What's "Cooking" in Tiki Central?

Trader Vic founded a Mexican restaurant chain called "Senor Pico", that's why he has all those recipes in there. He also tried to introduce Sushi to America, but was ahead of the times. Does that make Sushi into Tiki food, or into...Sushi?

There's one TRUE Tiki Food that has not come up in this thread I believe (?), but was discussed on TC earlier:

http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=17955&forum=10

My final word on the Brouhaha that erupted over the last 24 hours right here on our humble thread
And from this point on will be called "The Great Tiki Food War of 2010"

Empirical evidence has come to light which proves my previous opinion to be fact! on just what constitutes the category
of what is "Tiki Food"

I have spent the last few hours researching Vintage Tiki menus from the 1940s,1950s & 1960s
to see what food was in fact served at these Restaurants & Bars,Guess what? Surf-n-Turf, Chinese, Indian ,American & French cuisine,"escargot" yes Snails!Sweetbread's & Turtle soup for example.

and were the norm at most of the old school Tiki Establishments, even Mexican food as Mike has shown.

The one true constant was Tropical Cocktails,which prove to be the only prerequisite of having a true Tiki menu.

The Tropical food that most of you associate with Tiki came into vogue in the late 1960s,1970s and 80s and was "Hawaiian" influenced
most of you are to young to know better.

Proof that Mai Tai,Tom Slick(sorry Tom) and others are sorely mistaken,I suspect Sven was waiting for us to find the proof on our own?
Just check all the vintage Tiki menus for the proof,no more arguments about it.

So in summation I say, :P IN YOUR FACE! BAZINGA! HOW DO YOU LIKE ME NOW! KNEEL BEFORE ZOD! BITCHES! :P
I would like to thank the Jury for their patience & Court is adjourned.

Yikes, that scares me.

I think I will stick with your Tiki HotDogs,Sven..

Tiki Hotdog party! so how long would it take to carve about 30 dogs,kosher of course!

I found Sushi on a few of those old Tiki menus

Ah, ATP what scared me was the Sven post not what you said. Don't know how to include verbage with the post not following.

Love Sven's tiki hot dog. Hey, you brought it up. : )

On 2010-10-08 01:41, WSWahine wrote:
Ah, ATP what scared me was the Sven post not what you said. Don't know how to include verbage with the post not following.

Just use the quote button on the post you would like to quote from...
I knew that,Laura...now I have time to get you that recipe!

On 2010-10-05 22:20, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
"Char Siu Chinese Barbecued Pork & Pineapple Coconut Rice"

Char Siu Chinese Barbecued Pork recipe

In a dish with a lid

2 Pork Tenderloins,cut in half to end up with 4 small pork Tenderloins
Salt & Pepper to taste on each Tenderloin
Spoon 2 Tablespoons of Char Siu sauce over each piece of pork
Place 1 Tablespoon of minced Garlic
1 Tablespoon of minced Ginger
2 Tablespoons of Soy Sauce
1 Tablespoon Sesame Oil
on the Tenderloins
sprinkle on some Sesame Seeds

place lid on container and shake so all the Pork is coated in the sauces & spices
Marinate for 24 to 48 hours in the refrigerator

when ready to cook preheat the oven to 350 degrees
cook the Tenderloins in an uncovered dish with foil on the bottom (makes cleanup easy)
for 40 to 45 minutes,(you may have to adjust the cooking time for your own oven)
let the Pork rest for at least 10 minutes before thin slicing.
enjoy!

[ Edited by: Atomic Tiki Punk 2010-10-08 02:17 ]

Real Tiki food :lol: Nothing like a little long pig cooked over an open fire :D

I thought they were spaghetti tongs before I read the text.

The whole thread fiasco could have been better executed by one polite post saying "Please change the thread title because it's confusing and annoying" and "here's a picture of the tiki meal I just cooked to illustrate what I mean".

Do you all think we should have a separate thread for just recipes?

-home cookin'
-pix from out and about
-recipes

whaddya think?

A general observation:

The food served in Polynesian restaurants around the heyday of Tiki has always been the weakest link in the chain that holds together the make believe world of Tiki. It was the first thing that was targeted by critics of the style, and probably one of the main elements that led to its demise. But it is not the only "imperfect" element in Tiki culture, there are many. (I have always said that The Book of Tiki has created a perfect past that never was, by my selection of only the best examples of the style, and by putting them into context to each other.):

We now know that most of the Tiki restaurant customers wore suit and tie, NOT loud Aloha shirts when frequenting these establishments.

We now know that most Tiki temples did NOT play Martin Denny or Arthur Lyman or the many other Exotica artists, thought they would have been perfect.

