4 with virtually no carving from me. I would apologise but its me who’s probably suffering the most. I guess this is what comes from trying to bash the little buggers out one after another year in, year out.. Fear not, Tama is well but taking an overdue break from TIKI for the time being, which has meant TC has had to take a backseat also. Im sure the regulars among you will understand.

A timely offer in the form of some tutoring work at the local ‘jade skool’ has kept me busy, and for those interested Ill be posting some piccies in ‘Stone Q&A’ of the workshop shortly.

Thanks for your comps All - Keep a Tiki-torch burning for Tama..
Quote

Hey Tama, Yeah, we'll keep one lit just for you, knowing that when you can you will be visiting with photos of that classroom brimming full of "Baby Tama Wannabe's" and pic's of more of your works too. It's great for the kidz that you will inspire as you are the kind of teacher who can really make a positive difference in some students lives.
Yes I think I understand all too well, just keep in touch and don't be a stranger around here and when you get to it post some more pix of your works.
Saw the shots of the class rooms and I see now why you want more time there, they have some Awesome tools an equipment. I know I'd sure love to enroll there and learn to carve jade the proper way :lol: (too late for that I'm afraid?)

Long time, no TC..

Limping towards 100 pages I just noticed. Perhaps seeing this thread out to the magic # will be the boost I need, then a fresh start..

At present Im still only in the workshop a tentitive part-time, the rest of my days filled with small projects around the house (newly established chookhouse, fresh freerange eggs, mmmmmm), etc. Less than 1 month to go for submissions for the bi-annual NZ jade & hardstone exhibition/competition but at this point Ive got nothing to show & am relying on last-minute inspiration to get me to the party.. doh!

A few offerings:

You may have caught this guy alrEady, begun from a triangular-section offcut:

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A small 'trad' - with the upcoming summer/Xmas season its time to concentrate on these little bread n butter guys again in the hopes of some wholesaling to some local galleries:

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Another trad style, the earlier 'side-hanging' type:

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A larger toa/tekoteko/tiki type figure that was started some time ago; note huia (extinct native bird) feathers in the topknot:

And currently on the bench, a cheeky little chappy:

Lots of boys this month - must be time for a wahine soon..

Best wishes & happy carving to All! :)