We can assume that many Tiki Bartenders did NOT always use the freshest ingredients and spices in their concoctions, like the new wave of mixologists do nowadays.

But WE, the Tikiphiles do these things today because they help to create a better, more perfect Tiki world. Yes, we are Tikier than Tiki ever was in all of these aspects, and are naively unrealistic when going out to existing Tiki temples, expecting perfect cocktails, served in cool Tiki mugs, accompanied by moody Exotica sounds. I have often laughed about that. It has been called snobby and hoity toity to act that way. But what if we begin to settle for less? Accept Reggae in Tiki Bars? Wear muted monochrome Tommy Bahama shirts? Put Captain Morgan into our cocktails?

Yes, I as a historian agree that Polynesian food was basically a mixture of Surf'n'Turf and Chinese dishes back in the day, but that does not mean that today's informed, educated Tikiphile cannot improve on that, for example by being selective in making choices that better fit and build on the theme.

ATP, thank you kindly for that recipe. Will test drive it very soon!

BigBro,

You make an important point in reinforcing the contemporary attempt to create a "pure" environment which references the past. But current attempts to "create a past which never existed" or otherwise perfect in our vision, the style, the food, or the overall cultural experience through a narrow lens is what revivals and exoticism have been about for centuries. Poly-pop or anything else. Whether some version of neoclassical style(s), mid-century modern, moderne/Deco, or you-name-it, the tendency is to be selective about those elements which are the most emblematic of our perceptions of the style/culture, even if not the most "typical" of the true period/cultural. Colonial Williamsburg and Disney's theme parks are among the more prominent single entities which practice(d) this approach to cherry-picking cultural elements, though again, one of a million similar approaches.

What I think it ultimately important is that the revival of interest remains valid in its own right, as long as it is not misunderstood as a snapshot of authenticity of another era/culture. It is authentic in its own right, however odd it is to think about in that way -- that revivals create their own new cultural and stylistic brew which will be copied, reformulated, and revisited again in the next generations. The Poly-post-pop revival, perhaps. Such blends of fact and fantasy and past and present are enjoyable enough -- and only unsettling when they are held up as some pure historical absolutes when they are nothing of the sort.

Wow, I have been thinking about exoticism and revivalism too much...

GK

Thank you Sven! I have been arguing those exact points for sometime now and to much resistance
to the facts.

Today's Tiki Culture is what we make it, Lets honor the traditions and history,but don't tell me we can't make better food & Drinks
I love my Hawaiian Shirts,but I wear a vintage suit now & then to honor the past,we can have the best of both worlds!

To those intolerant few who thought we should not even be here,or at the very least try to dictate what kind of food should be here
on this humble thread, do some legwork & get your fact's straight.
Then get a Mai Tai and loosen the hell up.

I was momentarily concerned that next I would be busted for my not very tiki name...whew!

I want to talk about the attire thing as well. Couldn't find a specific wardrobe thread, so I posed a burning question
(see how I tied that to Cooking?) over here:

http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=36462&forum=1&9

Oh boy, playing that ol' "Tiki Nazi" card again...

Look folks, all that was basically said here is that on a website called Tiki Central, ideally things should stay "Tiki" in their theme!
And now we are are seeing pages of justifications why that should NOT be so? Mind-boggling.

MAYBE the intention to keep things on track could have been communicated a little gentler, agreed...but in the end, it all does not change the fact that there's nothing Tiki about Mexican food or corn dogs, period!

Agreed Sven, I did not clarify myself and did not mean to say that all the food posted in this thread is "Tiki Food"
but now that we know that others ideas of what should fit into that category has been misrepresented,at least we have expanded
on the criteria of what can be considered "Tiki Cuisine"

But it is us,who's "Art" is "Cooking" that will define it today.

Indeed, well said. And you really made my mouth water with that Char Siu Chinese Barbecued Pork & Pineapple Coconut Rice photo, that IS a piece of art! :)

Thank's Sven!

Is a panini tiki?

If it is made with King's Hawaiian buns, ham, teryaki sauce, green onions and grilled pineapple slices it is.
:o
Yummy lunch.

http://www.greyhoundog.org

[ Edited by: Mr. NoNaMe 2010-10-08 14:51 ]

On 2010-10-08 12:40, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
Thank you Sven! I have been arguing those exact points for sometime now and to much resistance
to the facts.

Today's Tiki Culture is what we make it, Lets honor the traditions and history,but don't tell me we can't make better food & Drinks
I love my Hawaiian Shirts,but I wear a vintage suit now & then to honor the past,we can have the best of both worlds!

To those intolerant few who thought we should not even be here,or at the very least try to dictate what kind of food should be here
on this humble thread, do some legwork & get your fact's straight.
Then get a Mai Tai and loosen the hell up.

So that's obviously directed at me. As are your postings of and PM's of "You're wrong, since you haven't come up with an argument or debate to disprove me".

I want to be very careful with my tone here, and spell out my thoughts and intentions, as things can easily get distorted through internet communication, and downward spirals develop from there.

In a nice, respectful tone, I disagree that Sven is agreeing and validating your point of view. And even though I feel that historically "Tiki Food" is hard to define, I refuse to get into a circular logic reasoning loop of "since there's really no such thing as tiki food, then anything can be tiki food" or "since tiki food is not definable then anything can be tiki food", or "since those tiki establishments served basically anything, then anything can be tiki food". (And because I refuse to debate about it doesn't mean that either one of us is right or wrong, or that one person "wins"). We have demerara rum, a key staple ingredient in many tiki drinks, that is manufactured in Canada, does that make Canada tiki? How about the Canadians that distill and manufacture it? Do rums from Belize or Mexico make those places tiki? One could argue that since next year's Tiki Oasis theme is "South Of The Border", therefore Mexico is tiki. Witco carved conquistador stuff, is that reaffirmation that all Latin items are tiki? What about viking ships? They're kind of similar to the Kon Tiki? What about a Witco Globe? Tiki is on the face of planet earth, is it not? Hey, wait, so is Jimmy Buffett! Is he tiki, too?

Trader Vic's makes a burger. It's one of my favorite things to order on the menu! Sometimes Midnite and I go to Vic's for lunch just to have the burger. Is it Tiki? In my opinion, no, because it's a burger. What about if it was cooked in the chinese ovens? Still no. In the same vein, I feel that nine out of ten items in this thread aren't tiki, in that they don't smack of some type of "exotic flair", whether Mid-Century, Tiki-Revivalist, or some brand new interpretation of Poly-Asian. To me, the philly cheesesteaks, huevos rancheros, holiday cookies, etc, lack that certain kind of "exotic flair". Again, I say that in a friendly, respectful tone. I'm not having a meltdown over it, and I'm not losing any sleep over it. And I'm not posting over and over and over how "other" people can't seem to let it go because they don't agree with my point of view.

Which brings up another interesting point. It appears that things are all great and fun and games, until someone disagrees with you. Didn't you and Boris get into it over in Bilge over this fact? And wasn't it about this particular food thread?

On 2010-10-02 23:15, Bora Boris wrote:
Yes, it's all about ** Fun** until someone makes a little ** Fun** of your very popular and going strong Food post, then it's not as much ** Fun** until you remind us that it is Fun. Is this correct? Because that's what it sounds like. :lol:

Again, in a nice respectful tone, because I feel that corn dogs, tacos, and huevos rancheros aren't tiki, does that make me a tiki nazi? Or Tiki Fonzie? 'Cause I'm just too Kool for Tiki School? I don't think so. You and/or amybean might feel differently. If so, then so be it. It's a free country, everyone's entitled to their opinion. I even received a PM from a moderator here, saying that they think it sucks that people are having meltdowns and I'm getting hate mail just because I requested that a thread be moved to Beyond Tiki or to Bilge. It also makes me a little sad to think that a few people might think that I'm some harsh tiki overlord, because I most definitely am not. But I'm not going to cry about it, 'cause hey, Fonzie don't cry!

So, lastly, in a friendly, respectful tone, especially to amybean, I've apologized for using harsh language, both here on the thread, and to her in a pm, and offered to talk story over drinks at FI. What else can I do, give a pound of tiki flesh? (Mmmmmmmm, tiki flesh - it's what all good zombies eat at Halloween time!). I would like to see the hate mail and the constant innuendos of being an uptight tiki nazi stop. We're adults, right? And can handle things in an adult manner, right? And at worst case agree to disagree, right? Even though there's an academic side to this website, it's still supposed to be fun. I've let this issue go, and I think we all should let it go, because I don't want to cause some kind of shouting match that is going to cause a downward spiral, and ends up getting this thread permamently locked. Now back to our regular scheduled program.

On 2010-10-08 14:25, bigbrotiki wrote:
And you really made my mouth water with that Char Siu Chinese Barbecued Pork & Pineapple Coconut Rice photo, that IS a piece of art! :)

Wholeheartedly agreed! I hope that you'll cook some of that up for me sometime, my friend!

Sure, Mai Tai, whatever.

Your desire to change the thread could have been handled in 1 or 2 posts, not days of dramatic output.
You behaved as though we were naughty children ruining the website, and you were the Dad coming in to restore order and issue punishment.

I'm sorry that this thread offended you and I hope you don't mind that I'd like to get back to work on the 2 tikis I'm carving.

I look forward to enjoying the food you post.

O.K. So, no love for the pua'a hamenini. Fine. I wont share the recipe. :P

Those look really good, NoName! I love panini, and this version looks delish!

I just showed up,Oh boy.....
Mr NoNaMe the Hamenini is wonderfully creative and Tiki too,so how did it taste? because I think you are on to something.

Mai Tai,Thank you for the Olive Branch, my PM to you should not have been construed as any sort of attack (facetious ribbing Yes! most certainly)

I am sorry, but your point of view was actually refuted with empirical evidence (The Best Kind!)
just read my prior posts for my arguments,so no need to repeat here.

also at no time did anyone say our entire thread was all (Tiki Cuisine) despite the goofing around the last couple of days
which was a direct reaction to not just your post,but a few like minded posts outside of our thread, That I retorted to.

Just so you now why you got the reaction,that you did,let me explain
This thread consists of a group of people that like to cook (create) which by nature is a "Tactile & Sensory" act, an emotional based
activity that makes us passionate about what we do.

I think this makes for a stronger bond then say,The Tiki Jeep thread.
And which most certainly appeals to the many,many people who visit this thread, oh! and of course the "food",what sane person doesn't like food?

I know you have other ideas,but you just don't show up at someones house, Then tell them that what they "like" or "believe" is not important
and piss in the pool and kick the cat on the way out!

I would say that's very Bad Manners!

Mai Tai Quote:
"I have no fucking idea how this, or the majority of the posts on this thread is Tiki, but due to popular request, here it is. Maybe this thread should be moved to bilge? Or just rename the whole website BilgeCentral.com?"

So yes! your going to bristle some feathers.
I myself am hardwired to rebel against anyone trying to force their point of view on some one else, I don't care what it is.
There is a faction of Tiki Centralites who think Tiki Central is getting diluted etc.
maybe so? but instead of creating more "Traditional" Threads & Content your selves,you go after subjects & thread's you deem unworthy
Then requesting threads get sent to bilge or even locked!

A slash & burn mindset if you will,that I find morally reprehensible!
It is also completely hypocritical

So instead of complaining,why don't you add the kind of content you say is missing,Do it yourself and leave us to enjoy what we
are passionate about?

And that is what I think this "Ragnarok" was all about.

I have avoided being emotional about this til now,so there!
I also would like to say that the regulars here are a great bunch of people,That I would love to sit down and enjoy a great meal with!
Lets get back to Cooking........

[ Edited by: Atomic Tiki Punk 2010-10-09 03:45 ]

Hello!
Not a Tiki meal tonight,I have not made in a while or posted here....

Homemade Pesto & Mostaccioli & Rustic Garlic Bread

Making the Pesto...Fresh Basil,Garlic,Pinenuts,crushed Red Pepper & Olive Oil

Toast some Pinenuts...

Saute some marinated Peppers & Artichokes

Making the Rustic Garlic Bread....

Dinner is served.....

Hey, I'm all for the "let's sit down for a great meal part". Count me in! "If you're cookin, I'm lookin!" Hope to be posting here soon. Thank you all for smoothing that over. It is never nice to argue over a meal....of any kind.

Red Pepper Pesto - YUM!

Maybe it's not cooking but it's definately "tiki"

I took some Spicy Pineapple Rum Pork Loin (no pic) to Tiki-Kate's Farewell Luau. I also took ingredients for "Painkiller Cocktail Sundaes". But the crowd was bigger that I expected and there were a lot of people who wouldn't "get it". So I left it all in the ice chest in the car and brought it back home. :D

Pineapple Shebert, Coconut Syrup, Rum-Orange Sauce (2/3 orange marmalade & 1/3 Kraken) then sprinkled with Nutmeg. Can't really say it tasted like a Painkiller but it was tasty!

Great idea Mike,making Desert versions of our favorite Cocktails!
we are enjoying Blue Hawaiians & Painkillers Tonight, non-desert versions of course!

I'd mention and shown my Papaya trees a few times already so I thought I'd show the inside of one. I cut up and ate most of the first papaya of my current crop and it was amazing! Took a few pics!

Beautiful color - I can almost taste it!

Wow Robert, nice Papaya!

I made Pupu ribs and ginger pineapple fried rice for dinner.

Chris

Great looking ribs Chris! Did you make the egg roll an dumplings too?

Looking Gooood! Chris....

Hey Zerostreet, How long does it take to produce fruit on the papaya? Think I could grow in Sacramento? I looks great, just need a couple lime slices.

Laura

Hey Guys!

Hi Robert, no I didn't make the appetizers. I walked a block and a half to a little place and got them while the ribs were on the grill. Although I do on occasion make a shrimp and cilantro pot sticker that's pretty good!

Chris

Chris,

Be a pal and post the recipe in the recipe thread. Please?

Mahalo, etc.

recipe thread?

On 2010-10-11 22:31, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
recipe thread?

Yep.
http://www.tikicentral.com/viewtopic.php?topic=38047&forum=10&2

Mahalo, etc.,

Tonight we made Tiki Tacos!!!

Followed by Tiki Count Chocula!!!

That exotic combination hurt my tiki tummy.

But then I had some Tiki Antacids, and all was right in the Tiki world!

Now Mai Tai,don't be a bad sport,why don't you show us a real meal
come on show us what you got?

I'm insulted. That was a REAL MEAL. As our family cook, I made the tiki tacos. :wink:

On 2010-10-12 01:28, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
Now Mai Tai,don't be a bad sport,why don't you show us a real meal
come on show us what you got?

On 2010-10-10 19:13, WSWahine wrote:
Hey Zerostreet, How long does it take to produce fruit on the papaya? Think I could grow in Sacramento? I looks great, just need a couple lime slices.

Laura

WSW, It takes about 5 months or so. Most of my trees starting flowering at around 4 feet tall too...I would think anywhere sunny is ok, not sure. I know they grow best here during the rainy season.

Around 6pm.

Around 8pm. I think they are done.

ATP, sorry for the mild derail. This is really about getting rid of bugs in the tikis. :D I just thought it was picture worthy and REALLY funny on this thread. :lol:

Erik the Red

Just as long as you ate them,afterwards,Eric. :lol:

This thread is fine, but my opinion is that it belongs in Bilge. That is NOT an insult to anyone. Why should it be? What is so insulting about saying that a thread belongs in Bilge because its INTENTION is to be anything goes, as opposed to tiki-related. No slashing. No burning. No hypocrisy. Nothing stopping anyone from enjoying "what we are passionate about" (ie, food) - just take the discussion to the right place.

Mai Tai's point of view was not refuted with any empirical evidence. Central to his point is that this thread is NOT trying to be tiki-related, and this has been roundly AGREED by all sides. I believe Mai Tai's only point was that "anything goes" threads belong in Bilge as opposed to a specific tiki-related forum such as "Tiki Drinks and Food". And I agree with his point. He wasn't trying to kill the thread or shut anybody up, or any other strawman meanie stuff that was attributed to him. Mai Tai stated several times that it would be great to see an "anything goes" food discussion continue (you know, people do post on Bilge topics - it does happen!)

On 2010-10-08 20:11, Atomic Tiki Punk wrote:
I know you have other ideas,but you just don't show up at someones house, Then tell them that what they "like" or "believe" is not important and piss in the pool and kick the cat on the way out!

I would say that's very Bad Manners!
(..)
I myself am hardwired to rebel against anyone trying to force their point of view on some one else, I don't care what it is.

Well, that all paints a picture, but ultimately people do communicate differing points of view. Certainly it is legitimate to hold the point of view that non-tiki stuff should go in the non-tiki forum areas. Speaking that point of view is no more dogmatic than taking the opposite point of view ("MY thread doesn't have to be tiki-related").

In fact MANY PEOPLE ON TIKICENTRAL would say that those who insist on defying the basic conventions of the community here (ie, where to post different things, etc.) are the ones who show bad manners. It might feel like some kind of cool rebel thing to shout down anyone who says "let's keep it tiki", but it's just a dogma.

I suppose the people actively involved in a thread could see it as their "pool" that gets pissed in by unwanted opinions. But by the same token TC itself is a "pool" that MANY have exited as they perceive it turning yellow, due in no small part to the ones who insist on making their own rules or just plain ignoring the fact that people prefer the tiki forums to be tiki-related.

As Sabu said, this kind of "anything goes" thread is still better than all the singular "look at me" threads, because all the discussion has moved along quite well in one place (and with a nice family tone). So as just ONE THREAD I don't think it's really hurting anybody, and don't personally care that much if it moves. But all the same I do think that if anyone cares enough to actually make an effort NOT to "piss in the pool" of the larger TC community, then they would be more willing to try to understand why this kind of thread, posted in this kind of forum, is kind of a "screw you" to the larger TC community and the conventions of where people post things.

-Randy